On Becoming a “Deadbeat Dad”

by W.F. Price on October 26, 2011

It’s fairly taboo for guys to open up about how they end up in child support arrears, because so many of us still harbor old-fashioned ideas about our duty to provide for our family, whether it’s possible or not. In fact, it’s a huge source of shame for a lot of men, and there isn’t much in the way of pity out there, so the stories aren’t often told.

Well, I figure I ought to break the ice in this regard, as I am currently in arrears, and let people – young men in particular – know how it can happen.

I’ve never been a high earner, nor have I ever been very ambitious about making money, although I’ve worked for the overwhelming majority of my adult life and can’t really imagine not working in some capacity or another. I’m sure my lack of financial motivation had something to do with the breakdown of my marriage (although, actually, it was probably psychologically more of a problem for me than my ex), but before being divorced I wasn’t aware that it was a potential crime.

As is often the case, separation and divorce were a shock to me. I saw it coming out of the corner of my eye, and was resigned to it in a way, but like the typical man I was in deep denial and avoidance. When my ex finally ran off to begin her affair with the then-married man she now lives with in British Columbia together with my children, I was pretty much left prostrate. It turns out the event had been planned, and her mother was involved. Unfortunately, I had fostered a friendship between my boss and my ex-wife’s family after obtaining a job for my ex’s sister, and my ex mother in law used this relationship to my ex’s advantage, essentially cutting me off from employment at exactly the point my ex left me. She would later tell my own mother that she felt justified in this tactic, because “it was war.” Of course, for me it was more like Pearl Harbor, where you don’t know it’s war until the bombs are falling right on top of you, but people have all sorts of justifications for whatever they do.

So, I found myself unemployed in the middle of the worst recession since the 1930s, with limited means, and alone facing a hostile wife, my children having been seized by her parents. Shortly after I filed for divorce to obtain a visitation schedule so I could see my children on some legal terms, I was falsely accused of making death threats while armed and had tactical officers approach my house with AR-15s. Mercifully, my ex recanted her lies under police questioning and the officers withdrew before I was shot to pieces in one of those humdrum “domestic disturbance” incidents, but my elderly neighbor nearly had a heart attack from fright and I learned that men armed with automatic rifles had questioned my neighbors about me in the meanwhile, which was humiliating to say the least.

Obviously, this was going to be an expensive divorce, and quite frankly I didn’t have the money to last long. After my attorney exhausted my retainer within a few months, I was on my own, and I was outclassed. After first admitting that I had never laid a hand on her in anger, my ex, under the guidance of her mother’s lesbian, feminist friends, started claiming abuse. There being no evidence, no corroboration and no arrests, the judge ignored her (this is a pro forma accusation in custody disputes), but I was totally demoralized. About six months after the separation, under the strain of being broke, under accusations from my ex, with a touch of PTSD from the SWAT incident and taking care of two toddlers alone much of the time, I started having severe anxiety attacks. It got to the point where I had episodes of dissociation — all of the sudden I’d feel as though nothing around me was real. I’d hold onto the nearest branch, rail or whatever was convenient just to ground myself in reality. I was a mess, but somehow I persevered and maintained some semblance of functionality. I don’t know how I pulled it off, and this is one of the times I’ve managed to surprise myself, but I was a pretty responsible and competent parent throughout all this, taking care of my children while their mother worked.

During this time, my ex’s attorney started working me, and I did my best pro se, but I had no idea about court schedules, rules, deadlines, etc. It was all a mystery to me, and I didn’t have the time in any event. Nevertheless, I managed to present some facade of resistance, so my ex decided to administer a killing blow. What she did was call CPS (child protective services) on me and accuse me of assaulting my son. She did this exactly as I was undergoing an evaluation by the Court Appointed Special Advocate (CASA), in what was a calculated move to deep-six me prior to the trial, which was scheduled for a couple months down the line. Like her earlier attempt to have me arrested, the call had little immediate effect — the CPS agent checked my son and talked to him, interviewed me and determined the report “unfounded.” I breathed a sigh of relief, but of course I was even more stressed and demoralized than ever. Then, unbelievably, she called CPS again two weeks later, this time accusing me of assaulting my then two-year-old daughter. Again, I had to deal with CPS, and this time they said that, since my daughter was only two, they would be referring the case to the police. I called my former attorney, who told me to relax, but I couldn’t. And of course, I didn’t have the money to pay him, so he did little besides try to reassure me. Fortunately, once again the CPS agent declared the report unfounded, and the police declined the case, but the damage was done. The CASA worker – a grad school volunteer – decided to err on the side of caution, and before the CPS agent finished the investigation (she had a deadline) recommended I attend a domestic violence course for six months (typically reserved for convicted offenders) which would cost me thousands of dollars, and have supervised visitation of my children until its completion, which meant that I wouldn’t see them for all that time in any event, since I had no family to stay with me at the time.

I was shattered, broken, beaten down. An attorney friend suggested I go to trial pro se, since I couldn’t get a worse deal either way, and he was probably right, but I simply couldn’t handle it — I was spent. About this time my ex’s attorney approached me with what looked like a reasonable parenting plan with decent time with the kids and a minimal amount of conditions. I would have to attend a ten-hour parenting class (so would my ex) and sixteen hours of anger management, and there would be no supervised visitation following the parenting class. There was only one catch — I would be imputed with income I didn’t have and pay more child support than I could afford. Thinking of the alternative, which could mean six months of an expensive domestic violence program that would mark me as admitting guilt for something I never did and possibly compromise my parenting time permanently, I signed. After all was said and done, in one of the strangest and most unexpected incidents of the entire affair, my ex’s attorney actually called and offered something like an apology — she said, in a roundabout way, that the CPS and police calls weren’t her idea. I really have no idea what prompted this, but I can only imagine my former attorney must have said something to her about playing dirty.

Of course, being broke and unemployed, it didn’t take long for arrears to start to build, and it took me some time before I could start paying in full, by which time I was already months behind. My meager bank accounts were seized in the dead of night, I have been threatened by the child support agency, and my credit was reported to all national agencies. There’s a hold on passport renewal with the State Department, my tax returns are subject to seizure, and I could be jailed or have my licenses seized at any time. Given that I am also paying off student loans, becoming “current” will be a rather painful process. Although it’s not a pleasant place to be, at least I know that I am merely one of millions in the same situation, and many have it a lot worse than I do.

Yes, it sounds like an awful mistake, but to me, the time with my kids was worth it. They can throw me in jail, make a pariah out of me, or proclaim me a worthless deadbeat to the entire world, but I am not in the least bit ashamed — my conscience is clear.

However, I still want young men to learn from my own travails. Never go into marriage or fatherhood without being fully aware of the risks they entail. Never look at a young, willing woman without a critical eye, and always be prepared for the worst. And, if you should ever find yourself in this position, don’t lose faith or despair — they can take all your worldly possessions, your children, and even your freedom, but they can never make it right, and there are such things as honor and goodness in the world. Believe it, for yourself and your kids if for nobody else.

{ 123 comments… read them below or add one }

AfOR October 26, 2011 at 05:13

Feel for you Bill.

My ex accused me of raping her, for ten years, beating her, controlling her, threatening to kill her, of, and wanting to fuck my own kids.

Nothing these filthy lying whores won’t stoop to, nothing the parasites who make a living in the family court / child welfare arena will censure, as it all adds to billable hours, and like you, the filthy lying whores are never ever prosecuted even when caught out in bare faced lies.

“child maintenance” is a bullet you can dodge in the UK, earnings are attched at source, so just sign on the dole and fuck them all, no jail time for non payment, besides after all the accusations and rape arrests, despite no charges, you always fail the CRB checks so who would employ you.

Take a page out of the Evil Penis’s book, GTFO and don’t look back.

