Book Review: Enjoy The Decline

by Elusive Wapiti on April 24, 2013

The Book: Enjoy The Decline, by Aaron Clarey, 204 pages, published 2013.

Summary: Subtitled “Accepting and Living with the Death of the United States”, this book asserts that the United States is in a terminal economic and social decline. It argues that readers, in order to live their lives to the fullest during this decline, should adjust psychologically to this new reality and re-organize their lifestyle so as to not only insulate themselves as much as possible from the decline, but even to enjoy life during this decline.

By far the most useful aspect of this book, in my opinion, is in the case that it makes for readers to realize that whatever bourgeois values they may presently possess, there is a high probability those values are maladaptive in the present economic and social climate. Up has become down and right has become wrong in these last days of the American republic. Work hard and save for retirement? Don’t be ridiculous.  Why save when the nation’s leaders gleefully debauch the currency, pulling a “stealth Cyprus” to the tune of 8 – 10% each year? Why delay gratification  when there will likely be little / no Social Security for Xers and younger generations, particularly if the government will simply appropriate your savings through an outright Cyprus/France/Hungary/Ireland/Argentina/Poland-style seizure? Why work hard, when doing so only qualifies you to be taxed even more to support an income redistribution scheme consuming more than 2/3 of the Federal budget, “spread [your hard-earned monies] around a little“, to bankroll parasites who didn’t earn it? Why hope for things to get better when unemployment is presently at around 14% and the labor force participation rate is at a 30-year low, is trending downward, and has been so for decades? And why scrimp to pay for college while the higher ed bubble continues to inflate, making your parent’s advice to “get an education” in order to succeed nearly financially suicidal and economically ill-advised in the new economic reality?  For that matter, why marry and have children? Silly rabbit, very few men and women these days are equipped to be proper husbands and wives.  Moreover, 5,000 years of traditional Marriage 1.0 has been subsumed by Marriage 2.0–and now, by homogamy–and is characterized by easy divorce and the subsequent trafficking in former spouses (usu but not always ex husbands) for the pecuniary interests of the state and ex-wives.

Pretty grim picture, to be sure.  So what does Mr. Clarey advise? First, that readers of his book put into action the conclusions that naturally follow from a hard-nosed assessment of the ground truth: a realignment of their behaviors and habits. To this end, the author dedicates a chapter toward what he calls “the art of minimalism”–reducing possessions to the minimum essentials necessary, thereby lowering purchasing, maintenance, storage, and disposal costs.  Techniques from the minimalizing playbook include buying things used or second-hand, avoiding having (expensive) children, acquiring a trade in lieu of an “education”, performing repairs yourself, eschewing going out to eat and instead entertaining at home, avoiding buying real estate (a house is a liability, not an asset), and buying only catastrophic health insurance. Moreover, since the minimalist lifestyle will likely appeal to far more men than women, readers should have little issue with following through on his additional recommendation to avoid  the expense of weddings–and if one does get married, elope. Do it all correctly, and Mr. Clarey calculates that a single fellow can live quite nicely for less than $USD 20,000 a year, depending on the locale. It doesn’t take that much time to earn 20,000, even in today’s poor economy, leaving the Enjoying the Decline (ETD) citizen ample time to take many vacations, work when he wants, and enjoy life in general, heeding Mr. Clarey’s call for readers to “not waste their youth” like he did.

Continuing on the minimalism vein, for those ETDers who want to go the “full Clarey“, he recommends not even bothering to save for retirement (see “why delay gratification”, above).  Won’t that leave a person penniless in old age?  Yes, it will, and Mr. Clarey suggests, in all seriousness, the .45 cal “Smith and Wesson retirement plan”, as the last six months of life are extremely expensive and not all that pleasant anyways.  Not a very Christian recommendation as far as recommendations go, but Mr. Clarey does not identify as a Believer and therefore has the latitude to recommend such a nihilistic option.

For those who do follow his minimalist advice, Mr. Clarey outlines several benefits: freedom from employers and the daily rat-race, better mental and physical health, a better social and family life, more travel, more sleep, and, paradoxically, a higher chance of becoming rich.  In Mr. Clarey’s accounting, minimalizing your life offers you the chance to enjoy your youth while you can and focus on things that really matter, such as family, friends, and other human relationships, rather than on busting your hump as a cube-drone for a faceless company to whom you are likely little more than a number.  And even if you’re not, is your work more important than your family? Will your work be there over the long haul? Or will your family?

Interestingly, Mr. Clarey’s book contains a chapter called “Plunder”, where he identifies ways in which an ETDer may take advantage of the many government programs designed to provide assistance to those with similar income levels as the minimalizing ETDer, thus aiding the ETDer in the effort to enjoy life and work less.  From welfare to free meals to health care to food stamps, the author provides a road map to where the aspiring ETDer may obtain all the no-cost-to-him government cheese available. Won’t that make the ETDer a member of the parasite class, those folks disparaged above (see “spread around”, above)? Certainly, but then again, one may rationalize doing so in view of (a) they’re giving it away anyway, (b) the ETDer is merely taking back what he paid in, and (c) in taking some of the cheese, the ETDer is helping accelerate the decline and fall of the United States and the presumably the spawning of whatever political entity will eventually replace it.

The last chapter of the book was also the most uplifting one. Titled “Revenge”, it has nothing to do with directly harming one’s adversaries; instead, it advises the ETDer to “get back” at the leftists who have destroyed this country simply by being happy. By living life to the fullest, by doing fun things, grandiose-fun things, working less, being a better, more cultured person, having better friends, by truly enjoying and making the best of a finite life, the ETDer rubs the leftist’s nose in the equalitarian misery he has made for himself.  Thus while the leftist on his death bed compares the ETDer’s life, lived to the fullest, to his, and is filled with envy, in contrast, the ETDer will die with few regrets but many good memories.

All told, I thoroughgoingly enjoyed this book, despite some jabs at my male-heavy semi-industrial home town in a  flyover state suffering from chronic “brain drain”–as well as ethically dubious advice to mooch off church groups as part of the Plunder program. In addition, even though I am not in a position to minimalize as much as he recommends (married, three kids, etc) there is wisdom in here for just about everyone. Especially for the single male, for whom I think this book is most applicable. For it is he who is not subject to baby rabies, not genetically hardwired to “nest”, and likely to be marriage-cautious if not marriage-avoidant, single males are the population subgroup best positioned and most inclined to enjoy the decline, such as it is, and will be.


About the author: EW is a well-trained monkey operating heavier-than-air machinery. His interests outside of being an opinionated rabble-rouser are hunting, working out, motorcycling, spending time with his family, and flying. He is a father to three, a husband to one, and is a sometime contributor here at Spearhead. More of his intolerable drivel is available at the blog The Elusive Wapiti.

{ 108 comments… read them below or add one }

geographybeefinalisthimself April 24, 2013 at 05:50

Sounds like an interesting book, assuming that after the decline, something better takes its place.

Remember, though, women don’t understand cause and effect at all, and they are not going to understand the cause of America’s decline and the effects thereof either.

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Zorro April 24, 2013 at 05:59

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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Zorro April 24, 2013 at 06:00

OK. That should be tree STUMP.

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freebird April 24, 2013 at 06:33

Because NAFTA and free trade is best for corporations,and trickle down theory is not a cop-out.

Toss up a fence around the nation and make everything inside.
Nothing comes in,nothing goes out.
A fascist’s nightmare.

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Justinian April 24, 2013 at 06:34

There is an aspect of MGTOW/going galt that I find very unappealing.

In essence its a kind of surrender to your enemies without a fight.

There is also absolutely no guarantee that your overlords are going let you kick back on your lay-z-boy earning $20k a year for the rest of your life.

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Realman April 24, 2013 at 07:14

Sounds like a good read to me. Preparing for the inevitable makes mighty fine sense. As the moronic feminists drive western civilization back into the primordial slime from which we rose, smart men are anticipating the fall from grace.
As a person who expatted from Australia to the Philippines a year ago and surrounded by solar panels, wind generators, vege gardens, fruit trees, rain water tanks and an assortment of other sustainable technologies, I look forward to the crash. Somehow, “I told you feminist b**ches this would happen” does not bring much joy, but I and my Filipina gf are going to survive this mess (or give it a shot anyway).

We will see more books and videos of this type as the situation worsens. I recommend Spearheaders take this stuff very seriously and get up to speed as quickly as possible. We don’t want to lose you to the femnuts and their ill-conceived dismantling of a patriarchy that existed only in their confused and vicious misandrist minds.

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MKP April 24, 2013 at 07:22

If Zorro’s rude comments are aimed at Elusive Wapiti, I hope he reconsiders his tone … but overall, I agree entirely with Zorro’s take. Telling people “might as well be poor, and then kill yourself when you can no longer afford food” is 10 pounds of stupid in a 2 pound bag.

If you actually believe that the USA is headed for some sort of “collapse,” then the welfare and food stamp benefits this author is advocating you avail yourself of won’t be around for long. What are you going to do then? Tell yourself “oh well, at least I didn’t have to needlessly work and pay too much in taxes!” And then resort to the .45 retirement strategy?

That’s IF the “collapse” ever comes. What if it doesn’t? What if, against all odds, the USA continues to roll along in a somewhat healthy, normal fashion? As it’s been doing for, you know, a couple centuries? Since before any of us were born? Are you then going to get angry that people are still going to school, going to work, buying homes, having children, and creating their lives, while you’re sitting around eating government cheese and waiting for “the shit to hit the fan?”

“Will your work be there over the long haul? Or will your family?”

Your family won’t even be there in the short term if you don’t get off your ass and do something with your life! I love how all these alt-right keyboard warriors proclaim that they’re going to avoid the hardworking father-husband role, and instead “gaaaame” women into having their kids and letting the government provide for them. Has ANY of you ever actually pulled that off? Serious question. All you experts who claim “the best evolutionary strategy is to impregnate a lot of chicks and put them on welfare!” Why don’t any of you fucking do it, then, and then tell us how it worked out? Take a survey of all regular Spearhead readers, and I guarantee the ones with kids and grandkids are the same ones who work hard and make good long-term decisions. I fucking guarantee it. The “drug-dealer impregnating his baby-mama” strategy doesn’t work nearly as well as your game bloggers would have you believe. There are plenty of washed-up drug dealers and welfare leeches with no kids, no job, and no future, saying to themselves “I wish I’d stayed in school and worked a little harder.”

