Ceaseless Victim Narrative Suggests Legalization of Prostitution Only Rational Choice

by W.F. Price on June 22, 2012

Over the years, the prostitution issue has transformed from one of public vice to a subset of the victimized women trope. As with so many other issues concerning women, prostitutes are no longer considered responsible in any way for what they do, but rather blameless, guiltless victims of bad men. For all their talk about how empowered and equal women are, feminists have an irresistible urge to deny that women have any agency at all when they are involved in anything that might cast the weaker sex in an other than flattering light.

Given that this will never, ever change, there’s really only one way we can effectively prevent feminists from using police to bully men on yet another issue: legalize prostitution.

Of course, not all men visit prostitutes. Most don’t. But that doesn’t mean that any of us will be free from suspicion as potential sex criminals if we happen to speak with an adult woman in public, visit a health center for a perfectly legal, non-sexual massage, or even spend time in public with an adult daughter. All interaction between adult men and women in public will inevitably be seen as a potential victimization waiting to happen (as it is now with adult men and children), and if given the power and mandate cops will act on it. You don’t think it’s possible? Well, that’s how it is in Saudi Arabia, and feminists are pushing us right in that direction.

A feminist article in the Seattle PI shows us how we are getting there:

For Taylor and the two other detectives assigned to the King County sheriff’s Street Crimes Unit, such encounters are a nightly ritual as they patrol Highway 99 — also known as International Boulevard and Pacific Highway South, depending on location — from Tukwila to Federal Way. They look for girls and women walking “the track,” but their real prey are the pimps who use seduction and violence to turn teens and young women into prostitutes, as well as the men who pay for sex in a section of South King County that has a seemingly endless supply of customers.

While many cops would rather not take their work home at the end of a shift, Taylor, Detective Joel Banks and Deputy Andy Conner have turned their jobs of busting pimps and johns into a passionate crusade to save victims of the sex trade.

First, most hookers don’t have pimps. The ones who do usually have them by choice. Additionally, cops are as likely to take on the job of pimp as anyone else.

A study of Chicago prostitutes commissioned by “Freakonomics” author Steven Levitt (professor of economics at the University of Chicago) found that hookers had free sex with cops on a regular basis:

Street prostitutes reported that about 3 percent of the sex acts they performed were “freebies” given to Chicago police officers to avoid arrest, according to a draft report of the study, which was presented to a packed session last weekend at an annual national economics conference in New Orleans.

Given this well-known phenomenon, it calls into question the motives of the King County sheriffs who work so intimately with hookers. If you really want to make a pimp’s job easy, give him a gun and a badge…

I don’t think any reasonable people want the state to take over the sex industry, because there are obvious problems with that kind of enterprise. But the only way to prevent this is to make it unlawful for police to arrest consenting adults who choose to make sex a financial transaction.

If we let the feminists have their way and succeed in criminalizing only clients, the result will be a sex industry that is fully in the hands of law enforcement. Gives a new meaning to the title “public servant.” The potential for abuse of power is obvious, and something we should rightly fear.

To prevent this, we should decriminalize prostitution, make it a licensed business, and collect tax revenue from those who freely choose to engage in the profession. Choose is the key word here. If prostitution is legal business, those who work in it will not be criminals, and will be subject to the same laws and regulations as anyone else if they want to keep their business. Nor will they be victims who need “saving” any more than men who choose to work as, say, roofers.

Let’s give prostitutes a chance to break free from the “cycle of victimization” — by enfranchising them. If they need security, they can pool with other prostitutes and hire a security guard/bouncer, who works for them. They can hire an accountant to do their books. A marketing agent to attract clients. And so on and so forth. No more pimps, no more cops, and no more pimp cops. Best of all, no more “victims.”

{ 127 comments… read them below or add one }

Uncle Elmer June 22, 2012 at 15:34

It was legal back in the Old West days. My old man grew up in Bisbee and Naco, Arizona which had a number of brothels on both sides of the border.

This book describes prostitution in Montana at the time, from the perspective of how the madams and girls themselves did quite well with the proceedings :

Wanton West: Madams, Money, Murder, and the Wild Women of Montana’s Frontier

http://www.amazon.com/Wanton-West-Madams-Montanas-Frontier/dp/1569763380/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1340404012&sr=8-1&keywords=wanton+west

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W.F. Price June 22, 2012 at 15:49

It was legal back in the Old West days. My old man grew up in Bisbee and Naco, Arizona which had a number of brothels on both sides of the border.

-Elmer

Indeed. I heard stories from my grandpa about Virginia City back in the day, and Seattle used to be notorious for its red light district.

What a lot of people don’t realize is that the US is one of the few countries in the Western world (including Latin America) where prostitution is illegal. Amongst Westerners, only the Scandinavians match us in its suppression.

Rebel June 22, 2012 at 15:49

Puritanism has never been so prevalent in the land of hard core porn.

But I still ask the question: Qui bono? (whose pockets are being filled?)

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keyster June 22, 2012 at 15:52

Just because the media highlights anecdotal accounts of the “sex workers trade” as problematic, doesn’t mean that it is. These are stories meant to gin up ratings during sweeps week.

Most prostitutes work independently. The drug addled street walker with a pimp is the exception. There has been some cross over lately with internet advertising (http://www.backpage.com/), assuming the woman can afford a computer and motel room at a minimum.

What exactly does this transaction of commerce entail?
It’s a woman granting a paying customer permission to penetrate her vagina with his erect penis and ejaculate. That’s what you’re regulating or “legalizing”.

Most prostitutes are doing fine and want nothing to do with government oversight, but they’re never interviewed by our media. Turn off the TV, stop listening to shreiking feminists and go talk to REAL prostitutes. They don’t want the government in their vaginas. The “black market” is much more efficient (and sexy!).

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The Trend June 22, 2012 at 15:52

To my way of thinking, if it costs money it is money- therefore any woman who has accepted dinner, drinks, entertainment, or gifts of any kind from a man she has later had sex with is a prostitute.

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Uncle Elmer June 22, 2012 at 16:04

Many of the woman truly are coerced into the trade. Legalization could curb the abuse if it gets in the way of government revenues.

Here’s a passage from the book :

“According to most sources, the Chinese American slave trade was pioneered by a Hong Kong prostitute named Ah-choi who came to San Francisco with a patron who died en route. Through the generous help of her ship’s captain, she set up business in San Francisco during the California Gold Rush. Within two years she owned her own brothel and was making trips to the Orient to import more women, whom she soon began wholesaling. Early recruits worked under contracts that, though heavily weighted to favor their employer, might be paid off with luck in about four years. But Ah-choi also targeted illiterate candidates, tricking them aboard California-bound vessels and encouraging the ship’s crew to “break the girls in” en route until they became submissive.”

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will June 22, 2012 at 16:14
Anonymous June 22, 2012 at 16:15
AfOR June 22, 2012 at 16:28

What they are aiming for is even if you have consensual sex with a whore it becomes rape, because of the imagined (financial) power differential…

mark my words.

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Rebel June 22, 2012 at 16:40

“What they are aiming for is even if you have consensual sex with a whore it becomes rape, because of the imagined (financial) power differential…

mark my words.”

I believe that. Anything to put their hands deep in your pocket.
As always: follow the money.

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Anonymous June 22, 2012 at 16:50

As it has been discussed elsewhere, prohibition on prostitution is kind of one large sexual market place trade union supply and demand control mechanism. It has nothing to do with morals. Prostitutes are providing “cheaply” what one author calls “dishonest whores” provide at inflated prices. Older, fat and ugly women who themselves had uncountable number of sexual partners in their younger, hotter years, do not want to see any option other than themselves is available to the men of their age groups or older.

Prostitutes are aware of the crockodile tears ostensibly shed to protect the prostitutes. A sex worker writes thus: “I’m an atheist who has been a pornographer and sex worker my entire adult life: 10 years. I’m also a former “sex-positive feminist” who tired of trying to shoehorn my life into a useless ideology like a pair of ill-fitting high heels. I oppose the feminist doctrine that women are inherently feeble victims, brainwashed by “the patriarchy,” and in need of someone to protect and guide us. I operate SWAAY.org, the only American sex workers’ rights project aimed solely at public outreach and education. ” http://www.feminisnt.com

As more and more men refuse to “man-up”, and spinsterhood is menacingly glaring at the women who are eventually looking for some “loser” to “settle down” with, expect to see more and more crackdown on men buyers of prostitution services.

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3DShooter June 22, 2012 at 16:54

I read it here on the TS, though I can’t remember who posted it, but it has become my motto (even though I’ve not indulged myself, most give it away for free):

“If it flies, floats or fucks, it is cheaper to rent”

A big plus would be that if legal, it would be driven to a fair market value. From what I hear, the prices – like the WoSD, are kept artificially high since it is a black market practice. I’m all for it . . .

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gunner451 June 22, 2012 at 16:57

It is mostly consensual except for the child prostitution rings, have a friend whose son is in the special forces. He has been involved in some operations interdicting children coming up from Latin America and has implied that it is quite the problem with “large” numbers of them being caught before they hit the boarder. Of coarse legalizing the 18 and ups would free up the cops to go after these guys but as you said a lot of the time the cops are part of the racket and are take a cut either in “freebies” or dollars.