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M. Radford October 26, 2011 at 05:15

That’s one of the worst cases I have ever read. I went through a similar situation and you are right. The time spent with your kids is worth it all.
I still remember fixing pancakes for my kids the first weekend I had them after been separated from them for a year and a half. No matter what befalls you in this life, you have to insist on being a part of their life and let them know you love them and want to be there for them, even if you can’t sometimes.

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Koanic October 26, 2011 at 05:30

Evil cannot survive if men refuse to serve it, whatever the price.

Your willing slavery perpetuates an evil system.

Children are replaceable. Women are interchangeable. Honor is neither.

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Koanic October 26, 2011 at 05:31

Are my words too strong? Am I a psychopathic monster?

You’ll find Jesus Christ said something similar…

Let the dead bury their own dead.

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west_coast October 26, 2011 at 05:34

It`s a wonder all this is now “normal”. The police donot even charge when a false claim is made they just decline, like a lawyer would. If I were you I would say screw the child support and relocate.

Look at it this way, if your ex stays in BS for some time it might be enough time for your kids to start resenting you if for nothing else then for feeling abandonmet. So you end up working 12+ hours a day to meet all these payments and stay afloat. They will take away your passport, driving license, mess up your credit (here), etc and what do you get if and when you pay up? A resentful bunch of kids, an ex who will hold you in contempt and a society who shuns you because you were once “deadbeat”. Add the student loan bubble and you see the entrapments life has become.

What I am saying is, you seem strong enough, just make that one final leap and take charge by relocating. Child support laws are not basis for extradiction processes (yet!).

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MWPeak October 26, 2011 at 05:42

Although it’s not a pleasant place to be, at least I know that I am merely one of millions in the same situation, and many have it a lot worse than I do.

That is the great elephant in the American living room.

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CorkyAgain October 26, 2011 at 06:08

@ west_coast

As someone who paid $2000+/month CS for 15 years, let me tell you, the temptation to chuck it all and emigrate to a friendlier country is very strong indeed. But I suspect Bill is the same as I was: not ready to cut the remaining ties to his children. Unless he somehow gets custody, he can’t escape the CS obligation without sacrificing his already limited contact with his children — and that’s just too high a price to bear. (Fathers do love their children!)

… and I’m sure his ex knows that it’s a leash she’ll be able to jerk him around with for years to come.

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Anonymous Reader October 26, 2011 at 06:22

This is the sort of truth telling that traditionalist conservatives and social conservatives cannot abide. It’s “evil” to advise men of the very real risks in marriage 2.0, according to a certain gedankenhausfrau. An Australian we all know would offer you a morsel of sympathy, and then tell you how great his life is & that somehow it will all work out in the end, although he has no clue how. Bill Bennett and others would likely just tell you to “man up”, ignoring the fact that your course of action was indeed an honorable and manly thing to do.

The tradcons/socons just don’t get it. Probably because they are operating under the same “men bad, women good” mental script as the feminists, except with a few different labels. “Women moral/civilizing influence, men immoral / useful beast of burden”. That’s why they are unreliable allies at best.

Thanks for posting this soul-baring text, Welmer. As painful as it must be for you to relive this by recounting it, surely it will be helpful to some other man, maybe in the not too distant future.

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Poiuyt October 26, 2011 at 06:27

“Quoting Welmer – “”It got to the point where I had episodes of dissociation — all of the sudden I’d feel as though nothing around me was real””

You got that too? Welcome home to the guignol bro … You’ll be reliving that unending trauma over and over for years in your mind, trying to figure out a rational reason for any of this cruelty and madness. But you’re amongst the lukkier men Welmer, I kid you not.

Other men for nothing, wind up in jail without a trial in similar circumstances, literally having to fight daily to stay alive. Firepower mistakenly believes that not all men end up like that. But that’s what the genderist system plans for you.

Even more unreal is when you are the one working slave hours, isolated from the children, whom were taken away along with their lying abusive mom,when she made her pre-planed violence allagations, and SWAT TEAM took them all to destinations unkown. And from there, multipple court cases were instituted in your absence, determining the future of your kids, apportioning your incomes, your houses and your pensions as hers.

Did you know the earning man is made responsible for the womans court costs, her lawyers costs, the petitions costs, the custody evaluators costs, the family court assessors costs, the supervised visitation centres costs, the child and wifes alimoney and maintenance costs, plus his own lawyers costs. And this is all the while the mans very ability and opportunity to get to work to earn monies to defray these said costs are deliberately being undermined by the plethora of said pervert-professionals and rent seekers whom produce absolutely nothing but misery for all involved … even the woman herself.

And people are surprised Anglo-Euro-American gendertopias are less and less able to find enough men to generate the necessary economic growth opportunities to trade their way out of their imeasurable and crippling indebtedness. An indebtedness that was primarily acquired to build and finance gendertopias sexist-genderist machine, employing all the above professional illusionists and rent seekers whom produce absolutely nothing except so much misery and trauma to men, fathers and children.

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Peter October 26, 2011 at 06:31

… and I’m sure his ex knows that it’s a leash she’ll be able to jerk him around with for years to come.

From Price’s tale, she’s really quite devious. She probably generously offered the unrealistic child support payment plan knowing she would be moving her kids to another country with the other guy. Then when Price inevitably fell behind on payments, his passport would not be renewed. I’m not sure how it is in Washington state, but I researched child support arrears in Ontario, Canada, and seizure of one’s passport is standard operating procedure.

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Tom Smith October 26, 2011 at 06:34

The problem is that the enforcement of these laws do not apply equally to men and women. If you have a “swinging dick” on you, the people (i.e. the state workers) who are responsible for pursuing the arrears will stop at nothing to force a man to pay. They will suspend his professional licenses, his driver’s license, and take arrears out of any meager check he pulls in (how this is calculated to collect the money is beyond me). If he is not working, they will force him to provide a “job diary” of at least 5 paper applications per week (who knows how this works now that most job applications are done over the internet?)

Comparatively, if you are a woman, and your claim that you are disabled is ruled by the courts to be frivolous, you will still not be forced to pay. Also the support authorities will either 1) not seek to jail you for contempt; or 2) will recommend house arrest instead of jail for a woman (as if that has any deterrent effect).

I am shocked that in the state where I work the minimum child support is 50 dollars per child. This is reasonable if it is ordered for either sex. This is particularly true, if in spite of consistent job applications, no work can be obtained. However, for men, what is done is income is imputed at the “prevailing wage” which creates a situation where a man gets in arrears, and cannot get out. Not the same for women, who are routinely allowed to pay 50 per child if the man has custody even if THE WOMAN HAS MADE NO EFFORT TO APPLY FOR WORK (in spite of not having a disability).

Men, be warned. Make sure you know what you’re doing when 1) you decide to have a child with an unwed mother; 2) you decide to get married and have children; or 3) you decide to have unprotected sex with someone who claims she’s “on the pill.”

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Rocco October 26, 2011 at 07:06

I am going through something similar currently.

Since men have been getting better results in family court cases, as we saw in Washinton state I believe it was, accusations of abuse rise.

Our viking warrior women will stop at nothing to get that prize they hate so much they write more blogs about why it’s ok to be a hard put they are raising children with day care and tutors…basically about guilt free shitty moms than any other subject other than why it’s actually healthy to be a big fat chocoholic.

So, if our women don’t want to reproduce what can we do……they’re not saying no sex.

But I wouldn’t go down on them if I were you and the storing sperm thing is your safest form of birth control.

Young men: Success

Hot debate. What do you think? Thumb up 17 Thumb down 4
Rocco October 26, 2011 at 07:09

I meant to say at the end:

Young men need to define success in their own way. For me it’s writing great musis with my 20 year old Thai girlfriend of the weak….if you must mate with americow remember….it was your choice.