This is all a somewhat facetious criticism, of course, because the author doesn’t actually believe anything he’s saying. He’s just trying to get people to buy his “provocative” book, like any other two-bit grifter.

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keyster April 24, 2013 at 07:39

I’m way ahead of Mr. Clarey.
Going to the ball game this afternoon after lunch downtown.
(Rockies and the Braves, dug out seats)
Just livin’ the life.
No need to buy catastrophic health insurance.
ObamaCare kicks in Jan 2014, sign up for the exchange in Oct.
ObamaPhones will soon support SmartPhones.
Don’t ever get married and don’t work too hard fellas – not worth it.
Viva la Greece!

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kgaard April 24, 2013 at 07:43

The flaw in his thinking is the notion that the US is in terminal economic decline. Bernanke is actually an excellent central banker: The US is in a textbook depression (defined as a long period of very low economic growth) and if we DIDN’T have easy money it would look like the 1930s. Recall that Hoover followed the advice Aaron appears to propose (“strong” money in a dead economy) and the result was a banking vortex, 25% decline in GDP and the ushering in of FDR and the New Deal.

Bernanke will go down in history as the guy who prevented another Great Depression (rather keeping things at garden-variety depression levels, which by comparison isn’t so bad).

The implication here is that it DOES make sense to work and save if you enjoy your work, because the economy is not being particularly mismanaged and should still be humming 20 years from now.

The slacker life is very depressing once you pass 30. I’m thankful every day that I suffered my way up the ladder in my 20s and 30s (I’m now in my 40s). I enjoyed what I was doing even though it was hard, and now I have the time and resources to travel and live in peace. The older I get the more I hate noise and difficult people. Money insulates me from both.

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Towgunner April 24, 2013 at 08:36

@Realman:

Hey, good for you for expating. I think that option has a great deal of appeal, especially for men. Do you mind elaborating on your expat experiences and do you have any recommendations? Also, obviously you like the Philippines, do you recommend any other countries or regions?

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ahamkara April 24, 2013 at 08:37

Elimination of debt and refusal to participate in consumer culture are the best revenge. Don’t pay them interest and don’t give them profits off of their useless crap. It makes life so much simpler and more enjoyable.

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chinesefootsoldier April 24, 2013 at 10:58

Or… I could just go back to China.

For those of you that can’t leave, consider hoarding and spending all your money on yourself while the liberals and leftists dance over the destructive fires of “equality” and “tolerance”. They’re obviously convinced civilization runs on childish moral values, so let them sleep in the bed they made for themselves.

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Charles Martel April 24, 2013 at 11:24

kgaard
Bernanke is actually an excellent central banker

Depends where you’re sitting. The primary problem I have with Bernanke is that he’s institutionalized a whole new level of support of the Wall Street elite with taxpayer money. What is it, $85 billion a month of mortgage backed securities being bought by the Fed now?

The turning point was the effective repeal of Glass-Steagall in the late ’90s. This set the stage for a wholesale upset of our economic system post-2008. I don’t quite know what to call the current system but I have no doubt that what we’re looking at is institutionalized corruption. The US economy has been financialized for want of a better word. You only need to look at financial sector profits over time to see that.

The average citizen is now being farmed like a dumb animal by myriad special interests who are all using the federal government as a strongarm enforcer. Public sector employees, health care, insurance, financial services, the federal bureaucracy, women, all have a gun to Joe Sixpack’s head. He can’t exactly put his finger on it but he knows something’s very, very wrong.

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The First Joe April 24, 2013 at 12:42

Lolz at the rubes who believe that everythings gonna be ok in the USA!

Bwahahaha! The petrodollar is all but done, as of now (the final nail in that world monopoly: China will trade oil denominated in soon-to-be-gold-backed Yuan with anyone as of a few months back).

The world is probably less than a decade away from junking the US dollar as a reserve currency. Already the BRICS are moving to SDRs and baskets of currencies / resources instead.

The hyperinflation that’s due to hit the US will make the 1930s look like a cakewalk, mainly because the US is no longer a predominently rural, productive economy of skilled people, living on the land.

As for whichever rope-o’-drool it was thinks Bernanke is anything either than a) an idiot or b) utterly malicious and a servant to the banksters at the expense of everyone else…???
I have no words for you. Other than “Go back to sleep”.

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oddsock April 24, 2013 at 13:14

Sometimes its like trying to tell the Band playing on the deck of the Titanic that the ship really is feckin sinking. I mean, how many pieces of the jigsaw have to be put in place and laid before your very eyes before you see whats happening ?

The developed West is in economic and social decline and has been for years. Now we are in the quickening, we have reached debt saturation, peak credit. Why the feck do you think there is a shadow banking arrangement with hundreds of trillions of dollars and pounds and euros off the balance sheet ? This is how it has all been kept afloat for so long. Look it up ! Bernanke is doing the same as all the other central banksters, kicking the can down the road for a little bit longer. There will be a crash with a major reset, to what ? Anyones guess.
Lets just hope we dont follow history, though we usually do. WW1 WW2 both followed recession depression currency wars trade wars ending with world wars.

Having people like Keyster constantly blaming everything on feckin cultural marxism while trying to promote voting right wing as a solution is nothing more than subduing the populace or at least the guys that read the spearhead while at the same time trying to con people into thinking there is some sort of political solution for men. My feckin arse there is. MGTOW is the best option by far.

Blame whatever political party you want, you need look no further than the banking system and the elite and if it makes you moist by calling them cultural marxists, have at it. They dont give a flying toss what you call them. Feminism the destruction of marriage single parents and equality et al are all just smaller cogs in the bigger game of keeping the con game afloat a little longer. Follow the power the money and the jobs.

Why the feck do you think all the jobs were outsourced to developing countries ? Why do you think Brazil Russia India China are now negotiating to use their own currency instead of the dollar ? Why do you think these countries are developing an alternative to the IMF ? Why do you think the Environment people along with governments tried to shaft everyone with the Carbon tax and shut down major industries all in the name of reducing so called greenhouse gas emmissions only to find the same industries and power generation systems are being set up in the third world. Look it feckin up ! China has the most rapid development and building of coal fired power stations in the feckin world. Using existing western technology.

Judas priest, are you lot really so naive ?

Meanwhile, have a listen to this video from Barbarossaa, one of his best. Listen to it and then listen to it a second time but this time also listen to your rationalization hamster as you react with anger.

So you think you have swallowed the red pill ?

Traditional Parasitism .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=be5V8fNTkT4

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Zorro April 24, 2013 at 13:15

“If Zorro’s rude comments are aimed at Elusive Wapiti, I hope he reconsiders his tone…”

Not Wapiti at all. At Clarey. Wapiti is one of my fave blogs. Clarey is an egomaniac and an embarrassment.

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Gilgamesh April 24, 2013 at 13:53

Was going to namedrop the Cloward Piven strategy but it looks like I got beaten in the second post.

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joeb April 24, 2013 at 14:19

Living the dream . I don’t know who to blame anymore . I just know that I need to take care of me and if that means running over a few delicate ego’s i’m already there.
I do know someone will have to pay the piper some day . History tells us it Not going to be the wealthy or the powerful .
American’s have a way of forming cognitive’s in witch a movement happens to end decadence .
A wink wink nod nod then its on , Hope Im on the right side .

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a guy April 24, 2013 at 14:22

Ha. Those of you saying that there is no decline, especially those of you singing the praises of Bernanke, are delusional or left-wing (but I repeat myself). The very idea that Bernanke’s endless devaluation of the dollar will reap rewards later is so asinine that even calling it “asinine” is giving it more credit and attention than it deserves.

The USA is in debt to its ears and we’re not even slowing down in our borrowing and spending. We’ve lost the top credit rating. Our economy is grinding to a halt because of over-regulation, over-taxation, and assorted government interference. Companies aren’t shipping their production overseas because they are mean and nasty – they’re doing it because if they try to operate in the US, they’ll go bankrupt. We already have entire cities and counties going bankrupt, and soon we’ll have at least one state go bankrupt. Anybody who thinks that endless money printing will save us need only look up “Weimar Republic” or Zimbabwe. Meanwhile, other countries are trying to replace the dollar as the reserve currency (go look up the new trade deal between Australia and China).

But the economic decline is just one part of the overall decline. We are smack-dab in the middle of an overall cultural decline, one that has been engineered for the last 100 years or so. We no longer have much of a moral foundation, as all of our sacred institutions have been corrupted or destroyed. Our “elected” representatives openly mock the US Constitution. The Founders are mocked or ignored throughout our government indoctrination centers (aka public schools) as nothing but racist, dead white males. Our military is under constant assault with the allowance of open homosexuals in the ranks and soon, women in combat roles, not to mention the ridiculous rules of engagement that our troops have been operating under in Iraq and Afghanistan. The family unit has been obliterated by government-supported leftwing propaganda, and all of our children are now fodder for every sexual perversion that can be pumped through television or movies. That’s right – your daughters will be turned into whores by the state, and your sons will be wage slaves or prisoners. And all of them will be riddled with STD by the time they are 20.

There is also a huge intellectual decline that has been occurring in the US, and the West in general. We now have “elected” members of government who have openly stated that too many people on Guam will tip the island over, that rifle magazines can only be used once, that we have to pass legislation so we can find out what’s in it, etc. etc. And are these people mocked and ridiculed for their stupidity? Does the press rip them to shreds? Not no, but hell no they don’t. Why not? Because not only are members of the press as stupid as these politicians (pick a newspaper article at random, sometime, and count how many grammatical errors you find, or factual errors, or simply bad writing), but they openly protect these types of politicians.

It is mind-boggling to me that people who visit a website dedicated to the exposure of the war against men by their own government can, at the same time, demonstrate full faith in the system in other areas. “Sure, the government is destroying marriage, attacking men and turning them into slaves, but I’m sure they’ll handle our healthcare, the economy, and our national security just fine!” The cognitive dissonance is astounding.

The source of the cognitive dissonance is, of course, left-wing thinking. As the socialist, nihilistic policies of the Left are implemented and destroy more of the fabric of this country, those who are left-winged brainwashed drones actually interpret these events as “winning”. It does not matter to them the damage these policies do. All that matters is that they are implemented. We could be a larger, more chaotic, run-down version of the old Soviet Union in 10 years, but hey, everything is wonderful because now we’re socialist instead of that evil capitalism! Now we can take pleasure in our misery!