That said, you have focused on just the street walkers but there are all sorts of venues out there now thanks to the internet. I remember a few years ago they busted a group operating out of Redondo Beach California which is a fairly upper middle income city. It was a bunch of house wives that were turning tricks while their husbands were at work. Mostly doing it for the pocket money so that they could by those expensive shoes, purses or whatever. I took look before they took the web site down (didn’t recognize any ones wife, that would have been a hoot!) most of them were pretty good looking white women in the mid-20′s to mid-30′s.

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Will June 22, 2012 at 16:59

Feminists have stated that ALL MALE heterosexual sex is rape. Step by step the laws are being changed to make this a reality.

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Survivorman June 22, 2012 at 17:19

It’s ironic that prostitution is seen as a crime in almost all of the USA, and yet marriage is seen as an honorable arrangement.

I’ve struggled for years to understand what the difference is.. a “pro” does it for cash, and a “wife” does it for a house, a car, jewelry, etc.

Seems the one and same thing to me – pussy in exchange for [whatever she values the most].

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DirkJohanson June 22, 2012 at 17:22

Lest anyone thinks its SoCons, rather than feminists, pushing this nonsense, liberal feminist New York City today passed a law which will punish cabbies for not turning in fares that are prostitutes. They will be stripped of their license if, among the bevy of half-naked sluts they give rides to every day, one happens to be on her way to getting paid for sex instead of giving away drunk for free to an alpha.

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/mayor_bloomberg_signs_bill_prostitutes_wYXCSef82g5FVjgvwt2JGO

Of course, if the suspected hooker tells the cabbie that she’s planning on video-ing the encounter on her camera phone and uploading it to the internet where small children all over the world can easily see it, then its legal since its porn so she’s not a prostitute.

Maybe the answer is simply to have no shame any more. So few young women do, so why should we? Ok, its true, I don’t have any shame (jk), but for those of you who do have shame .. Film, or take pictures of, all your sex, upload it to instagram or some site like that, and then you can’t be accused of engaging in prostitution even if you paid the chick to bang you.

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Eric June 22, 2012 at 17:27

Price:
The PI article again illustrates the dysfunctional derangement of the Seattle feminist elite.

Part of the reason prostitution (along with pornography, online dating, virtual sex, and strip clubs) are so common in Seattle is because this one of the most feminized (i.e. sexually repressive) areas in the entire United States. Of course, the bumblers in local government here—the same halfwits who think that banning handguns will keep us safer than locking up street vermin would—reflexively blame the men for not living up to the lofty goals of feminism.

What so’s doubly stupid about this ‘prostitute-as-victim’ mentality is that if the prostitute was not changing a fee—IOW slutting around with random men like most other women do for free— not only would she not be considered a ‘victim’ but a ‘sexually liberated female’ exercising her grrrl power instead!

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DirkJohanson June 22, 2012 at 17:41

Elmer,

There is coercion involved with some of the women, just like there’s coercion involved in a lot of things in life. And I have no doubt that some of the coercion actually constitutes true slavery, though in practically, its difficult for me to believe that there are many instances where an of-age woman can’t get away from it quite easily if she wanted to. Simply bolting out the door with a willing client, of whom there are no shortage, and getting a ride away is probably an option for 99.99% of even those who are initially truly somehow enslaved.

That having been said, there is also a fair amount of regret sex slavery, which is like regret rape but where you accuse your black boyfriend of making you a sex slave because it sells better with your friends and parents, as in this Brooklyn case finally dropped just yesterday: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/brooklyn/sex_slave_case_axed_WbBy5XE1HsbdgE0wJrCBaN?utm_medium=rss&utm_content=Brooklyn

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Poester99 June 22, 2012 at 18:26

Remember this is “all for the children”, even when it’s completely not, or is a huge stretch
.
A single underage hooker, addicted to some drug, becomes the poster child for all the workers in the entire multi-billion dollar sex work industry so that we can hire 1000 men with guns (more employment) to terrorize all these women, occasionally pimp them out, get freebies and put a whole bunch of guys who are… just… horny, not violent.. into jail.

I guess they want porn, porn and rape to be the only pressure relief valves.

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MRA June 22, 2012 at 19:08

They can hire an accountant to do their books. A marketing agent to attract clients.

That is actuality one of the many reasons hookers have PIMPs, many PIMPs doesn’t like customers massing around with their girls specially when it comes discounts and not wanting to pay, here the PIMP comes to scene, the movie “Phone Booth” scene when the hookers are fighting with the guy over the phone, they call their “daddy” is a prime example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZ0PfqT7zBg

And one particular note, the PIMP fall perfectly in the “douchebag, jerk” who makes ginas wets. there are more probability than a hooker is going to make one of her customer pay for a child than the PIMP.

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Binxton June 22, 2012 at 19:10

Legalizing prostitution in the US:

1) increases freedoms and choices for men

2) chips away total power and control from women.

While law in America cannot be used to revoke women’s freedoms and choices, it can be used to increase men’s freedoms and choices.

And anywhere men have increased freedom of movement and behavior, women end up in second place — which is where they should be.

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Ecclesiastes June 22, 2012 at 19:24

As long as you’re going to serve up such a fat pitch, I guess I better take a swing.

There are many verses in the New Testament concerning how one should conduct oneself to be a proper spouse and have a happy marriage, there is only one that I am aware of that actually states its purpose: fucking.

Yep. 1st Cor chapter 7, read it yourself. Marriage is for those people who desire sex so much that it interferes with pursuing a Godly life. If you burn then marry, but if you don’t burn then it is better that you don’t marry. Spouses quickly usurp God’s place in your life and the next thing you know, you’ll have a first hand understanding of why Adam bit the apple.

The sole chance Christians have to bring back anything like the Marriage 1.0 they had before is to legalize prostitution.

Once legal, they then could make *exclusive* contracts with other Christians with the serious default penalties available to businesses under the UCC but unavailable to men ( or women ) under current marital law. There are laws with centuries of American precedents that would deliver the lion’s share of joint property to the aggrieved party, laws that would enforce audits of accounts for joint ventures ( children ), laws that would at least limit the withholding of affection as a failure to deliver contracted services, laws that protect operational secrets, laws that can require substance abuse testing and insurance for critical personnel, even laws against malfeasance and fraud.

What there is *not* in civil law is jail. Jail is solely a punishment of *criminal* violations.

And you know what? It’s actually possible to accomplish this.

I think Christians ought get their heads out of the self-righteous rears, accept the wisdom of Jesus who told us that the laws of men have nothing to do with ‘sin’, and to just stay out of court. Current marital law isn’t any more ‘holy’ for being couched in ecclesiastically correct language.

There is no way to bring back Marriage 1.0. It’s hardly possible to protect the little good still available Marriage 2.0. Struggling upriver against the moral decline in an amoral ( legal ) system is a fool’s errand.

What *is* possible is to go with the flow, but bring one’s boat into a gentle current. It *is* possible to legalize prostitution.

The rest we can take up in our churches. I also think the wives of the church will be much easier to deal with once we have properly labelled them.

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Anonxcf June 22, 2012 at 19:35

Ecclesiastes hits a nail on the head- not exactly the one that was set up by this article, but an important one.

Simply put, the reason that all these sexual activities are regulated by the government- the same government that can shit all over a man suspected of polygamy (maintaining more than one spouse-like relationship with consenting adults who are all a part of the situation and essentially one large family) but throws its hands up in the air when a married man or woman cheats like crazy with a zillion partners- is so that marriage can be dictated exactly by the government, and anyone living outside of that narrow prescription can be found guilty of SOMETHING.

IMO, that’s a big reason why there are so many laws, but I’m not the first one with that idea, nor the most articulate, so I’ll not mention it any more.

But if the government allows sexual acts and activities to be specified in contracts, then an entirely different kind of marriage can be enforced- a traditional one, for instance, or a plural one, or any number of relationship details can be contracted.

However, I view this as being a reason why the government will actually fight against legalizing any such contract.

As an aside: it may be possible to establish such a relationship now, as long as, err, you were to tape everything. Pornographers seems to have won all the court battles, is what I’m saying, so maybe someone with some law could give that some thought.

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MRA June 22, 2012 at 19:44

To my way of thinking, if it costs money it is money- therefore any woman who has accepted dinner, drinks, entertainment, or gifts of any kind from a man she has later had sex with is a prostitute.

Watch the video but specially at 07:46
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6OKuzkUWho

Many women don’t understand that being a hooker is not just be on the street at night swinging keys with short skirt.

A teen who have sex for the latest phone is a hooker.
A woman who fuck a manager to avoid paying the meal is a hooker.
A woman who fuck just guys with nice cars because she does not like to walk or take a bus is a hooker
A woman brake up with her man because he lost his job is a hooker.
A woman who says “my company has a price” is a hooker.

The list go on, I think the problem is that women don’t understand the definition of prostitution, is not about show legs on the highway:

“Prostitution:
One who solicits and accepts payment for sex acts.”

Those payments don’t have to be money, could be a dinner or a ride to home.

Valentine’s Day, what are the ads about? about what the man has to buy to his woman, what he gets in exchange? sex, blowjob, what he gets any other day, the difference is that women are going to accept a payment in exchange for the “gift”, meaning on Valentine’s day is when most women are hooker.

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Jim June 22, 2012 at 19:45

I liked your article W. F. Price. I totally agree with it.

Decriminalizing is the only way to go and the only sane choice…but I doubt as far as the U.S. goes that none of us reading this will ever see it happen in our lifetimes.