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Avenger October 26, 2011 at 07:23

my ex’s attorney actually called and offered something like an apology — she said, in a roundabout way, that the CPS and police calls weren’t her idea. I really have no idea what prompted this

It’s obvious that she thought you’d make a complaint with State Licensing and the Bar assoc. Lawyrs are also officers of the court which means it involves the gov’t which means that you could sue her in Federal Court (take it out of the local jurisdiction) for conspiracy to violate your civil rights. Of course it would be a civil cases for damages but I’d also go to the US Attorney’s office for your area and file another complaint against her and demand that she be investigated for a crimianl conspiracy to violate your civil rights. The hag mother doesn’t understand either that when she involved CPS, a gov’t agency, that you could have also turned that into a Federal case if you sued her and the agency.
It’s easy to see what happened in this case. Ignorance of the law and procedure, lack of funds and being overly concerned about seeing your kids but in the ned you lost them anyway. Sure, you can go see them now but what if she gets it in to her head that she doesn’t want to let you see them in Canada? What do you do then?
I won’t give you any advice on here because you were foolish enough to use your actual name and your former wife knows of your site. It would all be perfectly legal but it’s never a good idea to let people know what you’re doing.

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duke October 26, 2011 at 07:23

This shows why a man should never get married or have children.The legal system is extremely biased against men and nobody cares.The only solution is to opt out.Fortunately with the impending bankrupty of state goverments the system won’t be around much longer.

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Mgtow October 26, 2011 at 07:50

I am a man in my 20s and avoid AW at all costs. They are useless and disgusting. I predict that, give or take 20 years, the women themselves will beg for marriage/divorce laws to change because NO MAN will be willing to marry. I think that possibly the last (but also somwhat risky) way to avoid becoming an indentured servant to a fat cow is to not marry and not sign the birt certificate. It should all go back to the caveman days: the cunt only gets your support until she is with you and giving you sex. As soon as she wants to take off with the next biker boyfriend, she gets NOTHING. So if you dont marry and dont sign, the only way she could hook you is by going through court and paying fees to order a paternity test. Given the state of the economy and Lily Manhater’s shopping habits, most of these skanks don’t even have $500 in their bank account. Let me know your thoughts.

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Taxi Driver October 26, 2011 at 08:09
Beltain October 26, 2011 at 08:09

First off there needs to be some sort of penalty for false accusations and this shit would stop. Penalties not only for the hatred obsessed wives but also the enabling lawyers.

Like you I was surprise attacked and gutted even lost my job through similar manipulative tricks by the ex. Then when I got a new job quickly, the state CSE agency could never get their act together and take the money out. I sent in two payments and never even got credit for paying but I did have the money order receipts. I finally just opened an account and placed the money there and when I quickly got to about 4K in arrears sure as shit they came and drug me out of bed and charged me with felony non-support. What saved me from going to prison were the receipts and the lump payment I gave the courts.

Here’s the rub. I went back to court and got custody and the ex avoided being served with papers for three years then of course an individual cannot go after support until the party is served and the state won’t bother unless you have been on welfare support, another words something women do much more often than men. Even after all this the ex is still well over 24K in arrears and…… NOTHING not one damned thing is done. The Pussy Pass is alive and well in Missouri that’s for sure.

Don’t give up hope in todays world these women will give up on their children at some point usually if you are ready to step in perhaps you can turn the tables on her. It worked for me.

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Alcuin October 26, 2011 at 08:11

The Almighty Pussy is just not worth it.

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nugganu October 26, 2011 at 08:11

I’m in arrears for child support because I’ve spent 12 grand on a lawyer trying to get a paternity agreement in place, but the mother and her family keep asking for outlandish things. Even though my child’s mother is now living with another man, they are demanding 300 grand life insurance in her name, and that I pay for a lavish montesori education even though I had no say in putting my child there, even though I haven’t even got my name on my child’s birth certificate and only get to see my child 8 hours a week.

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Trenton October 26, 2011 at 08:12

Get out of the country! These heartless barron robbers are robbing you blind. ‘Might’ really does make right, especially when the Byzantine-like family policies are enforced by jack booted thugs armed to the teeth with military calibre weapons. America has been a police state for a long time, when you get slapped with one of these feminazi extortion orders, you don’t lie down and surrender, what you should do is get out of the country by any means necessary and then wave your middle finger at them as you’re leaving the shores of America.

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Rocco October 26, 2011 at 08:41

The pussy is so valuable people without them dress up and pretend to be them…I’m not anti-transexaul at all but the secondary gain is obvious, the draw is huge and the feminists totally see it as male encroachment on their whole victim status culture thing.

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A Lonely Dad October 26, 2011 at 08:47

Most states, READ ALL !!, have as part of their Constitutions a clause that says you have the right to an attorney, even in civil matters. This is also part the United States Constitution. How this traditionally has been interrpreted is that the MAN pays for the barefoot and pregnant wife’s attorney. Now when the tables are turned, wifey has the $$$$$$$$$$, the courts conveinently forget about “stare decisis” , their own laws, and the Constitution, and leave the man hanging, violating his Constitutional Rights!!!!!!

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Mirco Romanato October 26, 2011 at 09:32

I would:
1) Plan to relocate
2) Plan what to say to the children about it:
“dear children of mine, these are the reasons I relocate. If you want, my new home is open for you when you want come. I will never be able to come here again, unless I risk to land in jail for a very long time. Thank your mother for all of this mess. With Love.”
3) Relocate.
4) When you are able and willing, send money to your children (not to their cow mother), so if she object to this, she must take the money from ther hands.
5) Wait until they are over 18 and invite them home.

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Rebel October 26, 2011 at 09:38

From where I stand, the U.S. has become a replica of the USSR.
Only some words are different: Gulag becomes Fema.

If everything I read here is true, and I don’t have any reason to doubt it, then I don’t understand why men insist on “living” there.

A beautiful country, no doubt, but Hell on Earth for sure. I would advise to get out of Siberia.

Welmer, I am sorry for the rotten treatment you received.
I know a couple of fathers who may somehow be described as “deadbeat”. Their kids are over 18 and…. they live with their fathers: they left the mothers and no longer speak to them.

And now, there’s feck all the mothers can do.

Patience.

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HeligKo October 26, 2011 at 09:55

I read these stories, and they terrify me. I am coming out of a 14 year marriage. I keep hoping that the longer I wait for divorce the better the laws get, or the courts, and that we have some solid patterns with the kids established. Thankfully she wants freedom, so having the kids full time would wreck that. I can only hope she doesn’t decide to use them against me.

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Traveller October 26, 2011 at 10:02

Admiration for your strength and your courage.

The situation will solve in itself, with less and less men willing to marry or to have a long term relationship with any Western woman.

They will fight with nails and teeth, but in the end what you said is right, with a man’s conscience even if they put us in jail we will not break. And we will not produce anything more, in the sight of an easy confiscation.

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keyster October 26, 2011 at 10:23

My brother, who is a lawyer in Calif., went through very similar gyrations. He had a panic attack and drove himself to the hospital thinking it was a heart attack. His ex-wife’s vicious lesbian lawyer had her accuse him of abusing his son, and he had to go through what you did, (short of a SWAT incident).

That’s what needs to be emphasized here; this scenerio is more common than people think. The media won’t report on it, academics won’t study it, but it’s a multi-million dollar industry. The BIASED resources that an ex-wife has at her disposal and uses without a conscience to fight “the war” against a shell-shocked man is almost unlimited.

Most people have no idea this happens, or that it just happens to “other people”. And even if it doesn’t happen she dangles the threat of it over your head like the Sword of Damocles to manipulate you and get what she wants in the relationship. Keep the Queen happy or ELSE!

Amazingly, men are STILL marching head first into a legally binding contract with a woman, under enforcement by the state, as if “she’s different, she’d never do that to me, we’re in love, our relationship is unique and therefore impervious to the horrors of lawyers, courts, state agencies and other nasty little legalities, she’d never do that to me, cause she’s not like that”. Sure friend, keep on believing, and get back to me if you feel the same way 5 years from now.

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keyster October 26, 2011 at 10:30

“I can only hope she doesn’t decide to use them against me.”