The decline is happening, fellas. All around us. And the final stage will not be pretty. Enjoy what you can while you can, because very soon, it will simply not be there.

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Rmaxd April 24, 2013 at 14:51

Yep, idiots like zorro can’t stand anything radical or out of the ordinary

Their drone lifestyles & years of worshipping retards like Oprah & Obama, bought & paid for by corporations & corrupt aristocrats, turns them into good little Marxist clones, ready to abort children, & bootlick cops & corrupt politicians asap

All these pricks do is worship politicians & worship authority & lick the ass of anyone forcing them to pay taxes at the end of a revolver, or a tank in Tienanmen square

These pricks don’t understand the concept of liberty or justice

Or the abilities of self made men, self sufficiency or grit & determination & tenacity of being your own boss & standing up to authority

Bootlickers will always worship politicians & any corrupt cop with a gun

Whether theyre marxist toads

Or pussy whipped mangina freaks

Theyre all anti-justice, anti-male, pro-child murdering scum

Marxism & feminism are all gateways to pure evil

Once they turn into good little fascist drones, thwy start worshipping corporate whores like obama & oprah & other corporate whores

People like zorro seriously believe corporate whores & insane politicians are their saviours …

The same corporate whores responsible for killing & dismembering inborn infants still alive & breathing in their mothers wombs

A holocaust of over 90 million infants murdered by deranged sick women

THAT is what you get for being good little corporate worshipping, government worshipping, sick drones

Enjoy the decline & make the drones pay by depriving the parasites of new men to the grinding wheel …

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Thos. April 24, 2013 at 14:59

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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greyghost April 24, 2013 at 15:02

MKP,Zorro
You fellas have lost faith in your fellow man. Nothing wrong with taking it easy. In fact there is everything wrong with puttingout your best effort. Also it is a guide to living low. Most of the stuff in that book was from men paying out 50 to 80 percent of earnings in CS and alimony survival techniques. A childless man making 20k a year is invisible. All things in the book are options and ideas for a man to live his life. Men taking that path of least effort are doing more to restore your way of life than any worker drone busting his honaest ass to be called a sexist,racist, rapist of priviledge to be punished with CS and alimony and threatened with prison at every turn.

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pb April 24, 2013 at 15:04

“The implication here is that it DOES make sense to work and save if you enjoy your work, because the economy is not being particularly mismanaged and should still be humming 20 years from now.”

Not if there are real constraints to growth.

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joeb April 24, 2013 at 15:05

Another one of are brave Brother was Murdered by the system .
http://news.yahoo.com/3-dead-courthouse-shooting-delaware-155949197.html

I know Im going to get hammered for this but, Rather then committing suicide he did the only act he could to make them stop . I support this hero .
If we all had this kind of courage the corruption would stop . FAST

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MKP April 24, 2013 at 15:44

I’ve lost faith in my fellow man? This guy’s advice is to deliberately make yourself poor, and then when you get old and can’t support yourself anymore, go ahead and shoot yourself through the head. That sounds like the most faithless, nihilistic, and catastrophically stupid plan anyone has ever developed. And he’s got a book about it, to sell to his fellow man.

“Oh, he was just kidding about that part.” Actually, here’s what I read:

“Won’t that leave a person penniless in old age? Yes, it will, and Mr. Clarey suggests, in all seriousness, the .45 cal ‘Smith and Wesson retirement plan,’ as the last six months of life are extremely expensive and not all that pleasant anyways.”

How are Mr. Clarey’s readers supposed to know when they have 6 months left, anyway? What if they find themselves without food or shelter long before they’re elderly? What if the fabled “collapse” comes and, as mentioned above, they can’t draw welfare or food stamps anymore? Are they to quietly die, taking solace in the fact that at least they never achieved anything that would allow parasites and feminist jackals to steal from them?

I rather suspect that Mr. Clarey has never held a loaded .45 handgun in his hand. If he had, he’d realize what it takes, what kind of mind-set it requires, to put the muzzle to the side of one’s skull and pull the trigger.

And, by the way, there are plenty of childless, low-wage men in prison for false rape accusations or other spurious, trumped-put charges. Random drunken bar skanks are among the most dangerous type of woman to be associated with if you fear punishment from the state. So, is Mr. Clarey’s advice to be celibate? I wonder if he addresses that question in his book, and whether that will (hopefully?) turn off impressionable young men to the idea of being a do-nothing loser and being proud of it.

I repeat my impression of this guy as a cheap grifter trying to drum up something that people will declare “provocative” or “controversial” in order to sell his book. Sorry to be a bring-down.

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Kgaard April 24, 2013 at 16:29

@ Charles Martel …

I agree with your entire comment (particularly on the damage done by Glass Steagall) … but that still doesn’t change the fact that Bernanke, given the milieu in which he arrived, has done an outstanding job. If you want to see a bad response to a credit crash, just look at what the ECB has done to the PIIGS. Tight money has destroyed a generation of young people in Portugal, Ireland, Spain, Greece and Italy. I’m no shill for the Democrats, nor am I a troll. (I am an economist.) But people who propose dropping your career because the US economy is heading into terminal decline are giving BAD ADVICE. The stock market is not hitting new highs for no reason. Easy money by the Fed is allowing the economy to heal. Tax policy is frustrating, but it’s not THAT much worse than the historical average for the last 100 years.

Anyway, I won’t beat this dead horse. I see my last comment was hidden due to 19 thumbs down ratings. But if you read the history of the 1930s you see that one country managed to avoid the whole depression: Sweden. And that was because the Riksbank (Sweden’s central bank) ran monetary policy with an eye toward printing enough money to keep street prices stable. No deflation, no depression. That’s what Bernanke is doing and it’s helping …

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Cpt. Capitalism April 24, 2013 at 16:58

MKP,

Oh, I don’t know, I might have handled a gun or two in my day:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvN1mmXWc9Q

Cpt.

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MKP April 24, 2013 at 17:17

Fine. Go ahead, quit your jobs, drop out of school, stock up on canned food, and run for the hills. Knock yourselves out. Go hide in the woods because “omg the cowwapse is coming!” Like a bunch of fucking pussies.

“The decline is happening, fellas. All around us. And the final stage will not be pretty. Enjoy what you can while you can, because very soon, it will simply not be there.”

You gonna give us a time-table on that? “Very soon” can mean anything. One week from now is “very soon.” Should I not show up to work tomorrow? Six months from now is … “very soon,” I guess. Years? How many? “I can’t tell you when, but trust me, it’s gonna happen!” is the trick of a 900-number psychic.

“Yep, idiots like zorro can’t stand anything radical or out of the ordinary … People like zorro seriously believe corporate whores & insane politicians are their saviours”

No one ever said a single thing about anyone being a “savior.” And predicting a societal collapse is no longer “radical” thinking. People have been predicting that for as long as I can remember – certainly for over a decade. Every week, it’s the same shit – “oh, stock up on ammo! It’s gonna happen!” And yet here we are. In our climate-controlled homes and offices, with gas tanks full of fuel and grocery stores stocked with food and supplies, talking to each other over the internet. With butchers, bakers, plumbers, mechanics, doctors, lawyers, electricians, and morticians, all only a phone call away.

You’re all setting yourself up to be angry, resentful, and disappointed just by the continued existence of your country and society. The very fact that people will continue to work hard, set and achieve goals, get college degrees, start families, and live their normal lives is going to infuriate you. Don’t you understand what kind of a horrible toll this is going to take on you?

“Or… I could just go back to China.”

You gonna talk about it, or are you gonna fucking do it? All of you – go ahead and do it, if you’re so sure it’s a great idea. Quit your jobs, collect $20,000 in government benefits (or however this idiot’s plan is supposed to work), move into your hermit shack, and then come back here and tell us about it.

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MKP April 24, 2013 at 17:19

@ Cpt. Capitalism –

Yeah. So have I. That’s why I don’ tell people “once you get to be old and broke from following my plan, you can always just shoot yourself in the head!”

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geographybeefinalisthimself April 24, 2013 at 17:30

@ MKP, Zorro and kgaard

I agree with you that throwing in the towel and hoping for a collapse is bad advice.

I only said in my previous post that the book sounded interesting but even this is conditional on the idea that the author is correct that the US is cratering with no possibility of reversing the damage. It is also conditional on the idea that after bottoming out, the US does in fact regain lost ground.

I also pointed out that half the population (the half lacking Y chromosomes) will never understand why this would happen or why a hypothetical collapse would have dire consequences.

Unfortunately for any man trying to get ahead in society and following your advice to continue working hard, there is still discrimination against white males in hiring, and let’s face it, affirmative action has not immensely benefitted black or Latino or Native American men or males of any other race or ethnicity that receives it. If it did, black men (as well as other men of color) would be out-earning white men by now.

A white woman still outranks any man of color, even though we all know deep down that to suggest that black men (and other men of color) have had and continue to have a lot of power in the United States is giving black American men (and other men of color) as many middle fingers as humanly possible. I’m white and I think this.

The deck is stacked against men in other arenas too. The AAUW (American Association of University Women) already vilifies any affirmative action given to males who apply to higher education even though the preferential treatment given to males still fails to achieve 50/50 parity even among an incoming class of freshmen at most universities. If it were up to the AAUW, I don’t think males would even be allowed to attend higher education.

So while I would agree that throwing in the towel is not the answer, bear in mind that the deck is overwhelmingly stacked against males to the point I’m not so sure males are allowed to play any card game anymore.

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Zorro April 24, 2013 at 17:31

@Rmaxd: When a doctor puts you on Paxil, you’re supposed to keep taking it.

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sestamibi April 24, 2013 at 17:32

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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Charles Martel April 24, 2013 at 17:34

Kgaard
The stock market is not hitting new highs for no reason.

And that reason has very little to do with the real economy. Corporate profits as a percent of GDP are at record highs while the wages share of GDP is at a record low. In the financial sector the Fed has opened the discount window to many more financial institutions who borrow from the Fed at zero interest and then redeposit those funds with the Fed and earn interest. I could make a crapload of dough too if I could borrow money at zero interest while selling all my losing positions to the US taxpayer via the Fed.