At least as long as people still tune in to the mainstream media.

Just look at what happened with craigslist.

The amount of injuries and deaths (over 1000 per year in a lot of years) in construction work alone dwarfs the amount of injuries and deaths in prostitution. Also more people are trafficked into it. Why no outrage on construction work being legal??? Could it be that 95% ++ of those deaths and injuries are male??

As far as the “swedish model” goes why is there no talk of throwing women in jail for “buying a Man’s body” when she hires him to….

Build her a house
Put an addition on her house
Put a roof on her house
pave her driveway
Cut down her oak trees
Clean out her sewer
And on and on and on

Anyone that does not think that these jobs require “selling your body” come with me and next week I will let you help me put a roof of someone’s house in 95* weather. Then you tell me if you “sold your body” or not.

And oh yeah also tell me if you think it would be easier to have sex with someone for the same amount of money.

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Anonxcf June 22, 2012 at 20:17

“And oh yeah also tell me if you think it would be easier to have sex with someone for the same amount of money.”

I dunno, if you are a guy, sex is actually work, and not every man can do it on command :P

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DirkJohanson June 22, 2012 at 20:30

So this article spurred me to do a little legal research into what exactly is “prostitution.”

With reference to the last sentence in Ecclesiastes’ post, the definition in Florida is: “the giving or receiving of the body for sexual activity for hire but excludes sexual activity between spouses.” So, the Florida legislature concedes that sex for hire occurs between spouses.

The seminal case is California v. Freeman, but unfortunately its only good law in California, though I believe New Hampshire has followed it, so my statement about being able to just film it in NY is kinda technically inaccurate, but in a practical sense perhaps accurate since no one gets arrested for making porn in NY. Anyway, the Cali case holds that porn is OK because none of the actors or the producer are paying for sexual gratification, so it isn’t prostitution in California under California’s definition (at the time, not sure if its changed).

The Freeman case then independently says the First Amendment would allow the conduct even if prohibited under the California law. It distinguished a case where live audience members paid to have sex with paid actors in a theater hired by the theater owner.

Here’s the rub though, and I’m only part of my way through my research but plan to meet with a lawyer I know who is the top prostitution defense lawyer around here – and there ain’t no shortage of it where I live (you should see this guy’s office). In the internet age, its so easy to have one’s own porn website, that it seems that the First Amendment (as per Freeman) would protect someone who does pay for the encounter, but who also has skin in the game on the back end for revenue from the video. In fact, there are many people who have such websites, and I actually got paid $100 recently to do a porn vid with a chick for site she and her husband operate.

Presumably, a third-party could arrange these encounters and structure the operation the similarly. For those who did not want to be identifiable, they could go on a site where the vid doesn’t show their faces, or is filmed very dark, and/or without sound that would give away their identity. Naturally, fewer people would want to watch this anyway. Of course, the operator could intentionally make the site low-traffic by doing lousy SEO and such.

Also, I understand that in Florida and some other states, selling one’s time and just happen to have sex with the guy (or girl or couple) is OK.

Of course, another looming issue for many of us is that even if you beat the rap, you got busted in the first place and all that entails.

Anyway, just ruminating out loud. And just making it plain-old legal is the best answer, at least for these times we live in.

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Geography Bee Finalist himself June 22, 2012 at 20:58

In Africa (yes, I know that AIDS is still a problem there, especially in Southern Africa) many cheap hotels also double as brothels (“les bordels” in Francophone countries).

One African ex-prostitute, Agnes Munyiva of Kenya, should be commended for donating her bodily fluids and tissues to scientists to research why, although she has had numerous sexually transmitted diseases during the time she turning tricks to feed her family, she has remained HIV-negative for over a quarter century since 1977 despite having had unprotected sex with so many partners.

Ms. Munyiva’s story is profiled in the book “28: Stories of AIDS in Africa” by Stephanie Nolen. Where this relates to antifeminism is that white feminists hate prostitution so much that they are ungrateful for a black African female prostitute stepping up to the plate to provide information as to how to eliminate a virus that is still devastating large swaths of Africa.

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continent June 22, 2012 at 21:05
Ecclesiastes June 22, 2012 at 21:37

So, maybe I’m ignorant of “how things work in the real world”.

In Australia, are there long term ( lifetime? auto-renewing? ) contracts for exclusive sexual services?

If not, why not?

I mean, the Philippines are – like – right there.

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evilwhitemalempire June 22, 2012 at 22:19

All interaction between adult men and women in public will inevitably be seen as a potential victimization waiting to happen (as it is now with adult men and children), and if given the power and mandate cops will act on it. You don’t think it’s possible? Well, that’s how it is in Saudi Arabia, and feminists are pushing us right in that direction.
—————————-

“The 1960′s saw the beginning of possibly the most remarkable event in human history – the end of ‘patriarchy.’ Within the space of a generation, a social system that had endured in every corner of the globe throughout recorded history had more or less crumbled.

In every corner of the globe…except the Islamic world.”

http://historyoffeminism.com/a-history-of-feminism/

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evilwhitemalempire June 22, 2012 at 22:36

Binxton June 22, 2012 at 19:10
Legalizing prostitution in the US:

1) increases freedoms and choices for men

2) chips away total power and control from women.

——————————–
then make the connection

what’s the REAL reason prostitution is illegal?

are they REALLY poor, helpless, exploited victims, blah, blah, blah?

or is that just a bunch of shit?

an excuse for fugly females to act on their sexual jealousy impulses and to enforce the pussy cartel (it’s MARRIAGE guys! the pussy cartel is marriage for those too dense to figure it all out) and it’s pussy price gouging for the benefit of women

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will June 22, 2012 at 22:39

@Jim

They did throw the girls under the bus once but that didn’t stop it. Now because punishing clients only seemed more effective they are implementing the swedish model.

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evilwhitemalempire June 22, 2012 at 22:42

Survivorman June 22, 2012 at 17:19
It’s ironic that prostitution is seen as a crime in almost all of the USA, and yet marriage is seen as an honorable arrangement.

I’ve struggled for years to understand what the difference is.. a “pro” does it for cash, and a “wife” does it for a house, a car, jewelry, etc.

Seems the one and same thing to me – pussy in exchange for [whatever she values the most].

————————————
marriage is union pay scale version of prostitution

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Aservant June 22, 2012 at 22:46

Hey Price, I heard a piece on talk radio this morning on my way to work about a tit-less woman in Seattle that whinned until she was allowed to go topless in the public pools up there…….

Why don’t you do a piece on this one and give us your local take?

But just one small caveat with all due respect……and consider that I have spent a good amount of time living in the Pacific Northwest so I know very well about the culture up there (it’s intolerably poisonous)….just spare us the “well, it is a really beautiful place in spite of the freaks” line while you’re doing it…….cause besides that, you’re a pretty good writer with some good insights……

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walking in hell June 22, 2012 at 23:10

“You don’t think it’s possible? Well, that’s how it is in Saudi Arabia, and feminists are pushing us right in that direction.”

In Saudi Arabia a woman walking alone or talking to a man is seen as a potential prostitute. She is punished for trying to seduce men into sin. The victim in this case is the man, which is the exact opposite of feminism.

If you think about it, this is a much more reasonable position. If a woman regularly speaks with a man, he will usually fall in love and begin to bring the woman gifts and feel protective over her. A woman’s typical reaction will be to string him along, all the while taking the gifts. Because of the the man’s noble and honest character he is used, and then throw away; he is the victim.

In Russia and Eastern Europe, prostitutes are still viewed not as victims, but as opportunists who exploit their customers. They are viewed as charging money for something–sex–that should be free.

I hope all men on this board realize that Muslim theology and practice are the best ally that men have against feminism. I sense a hatred of Muslims on many MRM boards, and I think this hatred is because of ignorance caused by exposure to Western Propaganda.

All men should realize that any doctrine that is vilified by America and the rest of the anglosphere is probably a doctrine that is good for men. So you as a man should not become an enemy of a doctrine that would liberate you.

Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 17 Thumb down 2
W.F. Price June 22, 2012 at 23:12

Hey Price, I heard a piece on talk radio this morning on my way to work about a tit-less woman in Seattle that whinned until she was allowed to go topless in the public pools up there…….

Why don’t you do a piece on this one and give us your local take?

-Aservant

Well, this is one of those things that I just don’t think we ought to make an issue of. As a Seattlite myself, I know exactly how people feel about it, and the sentiment (which I share with them) is that pity sometimes requires tolerance.

The less said about it the better.

walking in hell June 22, 2012 at 23:27

I would argue the following.

Sex, like other biological functions, is an inalienable right. Therefore anything that criminalizes sex is exploitative.

Sex should be free to all men regardless of race, religion, age, or appearance. The man who has to pay for sex should be regarded as a victim, and not a perpetrator. The woman who charges for sex should be viewed as exploiting an under class of men who have been forced into the position of paying for sex “through no fault of their own.”

Perhaps the man is born fat, ugly, and handicapped. Why should he be denied sex? Is that fair?

The solution should be public brothels where there is a minimal charge for the upkeep of the brothels, similar to the public brothel system Rome had. Women should not be allowed to ply their trade on the street any more than a woman should be allowed to piss on a street corner.

Again we see things in America the exact opposite of the way things are in the rest of most of the world, and the man is criminalized to bring this backwardness into being. Yet another outward sign of the sickness of America.