If she hasn’t planned on doing just that already, you can rest assure her lawyer will advise her to. Using the children to “stack” the charges gives her a better chance of coming out the victor. If her lawyer is any good, it’s bound to happen.

DOCUMENT EVERYTHING!

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AntZ October 26, 2011 at 10:36

@Price

All I can tell you is:
1) My mother did similar things to my father 35 years ago, also under the tutelage of lesbian feminists
2) My mother’s four children learned the truth after we became adults.
3) None of us forgive, none of us forget, and none of us respect my mother.
4) My mother’s four children rarely speak with her and we never call her.

Also,

5) All four brothers have a close and warm relationship with our father.

At first, my father felt he would never see justice:
* He did NOT win (he lost every battle, and finally he lost the war).
* He did NOT tell us the truth (we found out on our own).

The only thing he had to do was:
* He fought for us, and we always knew it.

FIGHT. FIGHT TO THE END. FIGHT FOR YOUR CHILDREN, ESPECIALLY BECAUSE YOU KNOW YOU CANNOT WIN.

Your children will know that you fought against the feminist courts, you fought against lies, you fought against the odds and you did it all FOR THEM.

When they look at their mother, they will feel nothing but loathing and disgust.

Also, if you want, send this message to your ex wife. She should know that her children, 30 years from now, will learn who she really is by the things she has done. They will loath her and avoid her. She will be alone and forgotten. And she will know that she deserves it.

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Izzey October 26, 2011 at 10:38

I do not know one single woman that has been put through this.
I am very sorry to read the disheartening veracity of your situation.

I hope someday your children will know exactly what you went through for them. It is important that one day they know. Hopefully, neither will have to go through it themselves.

Do another fundraiser.
I’ll contribute.

Izzey

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AntZ October 26, 2011 at 10:40

@HeligKo

“Thankfully she wants freedom, so having the kids full time would wreck that. I can only hope she doesn’t decide to use them against me.”

Get full physical custody of your children. You cannot win in court, so offer her anything she wants. Tell her she does not have to pay any child support, and offer her any property and money you can.

Get your children. Let her have her freedom, and all the money and property that you can spare. Once she is gone you can focus on raising your children and rebuilding your life.

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John Hembling October 26, 2011 at 10:41

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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Norm October 26, 2011 at 10:50

Is your ex’s new husband paying child support to his ex wife? He cheated on her so it’s only fair that he goes through what your ex put you through. It would be nice for your ex to see what you went through.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 10 Thumb down 2
Opus October 26, 2011 at 11:00

@W.F.

That is a terrible story. I have never (professionally or otherwise) come across anything like it, so I must either conclude you have been very unlucky (NAWALT) or things are different in the State of Washington. I suspect the former.

My sympathy however rests not with you, but with your ex’s new partner. Either he thinks you are a very bad man, or he is seriously deluded about your ex – and who in their right mind, would want to take on the responsibility for another man’s wife and children? In my view, if he wants her, then he should pay for the children too. Having said that, in earlier times (though unofficially) men would sell their wife to an interested man, indeed I had one client tell me that he had approached his paramour’s husband and formally asked him if he would relinquish his wife to live with him. The deal was done. Perhaps such a system should be formally introduced into the U.S.A. It might save a lot of grief.

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W.F. Price October 26, 2011 at 11:06

That is a terrible story. I have never (professionally or otherwise) come across anything like it, so I must either conclude you have been very unlucky (NAWALT) or things are different in the State of Washington. I suspect the former.

-Opus

I’m afraid it’s the latter, Opus. I’m sure my case was bad, but it’s far from unique. You see, most men simply never talk about this stuff — especially not in a public forum. I know several men personally who have gone through something similar.

My real reason for posting this story is to encourage men to stop feeling ashamed and afraid — in so many cases there’s nothing they could have done, and when they know that they are not alone things will start to change.

Firepower October 26, 2011 at 11:08

Poiuyt

Other men for nothing, wind up in jail without a trial in similar circumstances, literally having to fight daily to stay alive. Firepower mistakenly believes that not all men end up like that. But that’s what the genderist system plans for you.

There you go, talking about me, trying to get welmer all mad at me. Make me the Bad Guy, when it’s others who seek to make their mark by challenging the Gunfighter Logic King.

If asked nice – I’m willing to share my experience.

You don’t know what I think about this issue – because I haven’t bothered to comment on it here, yet.

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oddsock October 26, 2011 at 11:17

Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.

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Frost October 26, 2011 at 11:22

Very similar to what happened to my family when I was ~10. Except, my father had came from an incredibly happy and stable family and so was completely naive.

When your kids are older, they will understand. My father is my greatest hero and I have absolutely no relationship with my mother, despite her repeated attempts to create one. My younger brother and sister feel the same way.

My Dad went through a lot of hard years. But now he gets to grow old with three happy and successful kids who love him and cherish him, make time to see him as much as possible, and think the world of him.

Cheers,

Frost

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Tom936 October 26, 2011 at 11:31

The CASA worker a grad school volunteer decided to err on the side of caution, and before the CPS agent finished the investigation (she had a deadline) recommended I attend a domestic violence course for six months (typically reserved for convicted offenders) which would cost me thousands of dollars, and have supervised visitation of my children until its completion, which meant that I wouldn t see them for all that time in any event, since I had no family to stay with me at the time.

They call that “erring on the side of caution”. It shows just how little men count for in their eyes. “Let’s massively violate his rights – it’s the safe thing to do”. Geez!

It is appalling what they put you through and it makes my blood boil. Thank you for breaking the silence.

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Robert October 26, 2011 at 11:32

AntZ October 26, 2011 at 10:40
@HeligKo

“Thankfully she wants freedom, so having the kids full time would wreck that. I can only hope she doesn’t decide to use them against me.”

Get full physical custody of your children. You cannot win in court, so offer her anything she wants. Tell her she does not have to pay any child support, and offer her any property and money you can.

Get your children. Let her have her freedom, and all the money and property that you can spare. Once she is gone you can focus on raising your children and rebuilding your life.

This is both; what feminists and their ilk want. They will reap what they have sown……….Sooon.

John Hembling October 26, 2011 at 10:41
I remember when this website opened up…2009 I believe. That’s when the shit must have been hitting the fan for Welmer.

Well, it’s half way done now. Divorces take something like eight years to unravel and settle down.

You’ve learned your lesson, and now you know you don’t need a wife or a family. You can survive just fine on your own.

The good thing I’ve noticed is you don’t sound like an ‘angry mra’. This is a good thing. Hating women and being a misogynist is no way to go through life. Take a look at Manuel Dexter, you don’t want to be like that nutbar. Or Elam, either.

What do you have against Mr. Paul Elam? Mr. Price has the right to be angry. Are you trying to derail this thread? ALL MEN ARE ENTITLED TO GET/BE ANGRY………WE POSSESS PURE HUMAN NATURE/WE ARE HUMAN BEINGS!

Men need to recognize and remember all shit tests they are subjigated/subjected to. Women/womyn do. This IS a key to success. To mate and have children is part of the male biological imperative/nature. Remember; feminism has perverted/redifined human nature. They ARE the keys to the “state” gaining total control of human “resources”. Are there any feminists who care to prove me wrong?

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djc October 26, 2011 at 11:33

Mine went very well. All 3 kids were over 18. She took some of the furniture, and I got the house after a refinance and paying her 1/2 what it was worth. I consider myself EXTREMELY lucky. And will never put myself into that situation again. Not only will I never marry again, but I don’t even want a relationship with an any woman in the US. None are worth the effort.

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Taank October 26, 2011 at 11:34

Firepower, would you please share your experiences with us? I think, given Welmer’s bravery in starting the topic, that we should gather as many perspectives and stories as we can.

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Robert October 26, 2011 at 11:34

They shall reap what they have sown!

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AfOR October 26, 2011 at 11:35

Amen oddsock.

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Izzey October 26, 2011 at 11:38

@oddsock
“Buy favour” ?

Wow, did not know parting with my hard earned money would be construed that way.