When I was at B-school in the late ’80s the buzz in investment banking was all about upsetting Glass-Steagall. I rubbed shoulders with those guys for two years and I can tell you many of them are whip smart and totally amoral. There’s an unholy partnership now between the top investment banks, Congress and the Fed. Post-2008 Wall Street has directly tapped the US Treasury and nothing bad has happened – to them. They can’t believe their good luck and are working on taking more I have no doubt. Not for nothing is Goldman known as the vampire squid. This is gangster capitalism, legalized corruption, whatever, pick a name. Ethical fiscal and monetary management it is not and nobody gives a sh!t about the deficit as long as they’re getting theirs right now. We’re on the back side of John Glubb’s arc of empire and the social contract is totally broken. In this context calling Bernanke a good Fed chairman doesn’t mean a whole lot.

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kgaard April 24, 2013 at 17:47

@ Charles Martel

You are right about the amorality of Wall Street (I used to work there). But to say that “stocks hitting new highs has very little to do with the real economy” is not really a constructive way to look at it. A better way to describe the situation would be to say “stocks hitting new highs reflects improving prospects for the NOMINAL economy — and the whole point of monetary reflation is precisely to boost the nominal economy in order to help debtors become solvent.” That’s what central bankers are supposed to do in the wake of a crash. None other than Austrian god Murray Rothbard argued IN FAVOR OF printing money in the wake of a credit crash. (The other choice is a Greece-like or 1929-like implosion, either of which would be immeasurably worse than what we have now).

Another guy to read would be Ray Dalio at Bridgewater, who describes the current state of affairs as a “beautiful deleveraging,” consisting of equal parts money printing, write-offs and growth.

Crashes are hard. There is no pretty way out. But it’s important to recognize that conceptually we ARE re-living the 1930s — and this time we’re doing a better job of it. Liquiat Ahamed argued last year in Barron’s that “we should be building statues” of Bernanke, Paulson and Geithner — and I think he is right. Your options are what we have now or 1931. You’ve gotta choose between those two. There isn’t a third option on the table. The current path is leading slowly to renewed economic growth …

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Charles Martel April 24, 2013 at 17:58

Kgaard
If you want to see a bad response to a credit crash, just look at what the ECB has done to the PIIGS. Tight money has destroyed a generation of young people in Portugal, Ireland, Spain, Greece and Italy.

Apples and oranges. The PIIGS are screwed because they all gave up their central banks. Let’s borrow a bunch of someone else’s money and piss it away on stuff like solar power (Spain) and retirement at age 50 for bureaucrats (Greece). What could possibly go wrong? The PIIGS should all default on their Euro-denominated debt asap. But they won’t because their elites all have their noses in the Brussels trough. There is literally no way out for the citizens of the PIIGS other than to elect nationalist leaders who will do this for them.

Kgaard
I’m no shill for the Democrats, nor am I a troll. (I am an economist.) But people who propose dropping your career because the US economy is heading into terminal decline are giving BAD ADVICE.

If you have made a career as an economist that means you’re highly invested in the current system. Many of the men who read here do not breathe the same rarefied atmosphere as you and do not have the same options. I am also considering the S&W retirement plan by the way – eventually – as that seems preferable to the way my mother ended her life. I prefer to think of it as the Hunter S. Thompson option.

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Solitary Howler April 24, 2013 at 18:16

“If you have made a career as an economist that means you’re very good at sucking dick. ”

Then Clarey should change his name to Captain Cocksucker?

The manosphere is becoming more and more just like the femosphere (and perhaps I just did make that up). A bunch of whining halfwits writing in 98% pure hyperbole, doing no fact-checking at all and yapping platitudes about each others’ retarded CreateSpace self-published screeds.

You can easily determine the “heart” of a blog on the manosphere. There are what I call “real” blogs. Sincere and authentic, they try to illuminate some facet of life for like-minded readers. Love them or hate them, I would include Spearhead, Roissy, Dalrock, Wapiti, RooshV (but only barely), The Thinking Housewife, Hawaiian Libertarian, and a number of others. You know who they are.

Then there are the money-chasers. The people who thrive on “linkage is good for you.” I don’t blame or begrudge anyone for seeking to support themselves, but I detest their claims to be sincere and informative when they act like Jim Carey mocking Charleton Heston (inflammatory horseshit deliberately intended to inflame the sensitivities of society and draw condemnation and its inevitable internet traffic. Capt. Crapitalism (who routinely berates English majors while begging the more literate of his followers to copy edit his screeds for free) is a classic example. He’ll gladly champion going Galt and living on $15K per year as a lifestyle choice, but if Glenn Reynolds plugs one of his books and sends his sales through the roof, all the better for him. Were he to become an internet millionaire, his fans would be too stupid to see the hypocrisy. So just go ahead and claim it was satire. What bullshit.

Then, at the very bottom, you have the lunatics. Koanic Soul and Omega Virgin Revolt. Mother of God, are some people whacked.

Men used to discriminate a lot better in their associations. On the internet, apparently, you jump onto delusiondamage.com and applaud every fucking thing you see.

Just like women.

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kgaard April 24, 2013 at 18:29

I’m sympathetic to the issue of young people not being invested in the current system. But sometimes I think they’re just lazy and entitled. I got out of school in the late 80s (also a time of deep recession in much of the country), and spent years delivering pizzas and working low-paying jobs in small towns in order to get ahead. Making a living is not EASY for anyone. I didn’t have any real savings til I was 30-32.

But … you could be right. I’m a full generation older than the people now getting out of college. Perhaps they will develop a non-monetary-oriented mode of being that will be more fulfilling than the one I’ve led. It can be done. Community can be restored by people who want to restore it.

On Europe, yes, the PIIGS could default — or the ECB could just keep monetary policy super easy for a while, reducing the real value of each euro and making the PIIGS more credit-worthy as a result. This avoids the default problem and keeps the eurozone together. The best course is really a RADICAL weakening of the euro, frankly. That’s how you revive Spain and Italy without casting them off into the land of debt defaulters …

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Avenger April 24, 2013 at 18:44

@MKP
” People have been predicting that for as long as I can remember – certainly for over a decade.”

Pat Robinson and his followers still have a 50 year supply of beans and rice left over from when the world was going to collapse due to Y2K. Problem is that the bugs have destroyed all of it lol

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kgaard April 24, 2013 at 19:24

@ Geography Bee …

So … I have to say … I think your argument that it’s hard-ER for a white man to get anywhere in life than it is for other sexes and races may be approaching whining. I’m as frustrated as you by intellectual errors and policy injustices, but when I look around at who actually succeeds, well, it’s white dudes, some Asian dudes, and hot women.

After age 30-35, women are basically out of the equation as competitors, so you just have to outlast them. Asians are still hampered by the bamboo ceiling. And blacks face discrimination at every turn EXCEPT where they get help from affirmative action.

As rough as it is for white men … it ain’t any easier for anybody else.

Personally I think the big problem is that technology is reducing the number of socially meaningful jobs. That hits everybody. I don’t have the answer for that problem, though it seems techies do a pretty good job of finding ways to add value in the post-industrial economy.

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greyghost April 24, 2013 at 19:43

I’m going to buy this book and read it cover to cover. It is an MGTOW guide. Add that book to a PUA book and learn some game. Practice getting pussy and generating gina tingle. When you get old and raedy to retire instaed of wacking yourself use some of that game and dickwash some rich bitch. Some single bitch working the same job for 38k a year for the last 27 years. Get that pussy tingling and move that cat out and eat everything in that refrigerator. When SHTF she will be glad you are there.
Fuck it I wouldn’t give a shit about anything live for yourself. Work a job with a w2 to show employment and make money off books. Do everything you can to be unproductive to the system and productive to yourself. Live on government aid not out of desperate need but because you can. MKP has the wrong attitude about the whole thing. You don’t sacrifice yourself you sacrifice society for your benefit. Not having a lot of taxable assets is not the same as living in poverty.

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MKP April 24, 2013 at 19:55

“Not having a lot of taxable assets is not the same as living in poverty.”

No, it’s not. But if this review is to be believed, the book specifically says to live on less than $20,00o a year, never go out to eat, never own real estate, and never have children. The book also says “the minimalist lifestyle will likely appeal to far more men than women” and acknowledges that the book’s plan will leave you celibate.

There. I just saved you $14.99. That’s the cost of the book an Amazon.

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Christopher Corbett April 24, 2013 at 20:40

I’ve read the book. It’s an option not a mandate. It makes sense on so many levels. Why not reduce your taxable income? Why not live life to the fullest by working to live not living to save and living to be of “service” to others?

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Anon April 24, 2013 at 21:04

Rothbard suggested printing money? Cite please?

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Darryl X April 24, 2013 at 21:24

@ a guy -

“Enjoy what you can while you can, because very soon, it will simply not be there.”

There’s a great exchange between characters in a novel by Cormac McCarthy which already expands on the conclusion of your post.

Character one: “Things aint ever gonna be the same.”
Character two: “They aint already.”

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Darryl X April 24, 2013 at 21:36

@ kgaard and Martel -

Last time I checked, the stock markets have not hit all time highs anyway. Adjusted for real inflation (and not government-calculated inflation), the McClellan Oscillator and many other variables, the Dow would have to be around 16,000 points to be at an all time high. Value of the Dow is inflated by approximately 13,000 points. Two important reasons for this development are: (1) the huge number of Baby-boomer investing in the stock markets during the past forty years and (2) purchase of government treasuries by the Federal Reserve and the dumping of that money into the markets. Their are other mechanisms too. But those are two big ones. Problem is that Baby-boomers are aging and taking their money out now and value of the dollar is declining rapidly. Companies aren’t really producing anything and turning profits anymore. They borrowed lots of money are now getting consumers to pay for the debt. It’s a racket just like child support.

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Darryl X April 24, 2013 at 21:41

There is some great wisdom in the Bible. One important concept is that the laws of man will always be imperfect and that we should not rely upon them for worth in our life. In the end, value of our lives is not how much fun we had so we can stick it to others but how grateful we are for what we have in our lives (no matter how little or how much) and what we’ve done to help others recognize what we have and be grateful for it. I didn’t read the book which Wapiti reviewed, but if the review is any reflection of the book, it sounds like the same old self-indulgent clap-trap.