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Eric June 22, 2012 at 23:34

WalkinginHell;
You bring an interesting point, which always confounds me when discussing global demographics with other MRAs:

We know that the NWO gang is promoting a globalist feminist agenda and that our own government and its corporate wire-pullers are behind it. Yet the Russians, Chinese, and Moslems—who oppose the same NWO— are viewed as enemies of America who must be defeated at all hazards.

I can’t understand this way of thinking at all. Until our own government starts exercising some responsibility towards men it’s enemies are logically our friends.

Regarding the Islamic countries, this is exactly why our government is at war with them continually. Just like feminised females can’t stand the thought of any male not bowing to their supposed superiority, so feminised governments can’t stand male-dominated cultures who don’t fawn over them like slaves. That’s why the Obamanogs, inspired by the man-hating Ms.Hillary, took out Libya. Libya wasn’t even any threat to us, in fact they’d recently become an ally. But Hillary hated Qaddafi because he was a strong male and anti-feminist; her hatred for Syria too is linked to her feminist fanaticism.

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Eric June 22, 2012 at 23:43

Price;
‘The less said about it the better.’

A lot of the guys who don’t live up here don’t realize that you could write an entire blog on these issues dealing with Seattle alone. Between the drugs, welfare, and rampant feminism here it’s hard to get through a day without coming into contact with some form of insanity.

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walking in hell June 23, 2012 at 00:19

“I can’t understand this way of thinking at all. Until our own government starts exercising some responsibility towards men it’s enemies are logically our friends.”

That is correct; I really don’t understand how any MRA can criticize Islam and Muslims. Some of the most sympathetic posts on the internet come from other Muslim men who cannot understand why men are abused and imprisoned in America to such a large extent.

If you are looking for men who are brave enough to stand up to feminism, and even go so far as to set up parallel courts (Sharia courts) that give men a fair deal, look no further than Muslims in England, Belgium, and other European cities.

While we are here on these boards the Muslims are actually doing the fighting. I for one cannot criticize or fight against a group of men who are on much more on my side, than my own country who is out to destroy me.

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evilwhitemalempire June 23, 2012 at 00:37

In Russia and Eastern Europe, prostitutes are still viewed not as victims, but as opportunists who exploit their customers.
————————–
what’s wrong with viewing prostitution for what it really is for a change?

a transaction of money for sex. that’s IT!
period!
end of story!

NO exploitation of poooor heeeelpleeees feeeemaleeee, awwwww!
and
NO vile seductress, temptress, vampiress of the night bullshit EITHER!

jeeezus already!

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 13 Thumb down 3
evilwhitemalempire June 23, 2012 at 00:47

They are viewed as charging money for something–sex–that should be free.
——————–
FREE?!?!?!

free for who?

a demi-god, superstud, harem lord like you that shoots lightning bolts from his hands and has exclusive access to a gazzilion and one concubines?

dude, last i checked sex costs (at least if the female’s worth fucking at all)
one way or another you pay for your hole (ask any divorcee)

let’s try and make it cost as little as possible for ALL men for a change

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dhanu June 23, 2012 at 01:27

OT: State law requires sex offenders to list status on Facebook: http://mashable.com/2012/06/21/facebook-sex-offenders/

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evilwhitemalempire June 23, 2012 at 02:02

pretty good article up at avfm right now that closely mirrors what is discussed here

about sweden and how it transitioned from egalitarian sextopia to femifascism

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Brigadon June 23, 2012 at 02:10

That’s some twisted shit, Dhanu.
fortunately, there are about 6 billion ways to get around IP checking and post false profiles.
Of course, there is a reason I stopped dealing with facebook years ago :) people take it too seriously.

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walking in hell June 23, 2012 at 02:34

@Dhanu
“Violators of the law face imprisonment with hard labor for a term between two and 10 years without parole, and a fine of up to $1,000. A second conviction will carry a maximum penalty of imprisonment with hard labor for a term between five and 20 years without parole, and a fine up to $3,000, CNN reports. ”

This quote is from the article. It is the punishment for violating the law.

I have a friend who knew of a man who is a registered sex offender. Here is how it happened:

This guy was stuck in traffic and had to piss. He pulled over on the side of the road and pissed there. An old woman saw him and called the police. The police picked him up and arrested him. They charged him with public exposure and indecency and required him to register as a sex offender. Of course his life was destroyed and has been destroyed ever since.

That is a true story. As a man, do you still think you have a future in America?

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freebird June 23, 2012 at 02:46

I saw a feature on the very same topic on the TV.
Basically the cops apply pressure to the girls to rat out any male,either a ‘supportive’ male or a “customer.”
The carrot is welfare services such as food,housing,medical,ect.
The stick is threat of jail.

How very disingenuous.
It’s all about the money,the cops like seizing the up-scale cars from johns,and also extorting legal money for the court and “officers of the court.”

The male demonization is the propaganda cover for such extortive behavior.
It’s nothing personal,your money or your freedom.
Yeah, this system earns contempt daily.
“Justice for sale.”
Cue up “The ghost of Tom Joad.”
How those cops are able to look in the mirror I have no idea.

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freebird June 23, 2012 at 03:03

Good comment Poester.
“I guess they want porn, porn and rape to be the only pressure relief valves.”

Those are pretty much male=demonized already,and hence ripe for a crackdown.

As the “pressure” builds,expect more male on male aggression and general social anarchy,justifying an ever increasing Police State.
They’ve really got the circular reinforced feedback loop down to an art.
So far as to criminalize “hate speech” and the “male gaze.”

Where’s my gold star?(of David)

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walking in hell June 23, 2012 at 03:07

@dhanu

Check this out. This article is all about Angola prison in Louisiana. This is where you might end up if a prostitute talks to you.

Caution: very disturbing.
http://colorlines.com/archives/2011/08/dispatch_from_angola_faith-based_slavery_in_a_louisiana_prison.html

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Epoche* June 23, 2012 at 04:27

Maybe the answer is simply to have no shame any more. So few young women do, so why should we? Ok, its true, I don’t have any shame (jk), but for those of you who do have shame .. Film, or take pictures of, all your sex, upload it to instagram or some site like that, and then you can’t be accused of engaging in prostitution even if you paid the chick to bang you.
——————————————————–
I was thinking about the absurdity of allowing hardcore porn but not prostitution as well. Maybe we could start a business called “its not prostitution its porn” and sell franchises?

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codebuster June 23, 2012 at 04:48

There is one significant problem with legalizing prostitution… there is the risk that your daughter will accept the implicit message that prostitution is a legitimate lifestyle choice. As one prostitute (a “nice” girl turned “bad”) told me, “even decent married men with children hire prostitutes,” in response to which I hastened to add, “no they don’t, it’s just that the ones that don’t visit prostitutes are the ones that you are unlikely ever to meet.” Whatever the pros and cons, we need to be concerned about normalizing and validating prostitution, and how this impacts on the wider culture.

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Brigadon June 23, 2012 at 05:38

once again it’s a case of conflating social and political issues.
prostitution is wrong, badly wrong, from a social standpoint. But that’s no reason to have laws against it.

99% of our country’s problems stem from the idea that making laws to control social behavior is justified. from sexual harassment to child support, from statutory or non-violent rape to marriage, from drug trafficking to smoking bans, the government has been permitted and encouraged to legislate every aspect of our social lives.

And if you look VERY closely, you will discover the truth. virtually every single ‘social’ law in existence has been specifically targeted to harm and restrict the freedoms of MEN.

the ‘right’ and ‘wrong’ of prostitution is a social question, not a legal one, and needs to be handled on a social basis.

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Paul Murray June 23, 2012 at 06:07

This is pretty much received wisdom anywhere people don’t get their ideas from feminism or bronze-age goatherds.

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Charles Martel June 23, 2012 at 06:55

W. F. Price
Well, this is one of those things that I just don’t think we ought to make an issue of. As a Seattlite myself, I know exactly how people feel about it, and the sentiment (which I share with them) is that pity sometimes requires tolerance.

Good call, Bill. The specifics of the case are that the woman has had a double mastectomy and has nerve pain as a result. We should feel sorry for her.

I have moments when I hate women as a group but that kind of monolithic hate is unjustified. As greyghost has said before, what I want to see is the end of institutionalized misandry and the laws that accompany it. I have no problem with true equality between the sexes.

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Huck Finn June 23, 2012 at 07:18

OT:

Jury finds Sandusky guilty on 45 counts
‘Brave men’ spoke’

First time I’ve ever seen an MSNBC headline applaud men for being morally brave.

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Q June 23, 2012 at 07:42

In the press recently, we find that “human trafficking” is frequently being put into the same sentence as “prostitution”.

According to the line of thinking being encouraged, there’s no such thing as an arrangement between adults for sexual services, the service provider is always a slave and the customer is always a slaver.

Another mental association being created: “human trafficking of women and children”. So the customer of an adult prostitute is not only being tarred as a slaver, he’s being tarred as an accessory to child abuse.

Reasonable people might think that most prostitution is an arrangement between free adults that doesn’t involve human trafficking. This is answered by expanding the definition of human trafficking to mean whatever activists want it to mean, while keeping all the above mental associations. You’ll get the idea by doing a Google search for “internal human trafficking”.

If we have reason to believe that workers were treated badly during the manufacturing of a t-shirt or an iPod, we don’t criminalize t-shirt wearers or iPod users, we educate and regulate. The same thing can be done with sexual services if that’s what people are really concerned with.