What’s bugging you oddsock?
Spit it out.

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Robert October 26, 2011 at 11:38

John Hembling October 26, 2011 at 10:41

What lesson is Mr. Price supposed to have learned? How will such a “lesson” benefit him in the future?

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Robert October 26, 2011 at 11:43

W.F. Price October 26, 2011 at 11:06

In a battle for surpremacy; who do you think will win; Good or evil?

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oddsock October 26, 2011 at 11:44

Nothings “bugging me” Izzy. I simply don’t trust you and I do not believe any of your stories. I do perhaps get a little frustrated with men that should know better and despite all they have read and (should ) have learned, fall for your bull shite.

As for yourself Izzy, I dont care.

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Izzey October 26, 2011 at 12:00

I’m real sorry to hear that, oddsock.
Saddened, really.

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oddsock October 26, 2011 at 12:06

I’m not surprised with your response, Izzey.
My heart bleeds, really.

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Rocco October 26, 2011 at 12:24

Stop arguing with Izzy oddsock this isn’t Saturday night 8pm and she aint giving you any, arguments like that are why we’re still unmarried.

And why I support that this should not be a place where women come to debate and derail men who are going through a well planned mass psychological torture thought up by the lesbianic arm of the psychology establishment.

I fully agree. My ex confirred with a feminist psychologist and it was this psychologist that gave my ex her instructions that has now pretty much destroyed our son psychologically.

Welmer time is passing but don’t be surprised if she turns them against you no matter what.

If you don’t think they know exactly what happened with the false accusations I think your wrong.

As a guy who really put himself in the trenches I can tell you they know it all by age 3. Then they start using it to manipulate you and further worsen the situation for immature gain.

When this group grows up it will be a very very litigous society indeed.

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AfOR October 26, 2011 at 12:44

Oh yeah, you can expect a petition from your skank ho ex to have the kids surname changed too, that is the latest tactic that is undergoing a dramatic rise.

The purpose of course is to needle you into doing something that can be used against you.

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Izzey October 26, 2011 at 12:49

I’ll formally bow out of the conversations here from now on.
My apologies to all.

You do not need me to upset the apple cart. I respect what takes place here. But I can’t promise you I won’t be reading.

@oddsock–your beef is not with me.
@Welmer–My word is good. I will send another check. I have no strings attached to that. I never have. Good luck to you.

Izzey

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Anonymous October 26, 2011 at 12:58

Right now, and for some time to come, feminism and the plight of men is the talk of the day. But there may come a time when more pressing issues will manifest and draw all our attention.

Many people, specially in the U.S. are preparing for a shit wave (what we call SHTF).

http://www.pakalertpress.com/2011/10/26/the-prepper-movement-why-are-millions-of-preppers-preparing-feverishly-for-the-end-of-the-world-as-we-know-it/

Lots of changes, not all of them good, may hit us and hit us hard.

This makes it even more urgent for young, unmarried guys to open their eyes and to protect themselves from predatory females. (oh, yes they will become more predatory when they will face the ugly situation).

If you think women are bad now, then wait for the shit to hit the fan real hard and you will see irate women wanting to emasculate you because they think YOU caused the problems. And don’t tell me they won’t: they have already begun.

Be ready for false accusations galore. (a small hidden camera might help you). Expect demands that will put a heavy burden on you, such as a 10% man tax.
A sixteen year old boy told me last week that at his school, they are told that women must be treated as if they were the most precious thing on earth. Already, boys are told to worship women and be their servants.

You may also be forced to marry against you will, only to accept a devastating divorce.

Things are gonna get rough.

The women of today are not the women of yesteryear: they are a lot more like men now.

Sometimes worse.

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Somehow Somewhat October 26, 2011 at 12:59

Strongly recommend “The Manipulated Man” book. Eye-opener as to women. It was written by women.

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oddsock October 26, 2011 at 13:20

AfOR

Oh, yes, I had that one tried on me. The name change etc and that was quite some time ago. The part that always makes my shit itch the most is there is always a supporting white knight mangina in the background. Many are quite good at giving the impression of an Alpha male. Don’t be fooled. They are 100% sure NAWALT. Feckin idiots.

A couple of things to consider, at least here in the UK. A woman can change the surname of a child on a birth certificate with much ease and there is little a man can do about it. If you are unmarried there is practically nothing you can do. The woman can put any name she wants on the birth cert.

A few years ago there was a government drive to get unmarried fathers to have their surname entered onto the birth certificate. It was sold as being the right thing to do for the kids and family etc etc. In reality, it was nothing more than the government trying to get child support from the “named” father on the birth cert.

You see, there are that many single mothers that (a) have no idea who the real father is (b) do not want the real father named, usually because she has moved on and (thinks) she has hooked a provider. (c) simply has no desire for the real father to be involved, which is made much easier simply by not adding the real fathers surname on the birth cert.

Mr Price. I admire you and your stance. I have no doubt whatsoever, your views on women will change dramatically. Perhaps rapidly ? Perhaps over the years ? But change they will. Further, you will, if not already, start to feel animosity towards a lot of guys you meet in everyday life. At some point you will no longer be able to ignore men that now just seem to ooze manginadom. They are, perhaps, your biggest irritation and barrier. They are always and I do mean always ready to sell his brothers nads to the nearest female in hope of some praise they crave so much.

I strongly suggest that what you are going through is part and parcel of regaining your sanity and masculinity. Don’t waste your time trying to get women and other men that have never been through this to understand. They can’t. Simple as that !

Early days yet mate, early days.

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Jim October 26, 2011 at 13:28

I knew a guy I worked with that was working 1000 hours overtime a year just to live. 45 dollars an hour. You do the math to figure out how much he was paying in child support/alimony.

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W.F. Price October 26, 2011 at 13:33

I strongly suggest that what you are going through is part and parcel of regaining your sanity and masculinity. Don’t waste your time trying to get women and other men that have never been through this to understand. They can’t. Simple as that !

Oddsock

No, I don’t think they would ever understand what it’s like, but there’s a benefit to that. I can look at the situation with some philosophical detachment, believe it or not, but I don’t think those who haven’t experienced it can. In fact, I don’t want them to — ordinarily people should be shocked and revolted by it. Only that kind of feeling will prompt any change.

oddsock October 26, 2011 at 13:36

Izzey

If you are going to feckin donate just feckin donate. Dont make a feckin song and dance about it for fecks sake.

Your special! Just like every fecker else !

And yes I do have a beef with you. You’re a woman, therefore I don’t trust you. Even your recent posts you tried to use emotional manipulation to bring out the white knights. If you can’t see that then you will continue to get short change from myself and no doubt a few others. ( but only a few)

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Davd October 26, 2011 at 13:46

You’re invited for a 3-6 month retreat, details to be worked out by e-mail, renewable by mutual agreement; and if you have a better option i won’t be offended.

It will probably be a few hours before i send the suggested details because it’s late afternoon and there is outdoor work to do.

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oddsock October 26, 2011 at 13:48

Davd

Any sheep at this retreat ?

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AfOR October 26, 2011 at 14:03

@ oddsock

I ran across you on your last vacation…..

the sweet young thing down by the water on the left obviously recognised you….

http://wimminz.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/slapo12.jpg?w=600&h=450

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oddsock October 26, 2011 at 14:13

AfOR

Hahahaha feckin brilliant !

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The Dude October 26, 2011 at 14:31

Stories like these have helped me. I no longer plan on getting married. Why, when the risk is so great? Why, when if it falls apart, I’m the one who will will get screwed? Sorry, but a woman can get a relationship out of me, and maybe even a kid, but no marriage, no way.

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Things Are Bad October 26, 2011 at 14:35

I came up with a poem.

oddsock

sucks cock

(Not that there’s anything wrong with that.)

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Ted October 26, 2011 at 15:17

@AntZ October 26, 2011 at 10:36

” FIGHT TO THE END. FIGHT FOR YOUR CHILDREN, ESPECIALLY BECAUSE YOU KNOW YOU CANNOT WIN.”