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Darryl X April 24, 2013 at 21:56

@ kgaard -

“But it’s important to recognize that conceptually we ARE re-living the 1930s — and this time we’re doing a better job of it.”

I think from the perspective of many including myself, we are NOT doing a better job of it. In the 1930′s, as bad as things were, if you were hard-working, responsible and honest, you still did okay. If you weren’t, you suffered the consequences of your own bad choices. Today, hard-work, responsibility and honesty are liabilities and sloth, greed and malice are assets far more than they were in the 1930′s. Hard-work, responsibility and honesty aren’t just uncompensated but actively punished in ways that never happened in the 1930′s. I wasn’t in the Great Depression, but I know lots of people who were and they recognize the differences between then and now. Our present circumstances are far worse than they ever were in the 1930′s. What we are presently experiencing is not a Great Depression or a depression at all. It’s Revelations. At a time when no one should be prospering, the people who should be prospering the least in any economy (let alone one that reflects our present circumstances) are doing quite well while those who should be prospering under any circumstances are getting screwed. That didn’t happen in the 1930′s.

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Darryl X April 24, 2013 at 22:06

I hope everyone here recognizes that they are worth more than a S&W retirement plan. That such a thing can be suggested seriously reflects just how bad the economy and culture of the US has become.

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kuis April 24, 2013 at 22:59

Kgaard: what is the new era of growth going to be based on though? Surely the era of borrowing like crazy ala the last 20-30 years is not sustainable over the long term? and there isn’t much in the way of industry in the U.S anymore.

As an outsider, i just don’t see it, but America is not alone in this regard.

As for Greece, i used to live there, and i saw the crash coming years before it even became a hot topic. Economists were in denial about its inevitability for years, and the views of the few honest ones were mocked and shunned. But huge public debt, bloated public sector, small private sector

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kuis April 24, 2013 at 23:03

…, questionable work corrupt politicians, and an all round lack of innovation eventually did them in.

Italy and Spain are the ones to worry about. If they topple, the E.U is going to be in huge trouble. Greece is small potatoes in the grand scheme of things; their economy has always been weak and insignificant. The only hope they have now is the money invested by entrepreneurs in the Balkans, but rich Grreks have a long history of investing their money elsewheer

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FTLOTBP April 25, 2013 at 02:45

Anyone who says a collapse is not coming is a moron. A little history: All of the empires known to history have collapsed. No exception. The more useful – and not entirely known – information would be what the collapse will look like. That it is coming is impossible for honest men to deny.
The ignorant should refer to Sir John Glubb.

I think this is a great idea. I am doing it myself to an extent. I’m also close to expatting. I walked away from a shitty job last year. (Note: I was making WAY under $20,000 a year. Making a “mere” $20,000 at a job in a year is not nearly so easy as it used to be.) After walking, I started something I knew I should’ve done years ago. I started living for myself. There’s no saving, restoring, or preserving the glorious past of what was once a great civilization.

Ride the slide.

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Brigadon April 25, 2013 at 06:27

@MKP-
q3 2021 at the very latest.
You wanted a timetable? you got it. a combination of political/social/economic analysis and (well proven) cycle theory. I don’t know if our nuclear arsenal is going to be used, some kind of germ warfare agent will kill huge amounts of the population, or if that’s going to be the year we pull a soviet union and quietly fold, but that’s it.

This guy could be writing a book about my life. Except, add to it, a good library of books including a boy scout handbook, and a lot of training in ‘real world’ skills like hunting, carpentry, plumbing, farming, metallurgy, assaying, and chemistry.

the 25 year old ‘renaissance man’ that has trouble finding a job in a specialist field of today is the hero of tomorrow.

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Uncle Elmer April 25, 2013 at 06:29

I like the Captain’s blog, despite his recent disparaging remarks about older folks. Perhaps because he is a ballroom dancer and fossil-hunter like Elmer.

A man can live on $20K but cannot have a ForeignBride on that income. Perhaps if he lived in the Phillipines or similar and had some passive income stream.

Off-topic, but as I predicted recently, Dartmouth would be the scene of the next race-gender hoax meltdown :

Dartmouth College Calls a Timeout After Student Protest Draws Hostile Reactions

http://chronicle.com/article/Dartmouth-College-Calls-a/138753/

Allegedly there was an online threat involving “razor blades”. Seems pretty clear to me; some professional victim-feminist who’s into “cutting” made the phony threats. Men don’t invoke “razor blades” in their tough talk.

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Kyo April 25, 2013 at 07:06

Bernanke a hero, really? This clown is consciously using inflation to devalue everyone’s savings, transferring money from savers (the backbone of society) to debtors (the biggest of which is government).

Where are diligent people who put their money in the bank and live below their means to go without being taken for chumps by the Bernankes of the world? Switzerland, maybe?

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Michael April 25, 2013 at 07:17

@kgaard

“But it’s important to recognize that conceptually we ARE re-living the 1930s — and this time we’re doing a better job of it.”

Some things are the same, but other things – very important things – are quite different: Values, morals and ethics, demographics, marriage rate, divorce rate, police power, rule of law, transparency of government, patriotism, social cohesion, social stratification. Just throwing it out there. I am not an American, so it does not behoove me to form a reasonable hypothesis. Yet, I think I can safely claim that the notion “this time we’re doing a better job of it” based on economic and financial considerations alone is a fallacy.

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Uncle Elmer April 25, 2013 at 07:59

OK, I made an insta-post out of it. Price, check your inbox.

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keyster April 25, 2013 at 08:26

That’s IF the “collapse” ever comes. What if it doesn’t? What if, against all odds, the USA continues to roll along in a somewhat healthy, normal fashion? As it’s been doing for, you know, a couple centuries?

With a $20,000,000,000,000 debt by the time Hillary Clinton takes office in 2016, a collapse is inevitable. Interest rates are holding now, but the higher the debt goes the less willing our lenders will be to loan us money – and so interest rates will begin to rise. We pay $222 Billion a year in interest on the debt now. By 2016 it will be $700 Billion, and by 2020 $1 Trillion. We take in $2.5 Trillion now a year, but spend $3.5 Trillion.

Do you see a problem yet? It’s entirely out of control and there’s nothing we can do to stop it except to drastically cut federal spending AND raise taxes. Neither of which anyone in power will do. Like it or not it’s coming, and it will be a grand mess.

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geographybeefinalisthimself April 25, 2013 at 08:58

@ kgaard

I also have autism and bipolar disorder simultaneously and while I might get “reasonable accommodations” IF I can even land the job, no disabled white male is going to get affirmative action. While a disabled person of color or a disabled white woman MIGHT get both reasonable accommodations and possibly affirmative action, reasonable accommodations take a back seat to affirmative action.

Bipolar disorder, like every other mental illness, has the problem in that it does not elicit empathy from anybody who does not have a mental illness of any kind. That is a huge strike against mental illness in general. Mental health medications, even when taken properly, lose their effectiveness every few years and have to be reconfigured, just like HIV antiretrovirals, except the consequences of not readjusting for either treatment is different (severe brain chemical imbalance vs. drug-resistant HIV).

Autism spectrum disorders probably do not elicit much more empathy from people who do not have autism spectrum disorders as one of the stereotypes of people who have autism is that they are unable to love.

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Charles Martel April 25, 2013 at 10:28

kgaard
On Europe, yes, the PIIGS could default — or the ECB could just keep monetary policy super easy for a while, reducing the real value of each euro and making the PIIGS more credit-worthy as a result. This avoids the default problem and keeps the eurozone together. The best course is really a RADICAL weakening of the euro, frankly. That’s how you revive Spain and Italy without casting them off into the land of debt defaulters …

Textbook answer from someone heavily invested in the current corrupt system. The real problem as Maggie Thatcher predicted so long ago is that you can’t have a functional currency union without first having a political union. In a unified Europe Spain would have no ability to issue debt and all the taxpayers of Europe would be on the hook for all of Europe’s debt. I’m not advocating that as a solution, btw.

Oh, how timely: Central Banks Load Up on Equities

In the world I grew up in the idea of central banks buying equities would have been seen as insane. There is no justification whatsoever for this kind of manipulation of free markets. Now it’s just business as usual.

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oddsock April 25, 2013 at 10:38

America the Fallen; 24 signs our once proud cities are turning into poverty stricken hell holes.

Sad reading.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-24/america-fallen-24-signs-our-once-proud-cities-are-turning-poverty-stricken-hellholes

Those damned cultural marxists again I bet.

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Charles Martel April 25, 2013 at 10:47

oddsock
Those damned cultural marxists again I bet.

Try and think outside the British class system for once. And what happened to your resolution never to comment at the #*%@!&) Spearhead again?

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keyster April 25, 2013 at 10:48

The real problem as Maggie Thatcher predicted so long ago is that you can’t have a functional currency union without first having a political union.

She also predicted that if there ever was a Euro-Union of currency, that Germany would end up having to bail the weaker countries out. Will the guilt over the World Wars ever subside?

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oddsock April 25, 2013 at 12:01

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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kgaard April 25, 2013 at 12:35

I debate whether to wade back in here, but here goes:

@ Anon — Regarding Rothbard on printing money in the wake of credit crashes: It’s a central theme in his book, “The Mystery of Banking.” He makes the astute point that you can’t have a “healthy cleansing” of the system anymore because so many wages and prices are fixed in nominal terms. They DON’T FALL when economic activity contracts. Thus, unless you print, you end up with a never-ending depression because profit margins go negative and never recover. This is what happened in the early 30s.

@ Charles Martel — I know what you mean about my being invested in the current system. I agree that it biases my thinking. I almost got wiped out in 08. It was only thanks to central bankers’ collective decision to save the system that I’m still in business. Then again, if I went bankrupt, it would have been a symptom of a much broader collapse. The world would still be in a spectacular depression today — just beyond comprehension. Think Spain and Greece multipled by 3. Unemployment in the US would be 30%. I guarantee you that would not help anybody. (And this is Rothbard’s point.)

If we could go back and change things, the time to make changes would have been NOT 2008 — but 1998. The system needed to be changed before the debt bubble ever got inflated. You just can’t decide to get religion after the bubble bursts. The damage is already done. One of Rothbard’s insightful points is that inflation doesn’t happen when prices rise, it happens when the excess liquidity is created. When the crash comes you can either have a spectacular depression or print enough to get you back to stable nominal pricing. Bernanke did the latter and it was the right call.