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Wilson June 23, 2012 at 07:48

We’ve come too far now for legalization to ever happen. Prostitution makes the majority of women feel bad: that’s grounds for the most severe criminalization. A more current issue is the availability of pornography and the culture that promotes attractive women in ads, TV, and movies. Now that the heterosexual sex act is illegal for men, it’s time to stop men’s dangerous heterosexual thoughts.

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Huck Finn June 23, 2012 at 08:05

During the Gold Rush, whores were sometimes held in such appreciation and admiration by the gold seekers that San Francisco named streets after them. There were relatively speaking few women living there at the time in proportion to men. Probably the average whore earned a higher income than the average gold seeking man.

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keyster June 23, 2012 at 08:35

I was talking to a cop the other day and he said that ever since marjuana was “decriminalized” in Colorado, the “street market” for it is as robust as ever. It seems the dozens of “dispenseries” are charging 3 to 4 times more for an ounce (overhead, permits, etc.).

“Medical Cards” were over 120,000 5 years ago, now it’s down to about 70,000. Consumers learned the dispenseries were ripping them off, so they reverted right back to the wholesale market.

Decriminalizing prostitution is one of those “don’t wish for what you want, you might get it” scenerios. As somone wisely alluded to above it sanctifies the transaction of sex between a man and woman, just like a marriage license. It should remain a “grey market” between consenting adults.

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DirkJohanson June 23, 2012 at 08:58

Codebuster,

“There is one significant problem with legalizing prostitution… there is the risk that your daughter will accept the implicit message that prostitution is a legitimate lifestyle choice.”

In taking that into account, while no two places and times are truly comparable for purposes of a controlled experiment, this can be done to some degree by looking at countries were prostitution is legal, decriminalized or officially tolerated, or at the experience in the U.S. at earlier times.

It should also be borne in mind that, currently, 53% of children born to women in the U.S. age 30 or under are to single mothers, and the vagaries of women over their early 30s having children have been discussed at length on this site. And unlike in Sweden, for example, the American model of singlemotherhood is not an unmarried couple, but a woman who had a kid by some drummer or hoodlum the she did a lot of coke with one night.

It seems unlikely to me that if you have a daughter who is able to avoid being one of the 53%, that she will end up a prostitute. I also humbly suggest that in many of those instances, the women would have been better off being a prostitute.

Finally, young women already have the model of prostitution being acceptable, and that is porn being acceptable. One would logically think that being a prostitute is actually less of a step than being the same prostitute but in front of a camera, usually with people watching, hammed up to be extra raunchy (e.g., facial in nearly every scene, 3 or more people), with the act recorded and instantly available all over the world from the comfort of one’s home, internet cafe, or mobile phone.

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Great Books For Men GreatBooksForMen GBFM (TM) GB4M (TM) GR8BOOKS4MEN (TM) lzozozozozlzo (TM) June 23, 2012 at 09:06

Basically ministers and preachers front today’s largest prostitution racket.

It is called “marriage.”

And unlike everyday prostitution, via marriage the State can get a man to pay for past use of a pussy.

No pimp would ever charge you for past use of a pussy.

The State/Church is against prostitution because it detests honest competition.

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Great Books For Men GreatBooksForMen GBFM (TM) GB4M (TM) GR8BOOKS4MEN (TM) lzozozozozlzo (TM) June 23, 2012 at 09:09

Yes, above someone brought up a good point.

Creating porn is legal. So if one pays a women to have sex while a camera is running, it is legal. Turn the camera off, and it becomes illegal.

What if, during a shoot, the camera breaks? Does it become illegal as it transforms from porn to prostitution?

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keyster June 23, 2012 at 09:42

There is one significant problem with legalizing prostitution… there is the risk that your daughter will accept the implicit message that prostitution is a legitimate lifestyle choice.

The nightmare for every father who has a daughter; that she’ll grow up only to make a living allowing men to f*ck her for money. It would take an extremely Leftist/Feminist father to be totally cool with that.

“Being a sex worker is nothing to be ashamed of; on the contrary it should be viewed as empowering. I see no problem with young women becoming entrepreneurs and expressing their independence in a sex positive way…as long as it’s SOMEONE ELSE’S daughter doing it.”

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Brigadon June 23, 2012 at 09:43

@keyster-
Colorado’s “Legalization” is a complete and utter joke. They did not decriminalize it, They simply cranked up the street price by ‘supposedly’ making it legal.

The entire ‘decriminalization’ was a carefully designed social experiment to ‘prove’ that ending the war on drugs wouldn’t work. ‘medical marijuana only’ requiring expensive licenses and fees is not ‘legalization’ in any sense of the word.

Don’t even try to compare it to legalized prostitution.

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Andie June 23, 2012 at 09:46

The reason feminists don’t like prostitution is because it makes women disposable instead of men.

I’m a prostitute. I trade sexual favors (plus a lot of other things) for economic security. I’m a housewife. The difference between me and a prostitute is the number of clients. I have one.

Right now women can cycle through men like Kleenex because men have few other options for sex and children. If prostitution were legal, you can bet a lot of young women would straightforward monetize their sexual appeal and a lot of older men would line up to help them do that. All the pleasures of young women with none of the crazy bitch! Win-win!

This is exactly what feminists DO NOT want. Because in order to compete with prostitutes they would have to offer something other than sex. Something like a pleasant personality, interesting conversation, care, thoughtfulness, kindness, skills in making a warm and comfortable home, skills at raising pleasant, polite, respectful children, etc.

In other words, they would have to become women men find pleasing. If a man is going to give up sex with many different women (and under legal prostitution that becomes the reality for all men), he must get something in return for that. I have personally found that most men certainly DO value the companionship of thoughtful, intelligent, caring women.

If you don’t let yourself go physically and remain appealing and attractive both in body and in mind, there is no reason for a woman to find prostitution threatening. I certainly don’t.

Ugly fat bitches have reason to fear prostitution. But that fear has everything to do with themselves and little to do with men or women who are in fact, prostitutes.

Then again what do I know? I’m just a dumb whore myself. Time to go make my client a mojito!

Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 40 Thumb down 12
Huck Finn June 23, 2012 at 09:57

“Right now women can cycle through men like Kleenex because men have few other options for sex and children.”

That is assuming men are mostly seeking relationships sexual and emotional, and children with women. It seems to me that it is mostly women trying to find men.

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Peace Debts June 23, 2012 at 10:31

walking in hell June 22, 2012 at 23:10
“In Russia and Eastern Europe, prostitutes are still viewed not as victims, but as opportunists who exploit their customers. They are viewed as charging money for something–sex–that should be free.”

Some of those “victims” make more money in one night than an average eastern european makes in one month.

evilwhitemalempire June 23, 2012 at 02:02
“about sweden and how it transitioned from egalitarian sextopia to femifascism”

Swedish brothers still have options. They can get on a plane, fly to Amsterdam and have fun. Or just drive to Denmark or even Germany and have fun there. Or even more cost-effectively they can travel to Tallinn, Riga, Praha and get even more action for the same amount of scratch. The hookers then spend the scratch locally helping local businesses. Some business owners maybe even buy something from Sweden. Thanks to swedish feminists economies keep going.

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keyster June 23, 2012 at 10:41

requiring expensive licenses and fees is not ‘legalization’ in any sense of the word.
Don’t even try to compare it to legalized prostitution.

“Legalizing” prostitution would require licenses and fees be paid to a government entity, along with rules and regulations. That’s the political “price” that the citizen pays, and is passed on to the consumer.
This is what Feminists want, more government oversight of men who’re otherwise free to “express their sexuality”.

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Attila June 23, 2012 at 10:58

“We used to have a lot of whore-houses in the old-country but in YOUR country you have a lot of whores in every house.” —-quote by brother-in-law to some clueless soul who kept asking about the so-called moral decline back in our home country.

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Attila June 23, 2012 at 11:00

A little light-hearted enjoyment —- some dancing at an Iranian wedding (US):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khxYNBhRDNg&feature=autoplay&list=PLD389DCAB2B46A150&playnext=2

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keyster June 23, 2012 at 11:06

@Andie – that’s the best comment of this entire thread.

I have personally found that most men certainly DO value the companionship of thoughtful, intelligent, caring women.

Which is also why they go to strip clubs and patronize prostitutes. For a short time they’re respected and admired, even if it’s not real. The sexual part is merely a pretext for a moment with a pleasant woman. Many clients of prostitutes don’t even want to have sex. They just want to talk. It’s pathetic that a man has to resort to PAYING for a woman to be nice to him.

Women as a group are too solipsistic to see this as an indication there’s a problem with them vis a vis men. Women and how men treat THEM is all that matters in this demented zeitgeist. They have the golden vagina. Bow down to their every whim or else…you will be denied access. Disagree with their disagreeable personality at your own peril.

For every woman who excepts money for sex, she “disempowers”
another woman from the opportunity to deny him sex. That’s the feminist issue at it’s core.

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DirkJohanson June 23, 2012 at 11:24

Peace Debts,

My understanding is that Swedish men can be charged and imprisoned no matter where in the world they pay for sex. Is that not correct? At least if I get busted here in the U.S., I didn’t spend money getting to Germany, paying for a hotel, and getting busted, anyway.

PS Prostitution is illegal in Latvia now, one of the few places in Europe its illegal.