If you know you can’t win, shouldn’t you try something else?

Such as complete disconnection, as far as you can manage, from the whole situation. Which would include your children. If circumstances changed, and they came to live with you, that would be different; but that’s not how things are.

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unlucky guy October 26, 2011 at 16:16

Guys,

They tried to do all this crap to me but I DIDN’T EVEN HAVE KIDS. They used the same tactics with alimony, trying to use alimony to put me in jail so I couldn’t work.

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Avenger October 26, 2011 at 16:23

@8.11
‘Even though my child’s mother is now living with another man, they are demanding 300 grand life insurance in her name’

I think you meant to say that they’re demanding that you take out a policy and name her as beneficiary. This is so that in the event you die she gets the money you were being forced to pay over the years until the kid is 18.
If a judge tries to force you to do this then just arrange it so that no insurance co. will insure you. Now, if you’re young and the policy is only for $300k you may or may not be required to take a physical by the company’s physician. However, you still have to fill out an application and answer the medical questions. You can make yourself look like such a bad risk that the company won’t insure you :)
If you have to take a physical make sure that you take up smoking (or chew some nictoine gum etc)so that if you have to give a urine and blood sample it will show up as cotinine and they’ll know your’re a smoker. I’d also prick my finger and add a drop of blood to that urine sample :) Take some amphetemine too so it looks like you have hypertension when they take your BP.

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TERRY October 26, 2011 at 16:56

Mr. Price,

WF PRICE= Welmer?? right?? I’m going to assume YES!!

If you are the same guy as Welmer , then you’re the guy that wrote the iconic “Mens Liberation” This piece and the position it advocates has got to be the starting point for any future
action(s) on your part. When contemplating what to do in the situation that you are in, this has to be the starting point.

You see here’s the problem that no one seems to want to acknowledge.The whole system you have described , and which we all acknowledge, is one of MASS TORTURE AND MURDER. That’s right
,I said it. MASS TORTURE AND MURDER.
First off, we’ll start with a little SLAVERY first just to get
the ball rolling. Slip up JUST ONCE, and we’ll send the blue caps (secret police, ref Solzhenitsyn) out to kidnap (“arrest”)
you and then we’ll have a little kangaroo court debtors prison bullshit meeting . Where we’ll throw you in a cage for a year or two, maybe throw in some prison rape. HA HA HA !! Prison
rape is really funny, ha ha ha , let’s all laff while you take
it up the ass. Then, we’ll let you out for a while, the way a cat toys with a mouse, but, of course, the arrears keep building up, then it’s back to prison, more rape, it’s funny
prison rape, HAH HA HAH!! prison rape is funny. Meantime
a hell bound whore is raising your children to hate you, YOU FUCKING DEADBEAT. SOONER OR LATER YOU WIND UP UNDER A BRIDGE
where YOU DIE, prematurely at 50 or so. Prematurely, get it ??
THAT’S WHERE THE MURDER PART OF THE PROGRAM COMES IN.
I promise you and everybody reading this that we got a little
surprise for the hell bound whore a little coward and thief
and her satanic enablers. Know what it’s called ???
IT’S CALLED THE LAKE OF FIRE. First of all, as it is written,
“FOR WE KNOW THAT NO MURDERER HAS ETERNAL LIFE IN HIM ” (NIV)
And i promise the the LAKE OF FIRE is FOREVER.

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CorkyAgain October 26, 2011 at 17:47

@ Avenger

Your scheme to make yourself uninsurable will backfire. The insurance company will still insure you despite your “existing” medical condition. All they will do is raise your premiums.

Your evil ex (and most FC judges) don’t care how much you have to pay, and they won’t let you off the hook simply because the premiums are too high.

You’d be screwing yourself, not her.

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3DShooter October 26, 2011 at 18:29

@Welmer

I don’t know you personally, only through your writing. YOU ARE NOT a deadbeat dad. You are a loving, caring father being persecuted by a corrupt kangaroo family kourt system and it’s gold digging whore. Don’t ever call yourself a deadbeat.

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nugganu October 26, 2011 at 18:35

I’d be interested in what adjectives you gents would use to describe a man who moves in with, gets engaged to, and then marries, a woman who gave birth to another man’s child only 7 months before, and who himself has a child with another woman, 1 month younger.

If that isn’t one of the most effed up situations, then I don’t know what is, but alas, that is my life.

Myself, I like to call him, ‘cuckold mangina douchebag….

Tonight I heard my child call him ‘dada’. I honestly hope that some dude moves in on the mother of his child so he knows how that feels.

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nugganu October 26, 2011 at 18:42

Avenger – thanks for the advice. As I understand it, they can’t make me take out a life insurance naming her as the sole beneficiary. Even if I am legally named the child’s father, which I have not been. I was never married to her nor did I co-habitate i a common-law relationship. The fact that she lives in a common law relationship with another man also comes into play.

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BC Dad October 26, 2011 at 18:54

I’m been through a similar scenario, have survived almost 5 years (my son is now 10), but after the latest court battle, CS has been ordered on an imputed income I don’t have, and I’ve recognized it is time to leave.
I have made sure my kids understand that I’ve fought for them and done my best to be here for them as long as possible. They know who is responsible for the mess. They know what they can do in the future if they want both parents in their lives.
I silence my sorrow and walk away.

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3DShooter October 26, 2011 at 19:02

@nugganu

“I’d be interested in what adjectives you gents would use to describe a man who moves in with, gets engaged to, and then marries, a woman who gave birth to another man’s child only 7 months before, and who himself has a child with another woman, 1 month younger.”

Personally, I’d call him a fool. His fate will be even worse than yours and now he has fallen in with an experienced gold-digger.

As far a the insurance – tell her to put it where the sun doesn’t shine. That is a demand that her attorney is 100% instigating and she won’t get it if you don’t let her.

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Avenger October 26, 2011 at 19:16

A Lonely Dad October 26, 2011 at 08:47

Most states, READ ALL !!, have as part of their Constitutions a clause that says you have the right to an attorney, even in civil matters. This is also part the United States Constitution. How this traditionally has been interrpreted is that the MAN pays for the barefoot and pregnant wife’s attorney

Where is this in the US Constitution or State constitutions? And a man does not have to pay for his wife’s lawyer whether it is a civil or criminal case.
These family court cases where lawyer’s fees are almost always assessed against the man even when the wife initiated the action is likely unconstitutional. I could understand in the past when a man had to sue for divorce from a wife and it was tried based on fault where the man had to prove he had grounds to divorce her;you could also write into the complaint a demand for attorney’s fees if you win. But how can fees be assessed against a man today when divorces are supposed to be no fault? You win the attorney fees in civil lawsuits by proving your case and winning it.

In general, you are not entitled to an appointed lawyer in a civil case although you can file a motion requesting one but it is usually denied.
The only civil matter where you may get a lawyer appointed is for contempt of court since you may be imprisoned and/or fined heavily and over a certain amount.
Family courts are likely not operating within the law because issuing Orders (which a layman may not even understand and can involve imprisonment if violated) without counsel to advise him cannot be lawful. The fact that you can be imprisoned regardless of the fact that it’s a civil matter and not a crime means that you’re entitled to an appointed lawyer if you cannot afford your own. Something doesn’t have to be a crime in order for a person to be entitled to a lawyer and the criteria is if you can be imprisoned if found guilty or if it involves a high fine. People who violate ordinances (not a crime) and the penalty is even 1 day in jail have a right to a lawyer.

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Izzey October 26, 2011 at 19:25

oddsock October 26, 2011 at 13:36
Izzey

If you are going to feckin donate just feckin donate. Dont make a feckin song and dance about it for fecks sake.

Your special! Just like every fecker else !

@oddsock– Since you don’t seem to read into things the way it was inteneded from me, I will leave a parting post for you to explain something.