I’m not trying to bum everybody out. I think Aaron Clarey is awesome. I just think it’s important to have one’s economics straight. If you plan for a collapse and it doesn’t happen, you’re gonna be pissed off and resentful …

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Charles Martel April 25, 2013 at 15:03

kgaard
If we could go back and change things, the time to make changes would have been NOT 2008 — but 1998. The system needed to be changed before the debt bubble ever got inflated. You just can’t decide to get religion after the bubble bursts. The damage is already done. One of Rothbard’s insightful points is that inflation doesn’t happen when prices rise, it happens when the excess liquidity is created. When the crash comes you can either have a spectacular depression or print enough to get you back to stable nominal pricing. Bernanke did the latter and it was the right call.

For you. In the short run. And by the way I have the opposite problem to you. I avoided the 2008 crash but did not anticipate the extent to which Bennie and the Feds would prove willing to intervene in the capital markets.

Now we have a situation where Wall Street and the political elites are hooked on taxpayer crack. Central banks are buying equities for God’s sake in addition to the Fed buying up all the distressed debt that Wall Street throws at them. Think of the awesome moral hazard. Once you start down that road there’s no turning back. This is the kind of corruption that leads to revolutions. But your stock portfolio has recovered so for you, no problemo.

In Europe, Greece and Spain (and others soon) are in a doom loop because they don’t control their own currencies. They can’t tax, grow or inflate their way out from under their national debts.

I was born handicapped with an innate desire to see justice done. It’s not nearly enough for me that I get mine. The current corruption in Washington drives me nuts. I’m not naive enough to think this is anything new, but the scale of the current problem is off the charts.

Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 20 Thumb down 2
Cpt. Capitalism April 25, 2013 at 15:06

Well, there’s another idea.

Everybody could read the book and THEN make commentary about it.

Just sayin’.

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greyghost April 25, 2013 at 15:40

Why not live life to the fullest by working to live not living to save and living to be of “service” to others? This from Christopher Corbett. The point is not just live off 20k but live off what will allow you to live with out the rushed stress to produce. How many men worked for nice comfortable homes to provide for wife and kids stressing about everything under the sun to be kicked in the chest by divorce and then get the red pill shock to learn that western society couldn’t give a damn about your love of child and commitment to family.
I don’t know what it is about some men they feel they have to follow one thought in completely. Rather than live off 20k I’m going to live off 32k and never borrrow money. I’ll make 20k more “off The Books” having fun the whole time. No stress trying to live up to society. The whole point is to not kill yourself for a delusion. The book has Ideas on how to do it.
cheap living skill maybe the way to survive. Learning to live low also makes you less vulnerable to bullies and tyrants criminal and government. http://cheaprvliving.com/Boondocking.html

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Mark April 25, 2013 at 21:54

I’ve driven past the “garden” apartment complexes where $20K earners live, glanced at the discount-aisle cheese they eat, and peered into the windows of the public transportation they use to get around. The great Chris Farley, aka Matt Foley, told us everything we need to know about “living in a van down by the river,” mostly that it’s for losers.

I run a painting business, and work hard, and before you’ll see me living like that you’ll have to pry the airless sprayer from my cold dead hands.

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oddsock April 25, 2013 at 22:35

“The philosopher Diogenes was eating bread and lentils for supper. He was seen by the philosopher Aristippus, who lived comfortably by flattering the king. Said Aristippus, ‘If you would learn to be subservient to the king you would not have to live on lentils.’ Said Diogenes, ‘Learn to live on lentils and you will not have to be subservient to the king.’”

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efemyzed April 25, 2013 at 23:12

“The slacker life is very depressing once you pass 30. ”
For the monied slackers, its an anti-depressant thing.

Otherwise, the book is obvious.
For those who don’t see it, buy da book.

OR…

GYOW.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 9 Thumb down 4
Brigadon April 26, 2013 at 08:16

people take a very dim view of ‘gyow’ by building yourself an armed bunker complex. Go figure… a hundred years ago that would have been applauded.

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Solitary Howler April 26, 2013 at 11:26

Well, here’s another idea.

Everybody could take a big whiff of your odious dogshit and then decide not to pay $15 to take a bite out of it.

Just sayin’.

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Avenger April 26, 2013 at 20:06

@FTLOTBP
“I’m also close to expatting. I walked away from a shitty job last year. (Note: I was making WAY under $20,000 a year. Making a “mere” $20,000 at a job in a year is not nearly so easy as it used to be.)”

And how do you intend to expat with no money? Or make any money in a country where you don’t have a work permit AND it takes a lot higher credentials just to get an ordinary job where in the US they’d hire anyone breathing for the same job besides not speaking the language. And I find it impossible to believe that anyone could even earn less than $20k since this is what some Walmart greeter or 7-11 clerk would make.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 6
Avenger April 26, 2013 at 21:09

greyghost April 24, 2013 at 19:43

Would some older man on here straighten this boy out.

You’re no Kato Kaelin kid

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a guy April 26, 2013 at 21:13

I hate to have to put it in these blunt terms but:

Anyone who thinks that our current depression is just the same as the 1930s, but we’re handling it better now is beyond foolish. Think of these things:

1) In the 1930s, very few if any of the western countries had the extensive welfare systems they have today. Nowadays, we have MULTIPLE generations of people who live off of the dole.

2) In case you’re wondering why the western countries are so keen on importing millions of 3rd world savages as immigrants, despite the cultural problems, despite the soaring crime rates, and despite the complete lack of loyalty these immigrants have to their host countries, all you have to do is see #1 above. The welfare state is a giant Ponzi scheme wherein one needs each generation of taxpayers to be larger in number than the previous generation so that the money coming in to pay for the entitlements is greater than the expenditures.

But wait, the sexual promiscuity and perversion pushed by the idiot nutbags on the Left (YES! CULTURAL MARXISTS!) have ushered in an era where nobody wants have children, therefore the Ponzi scheme WILL collapse…unless our corrupt ruling class bring in more wage slaves – the dumber the better, because smart ones might actually catch on. Additionally, there is a subset of leftwing nutbags that want the 3rd world immigrants in by the millions because they will help dilute and destroy the native culture. Plus, 3rd worlders are, by far, more desirous of free shit from the government, and therefore are more accepting of socialism/communism.

3) In the 1930s, most countries of the West, ESPECIALLY the USA, did not have the governmental barriers to free enterprise that they have n0w, and thus the various economies could grow the country out of depression. With the excessive regulation by busybody bureaucrats, excessive taxation by a corrupt government trying to prop up the welfare state (which only exists to buy from from interest groups), and oppressive government interference in all markets, our economies CANNOT expand. This means that the money printing done by the likes of that idiot Bernanke will DOOM us, because rather than be temporary until the economy expands, the money printing is the only thing keeping the stock market and banks afloat. It is a house of cards.

4) People had morals and decency back in the 1930s, mostly because most people in the West were Christian (the real kind, not the gay-hugging, feminist crap that passes for most churches now). Now, it’s pretty much every man for himself, and the governments help the big banks steal from everyone.

As for when the collapse will come: that is a silly question. The collapse is ALREADY happening. Only people with blinders on would miss the obvious decay of previously reliable institutions and traditions. The only question now is: when is the grand finale?

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muk April 27, 2013 at 00:26

Lol, I’ve already been living the minimalist lifestyle pretty much since o graduated high school. I saw college for the ripoff that it is, and decided against it, and taught myself the subjects that I’m interested in. I’ve been delivering pizza for about 7 years, and doing pretty well for myself. My parents are always like “why don’t you do something Better?” At which point, I remind them that I live in a pretty nice apartment, in a good area, own two cars outright (saved up, and bought with cash) have no debt, and no stress. I’m doing pretty good on this $20k job.

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bruno April 27, 2013 at 02:05

So the author is saying that we should be parasites on the system and on our fellow men, and to hell with all consequences?

So he’s saying we should live like… women?

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Anonymous April 27, 2013 at 02:53

@Avenger

“And how do you intend to expat with no money? Or make any money in a country where you don’t have a work permit AND it takes a lot higher credentials just to get an ordinary job where in the US they’d hire anyone breathing for the same job besides not speaking the language. And I find it impossible to believe that anyone could even earn less than $20k since this is what some Walmart greeter or 7-11 clerk would make.”

I have savings. And I am going to have a visa and work permit. I’m going to teach English as a foreign language like most expats do. I made less than $12,000 my first year at that shitty job. There’s tons of people making far less than $20,000. Hell 20k might be enough for me to stay in America and save. Oh, it’s very possible. Exaptting can be done on the cheap as well, as can many things.

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FTLOTBP April 27, 2013 at 02:53

@Avenger

“And how do you intend to expat with no money? Or make any money in a country where you don’t have a work permit AND it takes a lot higher credentials just to get an ordinary job where in the US they’d hire anyone breathing for the same job besides not speaking the language. And I find it impossible to believe that anyone could even earn less than $20k since this is what some Walmart greeter or 7-11 clerk would make.”

I have savings. And I am going to have a visa and work permit. I’m going to teach English as a foreign language like most expats do. I made less than $12,000 my first year at that shitty job. There’s tons of people making far less than $20,000. Hell 20k might be enough for me to stay in America and save. Oh, it’s very possible. Exaptting can be done on the cheap as well, as can many things.

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Avenger April 27, 2013 at 13:42

Howler–”The manosphere is becoming more and more just like the femosphere (and perhaps I just did make that up). A bunch of whining halfwits writing in 98% pure hyperbole, doing no fact-checking at all and yapping platitudes….”

At least the femosphere seems to get things done and is not just a bunch of bitter little boys bitching to each other.

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Avenger April 27, 2013 at 14:03

FTLOTBP

Why don’t you just teach English where you are now? Besides, you would need at least a BA in English and your English and grammar would have to be perfect to make any money. You’d also have to live in a more prosperous area where there are wealthier people who could afford your fee. Some place like Taiwan where you can tutor the daughters of the wealthier people and earn $40-50 an hour. Poorer and cheaper places are no good at all. No one will be able to pay you for lessons or you’ll be working for $2 an hour.

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FTLOTBP April 27, 2013 at 18:25

Avenger

“Why don’t you just teach English where you are now? Besides, you would need at least a BA in English and your English and grammar would have to be perfect to make any money. You’d also have to live in a more prosperous area where there are wealthier people who could afford your fee. Some place like Taiwan where you can tutor the daughters of the wealthier people and earn $40-50 an hour. Poorer and cheaper places are no good at all. No one will be able to pay you for lessons or you’ll be working for $2 an hour.”