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FFP June 23, 2012 at 11:42

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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Eric June 23, 2012 at 12:23

FFP:
LOL, Andie really touched a nerve with you grrrlz didn’t she?

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FFP June 23, 2012 at 12:26

Organized prostitution and pimping are illegal in Latvia. But individual women are allowed to do it.

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DirkJohanson June 23, 2012 at 12:50

I stand corrected. Thank you FFP.

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Eric June 23, 2012 at 12:52

Martel:
I should probably amend what I wrote to Price earlier about. I think that he and I come from different perspectives about the Seattle, I think he’s lived here most of his life, I moved here a few years ago, left, and moved back.

My point was that the culture here has an extremely desensitizing effect on people. You come in contact here with so much of a sense of entitlement—and a belligerent demand for it—on such a routine basis, that even a case where there might be some justification for tolerance meets with resistance automatically. This is a culture where people are conditioned to assume the worst about others until others prove themselves otherwise. Normal social interaction here is nonexistant.

The city leadership and media tries to whitewash the environment and portray Seattle as a tolerant, progressive place where everybody gets along—the reality is much different here. The people here are known for being uptight, unfriendly, and overtly hostile; there are little or no recreational activities. Seattle is consistantly rated as one of the least family or business friendly communities because of the high cost of living, the low quality of living; and the high violent crime rate and rampant drug abuse. But you won’t hear any of this from the media.

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Charles Martel June 23, 2012 at 13:11

FFP
Andie, so is this how it is in America these days – that you have to be a total doormat and humiliate yourself publicly just to not feel “guilty” or “bad” that you have a “provider husband”?

You dumb bitch. You totally missed the point. Andie likes her husband. She also apparently likes men as she shows up here to show mental defectives like you what a sane woman looks like.

Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 21 Thumb down 6
Eric June 23, 2012 at 13:21

Andie:
‘Because to compete with prostitutes they would have to offer something other than sex.’

That nailed it. Feminised American women hate any type of competition, because they have absolutely nothing to offer any real man. In fact, it’s actually worse than nothing that they offer, specifically:

‘Right now women can cycle through men like Kleenxes because there are no other options for sex and children.’

It’s simple math. The reason the Grrrlz can’t ‘find any good men’ is because the good men are smart enough to understand than that a relationship will make them LESS happy than if they stayed single. When I stopped dating American women, part of the reason was that I realized that I was not only gaining nothing by my involvement with them, they were actually a net loss in every conceivable way. Just a waste of time and resources with no benefit whatsoever.

‘But then again, what do I know? I’m just a dumb whore myself.’

LOL—at least you saved Futrelle’s groupies the strain of thinking up a soundbite to throw at you this time! Unfortunately, this will probably be their reaction, since they can’t imagine themselves ever at fault for anything and have to blame men somehow.

They can scream all they want to though, I’m not going back into the US dating scene anytime soon (although I am tempted to ask if you have a younger sister who’s single LOL)

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Charles Martel June 23, 2012 at 13:21

In fact, Andie is so perfect, it’s hard to believe she’s actually a woman.

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Eric June 23, 2012 at 13:31

Martel:
Andie mentioned once that her best friend was from Serbia, I think she’s learned a lot from Eurogirls.

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Andie June 23, 2012 at 14:05

@Charles Martel

Well aren’t you sweet?

I do LIKE men, and I often think that is because I was raised on a farm with three brothers and no sisters. Farm kids have more of a sense of needing to be useful, I think. And as the only girl, I never grew up “competing” and being horrible to other women. Nor was I ever made to feel ashamed of doing “women’s work”. It was work. It needed doing.

Personally, I was happier making beds and sweeping floors than mucking out stalls and hauling down hay.

@Eric

Yeah, I like hanging out with my Serbian girlfriend because she doesn’t spend the whole time bitching about her husband and knows how to cook! We cook for each other’s families and it’s very nice.

Hey and guess what? She’s an engineer!! She designs electrical systems for trains! She spent 15 years at home taking care of her children and her husband before going back to work. So much for “dumb” whore.

There is nothing wrong with marrying an ambitious, smart, intelligent woman, as long as she puts her family first. Above her own aspirations. Above her own needs. Above herself. Her family must come first. To me, that is the very definition of a mature woman. Women who do not wish to make the care of others the central focus of their lives should not marry and should certainly not have children.

And guess what else? A man with a wife and children at home must do the very same thing. His family must also come first. For most men, this seems self-evident, and my feeling is that men take great pride in caring for their own families.

Women have lost that sense of pride. Now it seems to be all about destroying their families so they can feel “fulfilled”. The sad irony is that caring well for others is precisely what creates fulfillment.

The pendulum swings though. It must swing back soon. I think you will find the voices of women in particular determine the outcome of the election this fall. Women who want family back. Women who want home back. Who want their work and their time respected and honored as it used to be.

We shall see.

Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 16 Thumb down 7
Charles Martel June 23, 2012 at 14:31

Andie
There is nothing wrong with marrying an ambitious, smart, intelligent woman, as long as she puts her family first. Above her own aspirations. Above her own needs. Above herself. Her family must come first. To me, that is the very definition of a mature woman. Women who do not wish to make the care of others the central focus of their lives should not marry and should certainly not have children.

Where did you come from? This is so, so right. Many men discover that instead of supporting their efforts to provide for their family, their wife is a ruthless competitor. Putting herself first, her career first, her ego needs first, her right to consume the family’s resources first. For a man that’s a really, really bad place to be.

Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 20 Thumb down 3
td9red June 23, 2012 at 14:38

@Andie

“I’m a prostitute. I trade sexual favors (plus a lot of other things) for economic security.”

I to, am a housewife. At least, when I get home from work. I provide my own economic security. My husband moved into my house. I enjoy stimulating conversation. And, I trade sexual favors purely for the feel of it. I’m no prostitute. But, I fully support your right to be one.

Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 6 Thumb down 20
Ahmet June 23, 2012 at 14:38

It’s a good day to embrace Islam and to let it embrace you … You will wonder why it took you so long . Don’t keep suffering by yourself!

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 12
Ahmet June 23, 2012 at 14:49

FYI…prostitution is legal in Turkey .

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 4
td9red June 23, 2012 at 15:09

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 20
Ode June 23, 2012 at 15:19

Survivorman June 22, 2012 at 17:19
“It’s ironic that prostitution is seen as a crime in almost all of the USA, and yet marriage is seen as an honorable arrangement.”

For any feminist who denies marriage is legalized prostituion just ask her this question. Can you Find a man who will marry you under the condition that it must be a sex-less marriage?

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0
Andie June 23, 2012 at 15:54

@td9red

One of these women was awarded the house in the divorce. But, she couldn’t afford the upkeep. The electric bill was in the $500 rage in the summer.

hahahahahahahahahhaaa! Are you fucking kidding? Bitch couldn’t live without an air-conditioned McMansion and we are supposed to feel sorry for her?

You are out of your mind. She didn’t pay her damn insurance and let the kid burn the house down?

Financial management? FAIL
Childcare? FAIL

Such a mystery why this bitch got left at the curb.

And you seriously see her as the victim? Do me a favor. Do NOT speak for women. If the example you just cited is true, take a closer look. The woman was not a victim of anything but her own selfishness, greed and stupidity.

Alimony SHOULD be outlawed. You trash your family, you deserve nothing. Not one damn thing.

Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 21 Thumb down 7
td9red June 23, 2012 at 16:13

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 17
codebuster June 23, 2012 at 16:46

Finally, young women already have the model of prostitution being acceptable, and that is porn being acceptable. One would logically think that being a prostitute is actually less of a step than being the same prostitute but in front of a camera, usually with people watching, hammed up to be extra raunchy (e.g., facial in nearly every scene, 3 or more people), with the act recorded and instantly available all over the world from the comfort of one’s home, internet cafe, or mobile phone.

Dirk, Keyster

I do agree that it is inconsistent to legalize porn yet ban prostitution. But something bothers me also about the easy availability of porn. Everywhere you go, the air is infected with this stuff, constantly reminding men of their “needs” and women of their options.

Ever since I’ve been incorporating culture into my understanding of how the human mind and the world work, I’ve been rethinking a lot of things that we take for granted. Ban porn, too? But banning requires regulation and gubmint intervention. How do you send the message that neither porn nor prostitution are valid lifestyle choices for one’s daughter, without getting a meddling, hypocritical authorities involved? China seems to make it work somehow, at least better than we do – I’m not sure what the legal situation is – maybe the authorities just turn a blind eye to it. Maybe the answer is to establish a moral framework (e.g. buddhism) that formalizes the understanding of the relationship between mind, culture and the choices made. Women who transact intimacy for cash lose the ability to be intimate and thus the very reason you would want to marry one. How can you trust someone who trades intimacy for cash?

I’ve struggled for years to understand what the difference is.. a “pro” does it for cash, and a “wife” does it for a house, a car, jewelry, etc.

The difference, ewme, is the intimacy and, ipso facto, the trust. While these are routinely absent in the anglosphere on a wide scale, it’s about risk management – managing likelihoods.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2
Eric June 23, 2012 at 16:52

td9rd:
Amerobitch anger is the weather-vane of truth.

Andie knows the score. Keep your trap shut and learn something from her.LOL

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 2
Ode June 23, 2012 at 17:13

codebuster

There is one significant problem with legalizing prostitution… there is the risk that your daughter will accept the implicit message that prostitution is a legitimate lifestyle choice.