First, I offered the donation publicly to maybe ‘instigate’ others to do the same. I come from a group of people that have no problem understanding my reasons. When people need some help, maybe someone has to speak up to put the idea in the head of others.

Also,the post you referenced, was to demonstrate that so many women bullshit about a word used so casually, that when someone actually goes through it, and does not use the experience to boil someone’s ass with it, it is a whole nutha ball game.

I think you missed the point of it completely. Maybe I need to explain things with more clarity. I had a reason for its timing as well. If I am to empathize with anyone’s stories here, what do you call me?
Your white knight and mangina remarks were directed at people that have come to know me as a person and an advocate, as well as a friend to a few.

I do not care what you believe. I know my own truths.

“To thine own self be true.”

I’ll continue to read your angry Izzy sheep jokes, and maybe even smile. But these are my very last words here.
Take good care,
Izzey

And yes I do have a beef with you. You’re a woman, therefore I don’t trust you. Even your recent posts you tried to use emotional manipulation to bring out the white knights. If you can’t see that then you will continue to get short change from myself and no doubt a few others. ( but only a few

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nugganu October 26, 2011 at 20:13

Cheers 3DS!

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Anon October 26, 2011 at 20:54

I have been reading MRA stuff for the last few years. Bring in my late 20s, everyone – everyone – around me is getting engaged, married and having kids. I’ve always wanted kids and a wife. I’m dating a younger girl who is going to be making a bit less than me and wants to get married also. What can I do? I don’t want to MGTOW or GTFO. Eastern Europe also isn’t the haven its portrayed to be to raise a family.

I know the risks, and I’m going to take them (with a prenup). It seems that the worst thing are the false accusations. How do you pre-empt that? Maybe when you’re feeling that the divorce is coming, bug your home? This way you’ll have a year of tapes for every fight you’ve ever had – and this is something the court can review.

Have game, never let her walk all over you. And never get “tired” – to go away on weekends, to travel, to get out. Don’t become the typical couple who stays in all weekend. Similar to PUA tactics, when you’re taking her on dates every weekend, she doesn’t have time to bitch about the socks.

Like I said, I know it’s a risk. But the rewards – thinking that maybe – maybe – I can have it… outweighs it all.

However, I do have an out. If I feel I cannot live in this country any more, I can move somewhere else with no extradition treaty and get a job – BEFORE they take away my passport.

Say if I get married and have kids right away… if divorce happens in 15 years… hey, it’s only 3 years.

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Anonymous age 69 October 26, 2011 at 21:01

I call bullshit on those who think Welmer’s experience is either bad luck or a bad state. I supplied no-fee counseling to more than an estimated 1,600 men from 1984 to 1993, in the Midwest. And, his tale is so common it actually becomes boring after while. Your ignorance does not make his case to be an extreme case.

Do y’all understand the passport thing means the last time he will ever see his kids in Canada is when his passport expires? You can be sure his -ex understands this even if he doesn’t.

I do not understand the Great American Wimp. The most ignorant and superstitious plantation slave knew to run to Canada (when Canada was still a refuge for slaves) if he could. Yet, you guys sit here in Hell waiting for God to make a special trip down to save you.

Twenty years ago, I knew a cop in my city who had high child support payments, so he got a second job. His ex- took him back to have his c/s raised to reflect the extra income. So, he got a third job, and she took him back again to raise his payments.

After a time he became physically exhausted from three jobs, and wished to cut back on his hours worked. He was told (and it was true) that no man can voluntarily reduce his income when he owes child support. Seriously.

I encountered an appellate case where a doctor found he he had MS, and was told (he already knew it) that if he did not cut drastically his hours worked, it would kill him. The stupid judge (but I repeat myself) told him he was sorry, but the law made no provisions for a support payer to reduce his hours worked, merely to prolong his life.

Then, there was another appellate case. A doctor (this was maybe 20 years ago) was making like $80,000 a year. His ex- who did not work received the tax deductions, which she could not use. The man simply asked for the tax exemptions, since her support payments were tax exempt. A dissenting justice calculated with his tax burden and no legal dependents he had no more than $300 a month left to support himself on. The other justices yawned and said, no, he did not get the tax exemptions. And, see above, if he finds a way to make more money, his c/s payments go up.

Regan said the USSR was the evil empire. Now, 30 years later, the USSA is the evil empire.

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CorkyAgain October 26, 2011 at 22:06

@ Anonymous age 69

OK, maybe in your mind I am the “Great American Wimp” for staying here in the US where I could at least still have a little time with my children. I’ll own that, and I don’t care what shaming language you use to describe it. I know what it cost me and I’m not ashamed to have paid that price.

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Rad October 26, 2011 at 22:13
Twenty October 26, 2011 at 22:19

My meager bank accounts were seized in the dead of night, I have been threatened by the child support agency, and my credit was reported to all national agencies. There’s a hold on passport renewal with the State Department, my tax returns are subject to seizure, and I could be jailed or have my licenses seized at any time

This is slavery.

I’m sorry for your misfortune. If it makes you feel any better, others have learned from it.

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Avenger October 26, 2011 at 22:25

“child maintenance” is a bullet you can dodge in the UK, earnings are attched at source, so just sign on the dole and fuck them all, no jail time for non payment, besides after all the accusations and rape arrests, despite no charges, you always fail the CRB checks so who would employ you.

You can dodge it in the US too but most of these guys are so worried about not seeing their kids that they go along with anything. They usually end up working themselves to death and living some crappy life in semi poverty and lose the kids anyway. And btw, arrests and even aquitals after trial cna be expunged which means that they will not show up on any records and that you may answer that you have never been arrested. In fact, it would be a misdemeanor if someone ever said you were arrested.

@69-’I encountered an appellate case where a doctor found he he had MS, ‘

He should have given up working entirely and lived on SS disability and any other type of disability income protection insurance policies that many professionals have.
In fact, MS would be an ideal disease to have for disability because it may effect cognitive fuctions and make you unable to do any work. Remember that to get SS disability you must be incapable of doing any work not just be unable to do your regular job which makes “mental” conditions ideal ,otherwise SSD is very difficult to get. There is SSI which is easier to get but there’s a means test which means that you can only have minimal assets but once you have it you’ll also get free medical and go to the top of the list for rent subsidies (people over 65 and disabled get it first) There are probably other perks as well for free stuff. Even people with addictions may qualify because although they may be in excellent physical health, the treatment (taking methadone) makes them unfit for work. You can’t be nodding off all day at any job. At any rate, the wife can get nothing out of all of this because it was involuntary.

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universe October 26, 2011 at 22:31

However, I still want young men to learn from my own travails. Never go into marriage or fatherhood without being fully aware of the risks they entail. Never look at a young, willing woman without a critical eye, and always be prepared for the worst. And, if you should ever find yourself in this position, don’t lose faith or despair — they can take all your worldly possessions, your children, and even your freedom, but they can never make it right, and there are such things as honor and goodness in the world. Believe it, for yourself and your kids if for nobody else.

– Good advice, and especially to those who have just found this site and are unfamiliar with the ways of how current society operates.

Your story was not an easy read. At times infuriating. The ex and her mother! – what possesses one or both to act in those such manners?

However, change the circumstances around a little and what we find is a common tale repeated ad nauseating. I’ve heard enough stories of a similar nature to be in want of bringing an end to these assaults upon the men in this culture and wield the axe of accountability upon those who uncritically participate in those acts of assault. Fortunately it will be words that will start this process but unfortunate in the time that it will take to reach that end.
Given what you’ve been through, W.F., you’ve pulled yourself through with chin up. Good on you.

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Highwasp October 26, 2011 at 23:28

I feel strongly about this dead beat dad BS. 25 years ago I went through very similar experiences and circumstances as Price describes. I was destroyed emotionally, spiritually and financially at the age of 27 . It’s taken me 20 + years to reclaim some measure of self respect and emotional stability and most times I’m doing alright. Other times panic attacks hit, then I feel like I’m dying. Some day soon I hope to be doing great – mostly all the time.