I’ve applied for hundreds of teaching jobs in the U.S. over the past 3 years. Education in this society has long been a joke, but now there are no jobs there either. I have an education/English degree that will go completely or mostly to waste if I don’t expat. And that is exactly what I am trying to do. The ESL industry has fallen a lot as well, but compared to the U.S. job market it might as well be paradise. Teaching in the most prosperous areas abroad is generally a bad idea: competition is high and wages are low as a result because every Tom, Dick, and Harry want to go there. Ditto for wealthy clients – everybody goes where the money is. The hotspots and wealthy clients are largely done for when it comes to a new expat.

I’ll be making a modest salary with benefits in China. It will be a little more than I was able to make in the U.S. and that is BEFORE considering the apartment and benefits that come with it. You have no clue what you are talking about.

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greyghost April 27, 2013 at 18:58

Would some older man on here straighten this boy out.

You’re no Kato Kaelin kid
Avenger You aren’t motivated. You aren’t motivated at all. Cheer up the world will get better If we make it better. I’m still optimistic Infact I’m more optimistic about the MRM than ever all of this bad news and gun sales thru the roof is great. The Collapse is happening right now. And you are still talking like a prisoner. I heard a story about a political prisoner in stalin’s russia would make jokes about stalin and the guards would be terrified. I used to worry about so much. Not any more. I’m free now. Any man not feeding the feminine imperative is alright with me. To many men here today on the spearhead are prisoners to something that doesn’t exist any more.

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Realman April 27, 2013 at 19:39

@Towgunner (April24)

Not sure whether this is the right forum for an in depth discussion on the pros/cons of ex-patting especially given the number of down-votes I received, but thanks for your interest. There are a number of ex-pat forums on the web that do an excellent job at helping men make a decision whether to ex-pat and where to settle (Forexpatsbyexpats, International Living magazine, Happierabroad, etc).

I will however mention in passing a few points to remember.
Choose a country:
1. in the developing world close to your home country for ease of family visits;
2. with climate compatibility and free of extreme weather conditions (e.g. hurricanes);
3. free of civil unrest, with a stable political system, and low crime rates;
4. with a good and inexpensive health care system and hospitals/doctors;
5. self-sufficient in fresh healthy food, and with well stocked local markets;
6. disconnected as much as possible from the global financial/banking system (or when the crash comes it will go down too);
7. with friendly locals who welcome you and are eager to help;
8. with cheap and readily available essential food and services;
9. with a fast Internet connection and reliable power supply;
10. with due process of law and an uncorrupted criminal justice system;
11. uncontaminated by feminism and all the anti-male drama that goes with it;
12. that provides opportunities for employment/income generation or with retirement benefits;
13. with good transport infrastructure and proximity to airport;
14. easy visa or residency arrangements;
15. not a Muslim country (they hate us).

I was an Australian, so I had a number of countries that accommodated all or most of the above. Suitable countries that offered a highly desirable lifestyle included Thailand, Cambodia, VietNam, and some pacific island groups. I chose the Philippines because it is English speaking and Catholic and live in the south where it’s free of weather extremes. You are from the US and most Americans are ex-patting to central and south America or Mexico. Highly recommend you look at Ecuador; very popular with your people. The Caribbean islands also has attracted many US ex-pats.

Good luck with your investigations and best wishes.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1
Avenger April 27, 2013 at 21:12

The hotspots and wealthy clients are largely done for when it comes to a new expat.

Not if you’re from the same class yourself. Rich parents want upper class tutors for their kids.

Now, from what you’ve said you won’t be doing much better in China than you did in the US. And I find it hard to believe that you couldn’t find a job as a tutor in the US. Or that you were earning minimum wage. That would have had to be in a very poor area because no one would ever be able to find anyone, even some school kid, to work for that sum. Many places have their own min. wage that’s higher than the Fed. one. You won’t find anyone in Seattle paying less than $10 for even the most menial jobs that kids do.

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Kgaard April 27, 2013 at 21:43

@ Avenger:

I agree with your points on cultural degeneration and the immigration problem. Both drive me crazy. But I don’t think these will doom the economy. There are two factors people tend to forget:

a) The economy is getting more productive every year, so it can CARRY many more deadweight people and still function;

b) We are importing people of below-average intelligence (let’s say 88 IQ on average) — but the average intelligence of EVERYONE in emerging markets is rising by 5-8 IQ points per decade. A Peruvian who was selling chicklets by the side of the road 40 years ago now has a grandchild capable of doing college work. Internet and cellphones are making people more technologically proficient (effectively smarter).

US culture will be colder and more alienating as we become a mishmash of races with nothing in common, but that doesn’t mean the economy will crash.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 2
geographybeefinalisthimself April 27, 2013 at 23:59

“At least the femosphere seems to get things done and is not just a bunch of bitter little boys bitching to each other.”

What are we supposed to do to get things done, resort to violence (some non-custodial fathers have already shot up courthouses, and that is not helping our cause yet, but I digress)? I would only take that route when things for the vast majority of males becomes so unpalatable that violence against women becomes the only option.

Unlike feminists who started their agenda unencumbered by the obligation of having to work paid jobs, men don’t have that freedom of not having to work, which limits their ability to get things done.

Here’s a great idea, if it bothers you so much reading what is typed on this site by people who are venting: 1) don’t come on this site, or 2) if you do come on this site and don’t like what you are reading, scoop your eyes out with a melon baller.

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Anonymous April 28, 2013 at 06:23

Kgaard–you either have no reading comprehension or you are a disinformation agent. I’ve read pretty much everything written by Rothbard (and Mises, and the rest of the Austrians). No where in that book, or any other book, essay, pamphlet, or lecture that Murray Rothbard ever gave, does he suggest printing money as a solution to any problem. The conclusion of the book you referenced, and all of his other works, is that the Federal Reserve should be abolished and gold should be used as money.

Cite paragraphs and pages numbers or stop talking nonsense.

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FTLOTBP April 28, 2013 at 07:18

Avenger

“Now, from what you’ve said you won’t be doing much better in China than you did in the US. And I find it hard to believe that you couldn’t find a job as a tutor in the US. Or that you were earning minimum wage. That would have had to be in a very poor area because no one would ever be able to find anyone, even some school kid, to work for that sum. Many places have their own min. wage that’s higher than the Fed. one. You won’t find anyone in Seattle paying less than $10 for even the most menial jobs that kids do.”

Oh, I will be doing a lot better. As I said before, you don’t know what you are talking about. $1000 per month in the U.S. and 7000 RMB per month in China are two very different lifestyles and positions in society. The former is poverty. The latter is solidly middle class. Factor in that I will get an apartment at no cost, health insurance provided by employer, and lovely Chinese women to date, and it’s is many times a better deal than staying in the U.S.

And that’s before even getting into future prospects. Teaching in China might help me upon returning to the U.S. Flipping burgers is a GUARANTEED dead end. Might as well take that S&W early retirement plan.

I don’t live anywhere near Seattle. Screw Seattle.

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oddsock April 28, 2013 at 07:36

Avenger

Just to add to the rather eloquent and succinct suggestions made to you by geographybeefinalisthimself.

Shut up you feckin muppet !

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Kgaard April 28, 2013 at 07:39

@ Anonymous — Oh yes he does! Rothbard absolutely says this. Yes he prefers the gold standard, and yes he proposes getting rid of the Fed. But he’s also a pragmatist. Within the current system (which is what we have to deal with), sometimes you have to print to avoid never-ending depressions. It’s right in there in The Mystery of Banking.

I am traveling or I would find and give you the citation. I really should have it at hand, because obviously this is an important issue.

But I’ll pose this question to you: What do YOU think the Fed should have done in 1930-34 — after the crash had already happened and with the US economy sliding into a black hole? Do you think FDR should have continued Hoover’s tight money policies?

BTW … I’m not a disinformation agent. I spent six years at a supply-side economics think tank. I live and breathe this stuff.

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oddsock April 28, 2013 at 08:11

Kgaard

“BTW … I’m not a disinformation agent. I spent six years at a supply-side economics think tank. I live and breathe this stuff.”

So you spent six years in a think tank to make this total feck up ?

I suggest you brace yourself, I suspect you are about be thoroughly and very roughly reemed.

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Anonymous April 28, 2013 at 09:49

Kgaard–luckily for you the Mises institute puts most of their books up for free on their site. And since you obviously have internet access, here you go:

http://mises.org/document/614/Mystery-of-Banking-The

Also, here is Rothbard’s history of the depression

http://mises.org/document/694/Americas-Great-Depression

The pdf version is fully searchable.

I await your cites.

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Anonymous April 28, 2013 at 09:55

I quote, from Rothbard’s concluding chapter in Myster of Banking:

The Fed’s continuing inflation of the money supply in the
1930s only succeeded in inflating prices without getting the
United States out of the Great Depression. The reason for the
chronic depression was that, for the first time in American history,
President Herbert Hoover, followed closely and on a larger
scale by Franklin Roosevelt, intervened massively in the depression
process. Before 1929, every administration had allowed the
recession process to do its constructive and corrective work as
quickly as possible, so that recovery generally arrived in a year or
less. But now, Hoover and Roosevelt intervened heavily: to force
businesses to keep up wage rates; to lend enormous amounts of
federal money to try to keep unsound businesses afloat; to provide
unemployment relief; to expand public works; to inflate
money and credit; to support farm prices; and to engage in federal
deficits. This massive government intervention prolonged the
recession indefinitely, changing what would have been a short,
swift recession into a chronic debilitating depression.
Franklin Roosevelt not only brought us a chronic and massive
depression; he also managed to usher in the inflationary boom of
1933–37 within a depression. This first inflationary depression in
history was the forerunner of the inflationary recessions (or
“stagflations”) endemic to the post-World War II period. Worried
about excess reserves piling up in the banks, the Fed suddenly
doubled reserve requirements in 1937, precipitating the recession-
within-a-depression of 1937–38.
Meanwhile, since only the United States remained on even a
partial gold standard, while other countries moved to purely fiat
standards, gold began to flow heavily into the United States, an
inflow accelerated by the looming war conditions in Europe. The
collapse of the shaky and inflationary British-created gold
exchange standard during the depression led to a dangerous
world of competing and conflicting national currencies and protectionist
blocs. Each nation attempted to subsidize exports and
restrict imports through competing tariffs, quotas, and currency
devaluations.
The pervasive national and regional economic warfare during
the 1930s played a major though neglected role in precipitating
World War II. After the war was over, Secretary of State Cordell
Hull made the revealing comment that
war did not break out between the United States and any
country with which we had been able to negotiate a trade
agreement. It is also a fact that, with very few exceptions,
the countries with which we signed trade agreements joined
together in resisting the Axis. The political lineup follows
the economic lineup.1

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Anonymous April 28, 2013 at 10:35

As an aside, if you want to be taken seriously in economics circles, advertising that you spent 6 years in a supply-side think tank isn’t exactly the way to go about it. I’d take you more seriously if you spent 6 years working in a whorehouse. At least then you’d be intellectually honest and understand the fundamentals of economics.