Prostitutes make good money. About $200,000 a year. If a girl works for 10 years and can save 50% of her gross income that’s $1,000,000 worth of savings. She can use the $1,000,000 as a 25% downpayment on a $4 million dollar loan to buy an apartment complex and become a land lord. Assuming a 10% cash flow rate on the investment we’re talking about making a $400,000 annual salary. If I had a daughter who inherited daddy’s mathematical aptitude I’d let her become a prostitute because I know what the ultimate end result would be. She’d join the ranks of the 1%
but…
Most prostitutes have the financial common sense of a drunken sailor.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 1
DCM June 23, 2012 at 17:13

“keyster June 23, 2012 at 10:41

requiring expensive licenses and fees is not ‘legalization’ in any sense of the word.
Don’t even try to compare it to legalized prostitution.

“Legalizing” prostitution would require licenses and fees be paid to a government entity, along with rules and regulations. That’s the political “price” that the citizen pays, and is passed on to the consumer.
This is what Feminists want, more government oversight of men who’re otherwise free to “express their sexuality”. ”

Actually, in this area of society there do need to be some rules. I don’t mean just to protect prostitutes — a well run place has muscle discreetly out of sight unless needed.
If I see a female less dressed than she should be for where she is or for the occasion I tend to avoid her. Why? Because she could be looking for trouble, wanting to be offended, teasing men for fun…
I don’t have any problem going to strip clubs. I can look at all the naked girls I want there without any worries as long as I don’t grab their tits uninvited or such. The rules are known and apply to the performers and the customers.
In ordinary life the female simply improvises and makes up the reality as she goes along, nearly always to your detriment and her benefit.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0
DirkJohanson June 23, 2012 at 17:13

Codebuster,

I am 49 years old and have dated a lot of women. Easily the two women who were most unconditionally in love with me were prostitutes, one who got into it after I first met her, and another who did it as a career and who I first met when I hired her.

I know some of you think they were great actresses. They weren’t. I went to home of the former of the two, having not been there for a at least a few weeks, and she had literally built a shrine to me on her dresser, with pictures of me, everything I had ever bought her (which wasn’t much) still in unopened packages, and such. The other talked about me so much to her family that even know I never met her father, mother, or sister, they knew all kinds of things about me.

I am Facebook friends with the latter, and she was recently in tremendous anguish over losing a lover, and I am Facebook friends with another who I have never met who is similarly in anguish now.

In other words, the loss of intimacy is not a real problem. Both women I refer to had that unconditional love for me that one would expect in a virgin. Prostitutes do not become less able to bond, and I have had other similar experiences with dating women I paid, though not to the extreme of those two. And its not that I’m so great – I’m below average height, not thin, bald, and don’t make a lot of money.

Women who give it away free to alpha males are far more at risk for not being able to be loving intimate partners than women who happen to charge for the sex, and have it with less desirable men that they are less likely to emotionally bond to. Those women go through constant anguish being pumped and dumped and finding out they were in a de facto harem, and that is the model now for most attractive women. They have higher highs, thinking they finally found a top-dog guy, and lower lows when they realize they didn’t cut it and, in most instances, were downright defrauded into giving away sex.

Personally, what I picture as the ideal situation is not a professionalized prostitution industry of “sex work”, but more like it is at the “sugardaddy” level or somewhere like Colombia, where women are free agents and not holed up in a brothel, and a regular guy happens to give them money so they have sex with him instead of giving out free to a drummer, baller, thug, mogul, or such. If you like the girl, you do other things with her – dinner, go to a park, travel, get married, whatever it is.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 3
DirkJohanson June 23, 2012 at 17:15

Ode,

What women these days under age 55 – prostitutes or otherwise – DON’T have the financial sense of a drunken sailor? The statistics I’ve seen are very compelling, not to mention anecdotes, such as the number of women flooding into the housing market just before the bubble burst.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 1
Ted June 23, 2012 at 17:18

“Prostitutes make good money. About $200,000 a year. ”

Read Mr. AfOR’s blog. He reports different numbers.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0
keyster June 23, 2012 at 17:23

Maybe the answer is to establish a moral framework (e.g. buddhism) that formalizes the understanding of the relationship between mind, culture and the choices made.

Christianity WAS the moral framework before secular-progressives took over in Europe and now in the US. Now it’s all about moral relativism (if it feels good do it). No one cares about anyone elses daughter but their own; and they’re scared sh*tless of what kind of world she might grow up in.

It seems Andie and td9red represent the 50/50 national split of women between presidential candidates. Their views are very similar to Romney women vs Obama women. Scintillating!

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 2
Ted June 23, 2012 at 17:27

Andie: “The difference between me and a prostitute is the number of clients. ”

I don’t think that’s really the difference. You say it yourself later:

“Because in order to compete with prostitutes they would have to offer something other than sex. Something like a pleasant personality, interesting conversation, care, thoughtfulness, kindness, skills in making a warm and comfortable home, skills at raising pleasant, polite, respectful children, etc.”

Right.

Sex is important, but at times you guys seem to think it’s everything. It’s not. Consider: you need sex to create children in the first place, but then there are years and years and much other stuff to go before they grow up to be adults capable of successful reproduction themselves.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 2
Ted June 23, 2012 at 17:34

This whole business of women getting money from men is subject, like everything is, to market forces. Used to be the man earned most of the money in a family and he had it to spend. Well, it’s not like that any more. The ladies earn just as much as the men from paid employment, if not more. He just doesn’t have it to spend on you, girls. I see some of you are starting to realize…

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0
keyster June 23, 2012 at 17:35

“Prostitutes make good money. About $200,000 a year. ”
Read Mr. AfOR’s blog. He reports different numbers.

I got to be good friends with an “independent Escort”. She turned about a couple dozen tricks a week at $300 a pop, 3 weeks a month. That’s about $250K a year CLEAR, not including tips. I helped her “coordinate” buying her parents a house. She’s now 38, retired and went back to college.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 2
Ted June 23, 2012 at 17:41

About fifteen quid a trick, I understand.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1
codebuster June 23, 2012 at 17:44

Easily the two women who were most unconditionally in love with me were prostitutes

Perhaps typical of the “good girl turned bad” scenario? I don’t doubt that many prostitutes are capable of being strongly attracted and loyal to men. I’m familiar with their type. There was one friend in a sporting club of which I’m a member, who brought his girlfriend along. A very sweet, agreeable and honest lady… but there was something about her – I could easily see her as a prostitute and suspected that she was. There were indications that she was perhaps “too sweet”, maybe too easily seduced into the idea that prostitution is “just a job”. There are some damaged chicks among prostitutes who wouldn’t be there if their culture provided other more robust options. Typically, they make the assumption that “everyone is doing it, so maybe I should, too.” Too much dependency, clingy, trusting, naive, etc is as unhealthy as cynical, opportunistic, money-grubbing.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 2
td9red June 23, 2012 at 17:56

@Keyster

“It seems Andie and td9red represent the 50/50 national split of women between presidential candidates. Their views are very similar to Romney women vs Obama women. Scintillating!”

Romnwy women vs Obama women is hardly a 50/50 fight. Its more in the range of 30/70.

But, I ask you Keyster, a strong Republican supporter, how could you advocate for Romney? His views change so often there is no way to tell what he would do were he to be elected. For all you know he could get into office and support a healthcare mandate (actually, does he or does he not support a healthcare mandate right now??? huh, I think he only supports it in MA. Well, let’s see what he seize next week). He may get into office and decide the Dream Act is a good idea. He may decide that the bailout of the auto industry was pure genious after all (actually, he’s already spun and respun his comments on that one…). Republicans would have no idea what they are getting with Romney.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 14
Matt June 23, 2012 at 18:07

Republicans would have no idea what they are getting with Romney.

We already know what we have gotten with Obama, and IMHO Romney will be much better than Obama, the manboobz mangina of choice.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0
Paradoxotaur June 23, 2012 at 18:25

@Keyster: ” Turn off the TV, stop listening to shreiking feminists and go talk to REAL prostitutes. ”

Which you can do at “mypinkbook” dot com- where prostitutes freely exchange information with each other. Posting is limited to sex providers, but anyone can read the threads. It’s really, really funny when a provider clearly doesn’t understand the latter and k-raps all over her clients, . . . who are reading her posts.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0
Peter South June 23, 2012 at 18:40

@keyster
““Legalizing” prostitution would require licenses and fees be paid to a government entity, along with rules and regulations.”

In their minds that’s what it requires.

But in reality all they have to do is butt out, stop harassing people.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 0
Eric June 23, 2012 at 19:07

Matt:
‘the manboobz mangina of choice.’

You put your finger on what REALLY torqued Ms.td9rd and that other twit FFP off about Andie’s post. They can’t stand hearing any woman talking about making a man happy—because they know they can’t; and don’t want to admit their jealousy. They like mangina-men who’ll do everything for them because they can’t do anything for themselves. But with manginas, they’re still allowed to despise men as unnecessary and inferior and pretend they are really ‘independent’.

Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 18 Thumb down 3
Dubcik June 23, 2012 at 19:38

Great article. I have noticed recently how activists have done an amazing job creating a new way of thinking about prostitution, that prostitues are mostly pimped out and victims of human-trafficking. Now, when people hear the term “human-trafficking” they automatically think about “prostitution” trafficking. But actually, labour trafficking is far more prolific than protitution trafficking. Men sold a story about their great new life in America, and then turned into virtual slaves, working 7 days a week, 15 hour days, kept in locked down basements, fed scraps, and not paid, or paid so little they can never leave. The only real human trafficking bust in Canada was of 19 hungarian men that were forced to live like this. And yet, that association is rarely made by people. Another association the activists have cultivated is that only females prostitutes are “victims” of pimps or human trafficking. And yet, there was a study done in New York that found almost 1/2 the prostitutes on the street were boys or men. This same study found that the vast majority of prostitutes on the street had no pimp or person controlling them. But, just last night my sister told me how she had seen “48 Hours” and how it is so horrible, 98% of the prostitutes are trafficked she told me! She couldn’t really remember the number, but the impression the show left on her was that almost all prostitutes were victims of evil males! So you are right, the only way for this to go away is to legalize prostitution. And obviously nobody, male or female should be ever be trafficked for sex or for labour. It is abhorrent to think people can do this to other people, and traffickers should be caught and punished severely. But the converstion has gone too far, the activists have used the media too well, and now the general public believes most prostitutes are coerced into it. Too late for the truth now.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 0
Brigadon June 23, 2012 at 21:01

Believe me, ‘Taken’ was a great movie. It’s just that no one understands that this is complete and utter fiction.

That’s one of the biggest problems today. the MSM and Hollowood have been pumping out liberal propaganda for 50 years unopposed.

I actually think it was a travesty that McCarthyism was stopped where it was, because, frankly, the unamerican activities committee was actually RIGHT about what hollywood was doing as a propaganda machines. They have since been villainized, and turned into the evil conservative bogeyman, but 50 years of seeing what a socialist farce hollywood has become has certainly vindicated McCarthyism.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 12 Thumb down 0
Sun June 23, 2012 at 22:46

There seems to be a lack of understanding that Feminism has different strands, although it all comes from the same stalk.

The now “old guard (or shall I say the new old guard)” of Feminist mainly from the 1960s/70s–2nd Wave and some 3rd–are often against prostitution in the idea that it degrades women.

While the newer 3rd and 4th Wave Feminist, who many call themselves sex positive Feminist, are in the advocacy of prostitution.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 7
Sun June 24, 2012 at 00:04

@ Aundie

You–are not a prostitute.

And I won’t allow you to call yourself such.

You are a very rare breed.

I’ve enjoyed your post.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 5
sam June 24, 2012 at 02:21

I remember reading about marine landing in oz and then visiting brothel and actually using 35 min instead of paid 30 min so hooker calls for a cops after a bitter argument and marine was charged for rape and it made headlines here all he did was forc himself on her for extra 5 minutes and refused to pay for that and had his life destroyed literally by a hooker

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 3
YB June 24, 2012 at 02:30

Prostitution is legal in New Zealand. This gives some benefits: cleaner whores, less likelihood of criminal abuse (though underage sex and sex slavery still exists), and the cops are free to concentrate on more important crimes. It also allows the government extra taxes and the ability to track the buyers (supposedly for STD control).

I know from personal experience that for most whores it is a lifestyle choice. One whore I know recently moved to Auckland, strictly because she can earn over $3k a week as a high-class whore vs $600 a week in a regular job.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0
shiva1008 June 24, 2012 at 03:21

have you seen her running ’round (have you seen her)
and the way she wears her hair (running ’round)
if you see her out tonight (have you seen her)
tell her I don’t care (running ’round)
tell her I don’t care (running ’round)

have you heard she’s coming down (have you seen her)
with every sickness in the air (running ’round)
if you see her out tonight (have you seen her)
tell her I don’t care (running ’round)
tell her I don’t care
tell her I don’t care (running ’round)

I don’t care
I don’t care

(kumbaya, kumbaya, have you seen her, let her know)

and if you get alone let her know that I don’t really care
and if you get alone let her know that I don’t really care

have you seen her running ’round
and the way she wears her hair
if you see her out tonight
tell her I dont care
tell her I dont care
tell her I dont care
tell her I dont care

I don’t care
I don’t care

(kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya)

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0
Traveler June 24, 2012 at 04:50

This is an awesome idea, seriously. If all prostituting in America could be like it is at the Bunny Ranch in Nevada, it would greatly improve the state of this “industry”.
The ladies who work there are officially listed as subcontractors…they have no pimps, and each woman decides what she will do. They are not forced into it, most enjoy their job, no one is made to do any sex act they dislike, and they rake in big money, which is taxable. Just watch the HBO (?)special Cathouse, you’ll see what I mean.
Yes, I know that I’m supposed to be outraged by the notion of prostitution, legal or otherwise, since I’m female…but honestly? If it was another way for someone to make a good, taxable living I really couldn’t care less if I tried. I think it’s a good idea.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 2
Traveler June 24, 2012 at 05:04

Unfortunately, even if prostitution DOES become legalized, I see problems around the corner for men.
Will menfolk be allowed to be prostitutes of their own accord?
Will they be looked down on in this industry for not being able to service as many clients in a day?
Would the majority of them be gay, or could a woman also find relief in their services?
Would condom use be completely necessary, or would this finally be the push we need to make a Pill for the male sex?
Also, how would male prostitutes be protected from false claims of (you guessed it) rape? What protocols would be in place for anyone, male or female, to not CLAIM they only wanted oral sex, and got penetrated instead?
Some of these questions are viable for female sex workers as well…but we all know how men are the more demonized of the two sexes. These issues need to be ironed out beforehand.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1
Stoltz June 24, 2012 at 05:34

Survivorman June 22, 2012 at 17:19

It’s ironic that prostitution is seen as a crime in almost all of the USA, and yet marriage is seen as an honorable arrangement.

I’ve struggled for years to understand what the difference is.. a “pro” does it for cash, and a “wife” does it for a house, a car, jewelry, etc.

Seems the one and same thing to me – pussy in exchange for [whatever she values the most].

The difference is that with a “pro” the agreement continues unabated: you pay for a service, and you get a service in return. With a “wife”, she can (and a huge amount of time does) cut the “service” off at any/all times and still gets paid, regardless.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 0
Attila June 24, 2012 at 09:21

Middle-East hater MRAs –eat your hearts out!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qp1RQg3Pw4&feature=related

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 2
keyster June 24, 2012 at 10:16

Romnwy women vs Obama women is hardly a 50/50 fight. Its more in the range of 30/70.

That’s among SINGLE women.
Get your facts straight.
Among ALL women likely to vote it’s 50/50 nationally.

Obama has been the most devisive, disconnected and worst Presidents this country has ever seen. While he’s the best campaigner, he’s the worst leader. He doesn’t even attempt to engage Congress. His pandering to “special identifiable groups” for votes should be insulting, (especially to you T9red). His presidency has been a disaster from ObamaCare to the Fast Furious debacle/cover up.

I also prefer politicians that don’t pander to females as a group, but rather Americans as a whole.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 1
td9red June 24, 2012 at 11:48

@Eric

Read and comprehend.

I’m a married to a man. I’m not a single woman complaining about how there are no good men out there. What do I have to be jealous of?

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 8
Eric June 24, 2012 at 12:28

td9red:
Read and comprehend.

Andie is a HAPPILY married woman who doesn’t hate men.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 7 Thumb down 3
Peter South June 25, 2012 at 12:09

@Traveler – “If all prostituting in America could be like it is at the Bunny Ranch in Nevada, it would greatly improve the state of this “industry”.”

Personally I don’t think having to pay thousands of dollars for sex with ass ugly women is a step in the right direction.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 1
Emma the Emo June 26, 2012 at 00:11

I think a housewife is more that just a prostitute, like people already said – she gives more than just sex, unless she’s a shitty housewife. Prostutition is when a guy takes you out to dinner and you have sex.

Oh, and from the Sweden link about the ban being “very effective”:
“While the law punishing the client rather than the prostitute may not have caused a dramatic drop in prostitution as a whole, its true triumph, according to the report, is that “street prostitution in Sweden has been halved.””
We have a similar ban in Norway, with similar results, only they also say the lives of whores got worse. They don’t care. I doubt they care about the whores, really, or else they would have taken back that law by now. It’s all feminist doing.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 5 Thumb down 1
Traveler June 27, 2012 at 21:58

@Peter South

Actually sir, I suggest you visit their website or better yet, contact some of them. While not all of them are 19 yr old porn star look a likes they are all at moderate to very attractive. There’s all sorts of women of every race, and each embodies a sexy bodytype.

As for cost, that would surprise you as well. While you may be charged over $1000 for a drawn out fantasy or a orgy with many other participants, the majority of women only charge around $100 to $200 for a simple roll in bed. Like their site says, “We’ve been in this business for decades, and have done so by having reasonable prices”. I personally want to check out their services with my lover someday…too bad they are across the country!

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 1
Traveler June 27, 2012 at 22:18

@Andie

Finally, another woman who GETS it!
If there’s one thing I learned from my lover, it’s that sex is awesome, great, wonderful…but that simply having a pretty girl who will listen to her friend/partner is just as important to a good relationship. To have a nice woman who will willingly give hugs, love, conversation, care, and a shoulder to lean on…these aspects of womanhood are rapidly disappearing.

I don’t think you and I are whores for giving our men this love and equality…I think it makes us SANE.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 1

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