Remember the debate surrounding supply side economics in the 1980s, when we were trying to determine how much the tax rate should be lowered so that we could maximize tax receipts. What kind of an idiot would spend 6 years of their life trying to most efficiently maximize the size of the government’s take?

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Kgaard April 28, 2013 at 11:33

@ Anonymous — I downloaded the book and have been going through it. I may, in fact, be wrong here. I can’t find what I am looking for. I won’t know for a week or more til I get home whether it exists.

What I did find — and what I remember striking me when I first read it — was Rothbard’s footnote on Temin’s book (p214) about the Jacksonian economy and the recession of that period. At that time, prices and wages WERE allowed to plunge and thus the depression was short and sharp. Rothbard goes on to say that FDR got in the way of this adjustment process 100 years later in the Great Depression.

So perhaps I over-extrapolated in my own mind. What I took away from Rothbard’s quoting of Temin was that if other political factors interfere, the cleansing won’t work and the depression will never end. I have to check my notes. But the implication is this: If you CAN’T let wages and prices collapse (due to stickiness) then there WON’T be a healthy cleansing and the depression will never end.

Recall that the US of the 1930s was far different from the 1830s. For one thing the vote had been extended to far more segments of society (including women). So there was no way to allow wages to plunge. It just wasn’t gonna happen.

Anyway, I may to throw in the towel on this one because I can’t find the quote and it may not exist.

But I re-iterate my previous question: Do you think the dollar shouldn’t have been devalued post 1929 — GIVEN the political constraints to allowing other prices and wages and benefits from collapsing (given the much wider political electorate)?

Also, regarding supply-side economics, it has never had a problem with raising more revenue — the idea is that you want the tax rate that generates the most wealth creation in the society. That will tend to throw off the most tax revenue too.

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Anonymous April 28, 2013 at 12:56

Well, respect for the response. At least you’re not a disinfo agent.

The short answer is that even if wages and prices are sticky downwards, printing money is never, ever the answer if you believe in Austrian economics and in particular the Austrian Theory of the Business Cycle. That’s how I knew that Rothbard would never have said that. Printing money is even worse than not allowing wages and prices to adjust and will only exacerbate the issue–the recession will never end, you will pile additional malinvestments on top of the ones that you are not allowing to clear (i.e. causing an even bigger recession eventually), and on top of all of that you will create an inflation problem or potentially a hyperinflation.

http://www.lewrockwell.com/north/mom.html

Right–my point is that the whole premise is wrong. Why would I want to throw off the most tax revenue? They’re coming at the problem from exactly the wrong angle. The question should be: how do we achieve the tax rate the minimizes government revenue. I.e., set it at 0. Or if you’re a pragmatist, 1%.

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Zorro April 28, 2013 at 14:00

“Mr. Clarey suggests, in all seriousness, the .45 cal “Smith and Wesson retirement plan”, as the last six months of life are extremely expensive and not all that pleasant anyways. Not a very Christian recommendation as far as recommendations go, but Mr. Clarey does not identify as a Believer and therefore has the latitude to recommend such a nihilistic option.”

So if I am a Christian I am not allowed to mug an old woman for her SS check, but if I am “not a Believer,” I have “the latitude” to do so?

Crazy, stupid and evil do not recognize sex, race, religion or political affiliation, Wapiti. They go where they please, and being one thing or the other does not excuse you from being crazy, stupid or evil.

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Avenger April 28, 2013 at 17:24

@greyghost
Avenger You aren’t motivated………… blah blah blah

Motivated for what? I have no problems with females and knew how to avoid things that may have led to the rare problem. You and the other crybabies on here didn’t, or did they know how to get out of a problem they found themselves in. Before the internet became dirt cheap in 2000 nobody would even know you existed and you’d just cry into your beer on skid row for the rest of your miserable life.Now all of the omegas and stumblebums think they have a forum but you’ll never do anything and I can assure you that 10 years from today you’ll still be moaning. The fact of the matter is that there have always been the competent and the incompetent (lower classes) regardless of whether feminism was around. If it wasn’t feminism that you could use as a scapegoat and excuse for your own inadequacy it would be something else.
Your solution is to go live in the jungle or like a homeless person “boondocking” in their car and that’s exactly the sort of thinking I’d expect from someone who lives in a trailer in Dirtwater, W Virginia. Most of you on here are just hopeless cases not men’s rights activists

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greyghost April 28, 2013 at 19:27

I don’t think your comments are very nice Avenger. Infact I feel your comments are mean and insensitive. I also feel you are intentionally trying to be hurtful. (if you weren’t I will apologize in advance).
Overall I find what you have to say as absolutely correct. We are losers me especially. (i don’t think Welmer is a loser) I also wish I had better success getting sex from women. I wouldn’t have to be an MRA and try to be noticed making comments on the internet. I wish I could trade places with you Avenger even your screen name is almost as cool as mine.

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NWOslave April 28, 2013 at 19:41

The economic/social collapse is inevitable. The petrodollar, will collapse by being devalued until it becomes worthless, (the dollar is presently worth around six cents in purchasing power), and of course other state policies that we’re told will help will accelerate the process.

The world being so economically interdependent is essentially a giant communist entity controlled by the banking cartel. The people in the west are of course told they’re free and a holy democracy of goodness, yet facts clearly indicate a pyramidal political/media/economic power structure. This is communism.

This link is from the congressional records on the goals of a communist takeover of the US. Which the US government now and has been using as the blueprint for world communism.

http://www.uhuh.com/nwo/communism/comgoals.htm

Some of the goals are unnecessary or have been abandoned due to take overs of those particular institutions. Clearly though, all goals have been met. The policies we enact these days are called social, welfare human, ecological or whatever policies, which is a fancy name for state control.

Here is an excellent video by Yuri Bezmenov given in 1985, a former KGB defector who details how to subvert a culture, which was his job.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gnpCqsXE8g

One of the points he may have made in other videos, or perhaps he didn’t grasp it, was that communism is designed to completely collapse a nation socially and economically. Communism, socialism or any such name, is designed not to bring about state control, but to annihilate a nation completely. Communism is not a failure, it is a success in guaranteeing the destruction of a nation.

Virtually all world currency is based on the petrodollar, when the inevitable economic collapse of the petrodollar occurs, the entire world will crash. When that little hiccup mysteriously happened in 2008 the whole world was affected. When the petrodollar crashes and becomes worthless, so will virtually every other currency on the planet. After that, welcome to the New World Order.

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Hf April 28, 2013 at 23:37

I’m on the fence about the collapse. I’d like to think there is one coming, but in all honesty, I don’t think there will be a real collapse, at least not any time soon, and at least not the sort of collapse where everyone takes to the streets. BUT, I do know, and I think most of you will agree, is that Avenger is a dbag.

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geographybeefinalisthimself April 29, 2013 at 06:04

@ Hf

I do agree with you that Avenger is a douchebag, and if he was the victim of any violent crime of any kind, I would hope that the defendant(s) of said violent crime (even if the defendants were female) were acquitted, regardless of what the violent crime was.

Bear in mind all of Avenger’s previous comments on your site, Welmer, including the ones berating the fact that everyone else is welcome to post comments and the ones berating the fact that everyone is welcome to vote on comments except for their own, when you moderate this comment.

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Gilgamesh April 30, 2013 at 00:10

24. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them “censorship” and a violation of free speech and free press.

25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV.

26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as “normal, natural, healthy.”

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W April 30, 2013 at 16:26

Welmer wants us to be slaves of the 1950s, but deny us the pleasures of the 900s. He is a “good man” and wouldn’t accept those savage values. Young women should be educated and know their rights as americans. Young girls should not be married off, men who like them should be imprisoned.

Go to hell price.

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w April 30, 2013 at 19:32

“24. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them “censorship” and a violation of free speech and free press.

25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV.”

These things were designed to protect women, not men. To protect her worth. First they outlawed young marriage of girls (as opposed to women) then started taking a closer look at books etc. Mid 1800s to mid 1900s.

Look at the islamic world: all the (private) porn they want of any type (what do they care if whores of any age or stripe show themselves? they aren’t their daughters.) plus marrying very young girls and having the real deal. That is a man’s culture. There are also woman-culture strains in islam too, but with all the military grade weaponry floating around those chaotic/free countries the women don’t get to rule (they are killed by random angry young males if they try).

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JoeAmerica August 5, 2013 at 21:26

He makes many very good point many are the same as mine, too many to list them all.
Like Americans having chosen socialism.
My though was Americans have chosen lifestyles that lead to poverty, the new poor is a bottom up thing not top down.
If Americans continue to choose socialism, I don’t make any political party distinction here, it would be good idea to hedge the risk of wealth confiscation.

I think his SHTF scenario is very unlikely in the way he put it. I think a SHTF scenario would be if the US looses or is checked in a major war, like a China or some new alliance for instants.

One other thought is we keep blowing economic bubbles, smallest and most productive was the Dot Com bubble, next the housing bubble and now even bigger and growing is the education bubble. There is a pattern here, a progressively worsening ability to correctly value things. At some point we will get correctly valued.

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Mingtian September 2, 2013 at 22:47

@freebird

“Toss up a fence around the nation and make everything inside.
Nothing comes in,nothing goes out.
A fascist’s nightmare.”

That isn’t really Fascism, though, Fascism would be a welcomed change to the US at this point, IMO.

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