Some of you men talk about walking away as a solution. I did that. I had to abandon my child when she was 5… it was that or commit suicide and / or homicide… I sometimes think options 2 or 3 would probably have been better choices… because they at least might have left me with a feeling of vindication, justice and respect – or simply with no feeling at all… (Or a life in behind bars in prison). But when a man loses his self respect, his dignity and confidence, it destroys his soul – so what’s the difference if stays free and alive or not?

When I was 27 I was so depressed and beaten I sometimes couldn’t speak above a whisper. I developed a stutter. Avoidance, fear, paranoia, anger… A young, strong man – wasted. Raped seems an appropriate description of how I reacted to the family court system and my apparent helplessness to stop the abuse of my child. I remember being unable to control my emotions during those times – I would cry in public and private, or lash out in a rage. Helpless to control myself, my emotions or my world… shame became my identity and I didn’t really expect much of any good to ever come my way. That’s a dangerous thing for a young man… to have nothing to lose. Literally – suicide and / or homicide seemed my only options… I was backed into a corner unlike any I had ever imagined possible. Like Rape I suppose… I had nothing left to lose. I was broken. I learned this helplessness and shame as a way of life for 15 – 20 years as a direct result of feminism and the family law systems of Amerika.

Now I am 50 and my child is very much in life and refuses to have anything to do with her mother. My daughter knows her mother for who she is. It has taken over 20 years to get to this point with my daughter where we are good with one another – I have lived to fight another day.

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nugganu October 27, 2011 at 00:04

I’m starting to think being left off the birth certificate was a mixed blessing, especially given my child’s mother’s behaviour – she wants to avoid family court as she’s been there before and did not fair well. Not to mention everything she’s done since my child’s birth. There’s no way anyone can look favourably on that stuff.

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Anonymous October 27, 2011 at 02:13

hey guys first time poster.

Just found a vid about divorced and its quite relevant and as crazy as welmers story. From that i can say that the us is definitely a fecking JUNGLE with the law of the strongest smartest richest MAN (not a typo)
because once you are this “civilized” man you are almost untouchable.
I now understand why arnold fuck a latina and still stay married without the divorce “trick” dangling around.

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Rod October 27, 2011 at 03:07

You are an amazingly strong man.
Bless you, my thoughts are with you.
And thank you for grounding me my suffering is over.
Your story now, can help and wake other men.

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Migu October 27, 2011 at 05:24

Most states, READ ALL !!, have as part of their Constitutions a clause that says you have the right to an attorney, even in civil matters. This is also part the United States Constitution. How this traditionally has been interrpreted is that the MAN pays for the barefoot and pregnant wife’s attorney. Now when the tables are turned, wifey has the $$$$$$$$$$, the courts conveinently forget about “stare decisis” , their own laws, and the Constitution, and leave the man hanging, violating his Constitutional Rights!!!!!!

Wrong. My dad tried that too. Judge Hardasty said no, and that was in Federal court. The precedant must now be overruled by Scotus. The 11th circuit agreed with Hardasty on appeal.

This is why I like Anon at age 69. All this has been tried, and it was all a waste of time.

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Avenger October 27, 2011 at 05:43

CorkyAgain October 26, 2011 at 17:47

@ Avenger

Your scheme to make yourself uninsurable will backfire. The insurance company will still insure you despite your “existing” medical condition. All they will do is raise your premiums.

It’s true that some people may be insured and put into a higher risk category but some are just outright denied the insurance. No co. is going to insrue a 400 pounder in any risk category or someone who shows any signs of many diseases. And what if you say under the mental questions that you’re chronically depressed and feel like killing yourself? No co. will insure you because they’ll have to pay the claim if you kill yourself.
There’s a misconception about the “suicide clause” in the policy in most people’s minds. Although it may be in the policy most State law voids it. Some States also originally partially voided it if you were insane at the time you killed yourself but even they changed it to regardless of whether you were sane or insane the co. had to pay. And besides, even when suicide clauses were permitted they always became incontestable a year after the policy was in force which meant that the co. had to pay. So no co. is going to issue a policy to a depressed person who may kill himself.

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Avenger October 27, 2011 at 05:59

P.S.
“The insurance company will still insure you despite your “existing” medical condition”

No they won’t and in fact this is one of the things they’re looking for to reject you. You think they’re going to insure someone with infantile diabetes who probably won’t make it to age 30? These are LIFE insurance companies not health insurance like Obamacare (if it actually ever even goes into effect)

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codebuster October 27, 2011 at 06:58

I know that feeling where you’re brain feels like it’s scrambled, and there’s no way out. But you’ve got to stick with it. I do not believe in a personal god, but for some reason I find myself praying for you.

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codebuster October 27, 2011 at 07:00

ahem… Bill… and everyone else. Amazing times we live in.

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Avenger October 27, 2011 at 07:12

‘Wrong. My dad tried that too. Judge Hardasty said no, and that was in Federal court. The precedant must now be overruled by Scotus. The 11th circuit agreed with Hardasty on appeal. ‘

Judges won’t go against precedents because the purpose of them is maintain certainty so a litigant knows what to expect. The US Circuit can overrule a decision and change it if it was made by one judge or even a panel of three if they hear the case sitting en banc and as you said also the SC.
There is a provision where on motion a US District Fed Count judge can appoint a lawyer in a civil case but if you’re the plaintiff the judge will respond that you could find a lawyer to take your case on contingency and since you already wrote and filed the complaint yourself that you’re smart enough to proceed in propria persona.(if you had no money the fees are waived) I can see an ignorant defendant getting a lawyer in a civil case but I doubt even this has ever happened because poor people just don’t get sued unless it has something to do with their insurance in which case the insurance co. lawyer would defend.

28 U.S.C. 1915(d), which provides that federal courts may “request” an attorney to represent any person claiming in forma pauperis status.

So a judge can request this from the pool of lawyers but can’t demand anyone to represent someone so good luck lol

‘This is why I like Anon at age 69. All this has been tried, and it was all a waste of time’

Not everything is a waste of time especially if you have the funds and will to achieve your objective.

But you’re also going to have to learn to take extralegal and preemptive actions to protect yourself and always be one step ahead of your opponent. eg. Welmer mentioned that he can’t renew his passport but it would have been wise to renew it(it’s good for 10 years) before a court had issued any order. And any money he had in a bank account should have been withdrawn.
If you want to beat a female you’re going to have to adopt the same malicious and underhanded tactics they use to get what they want and have no mercy on them at all.

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Anonymous age 69 October 27, 2011 at 07:40

>>CorkyAgain October 26, 2011 at 22:06

I have said repeatedly there will be men who cannot leave, and family and kids are one reason. The time to leave is before you are trapped by the kids and the divorce industry. You can have kids in other nations. Kids with eyes of a different shape are as much your kids as the usual Anglo kids.

No shaming language here, except to point out that any man in the USA who has not at least evaluated leaving is an idiot, and that is fact, not shaming.

Just how bad does it have to get before men figure out they simply do not belong in the US?

No human; legal; civil; or constitutional rights. Any woman who wants can have you sent to prison, or if she plays her cards right, someone will murder you, with no wrong doing on your part. If you call CPS to report abuse by your wife, there is a good chance you will end up losing your kids to the abusive woman.

If I knew when your kids were born, it might affect my opinion. I assure you that in 1984, my activism was known nation wide among other activists. We did everything we could to let men know what the government and courts were doing to men. They laughed and called us every name in the book.

And, at that time, virtually everything being done to men today was being done to men then. The system is more automated than 25 years ago, but it’s same-o, same-o. You guys who are horrified at what is happening only imagine it is new, because you failed to pay any attention when a steady stream of activists tried to tell you.

And, in virtually every community in the USA, there was a man trying to publicize what was happening, and asking for political support. So, it is highly unlikely if you married well under 25 years ago, that you did not hear what your true status was. So, you didn’t believe it? Not your finest moment.

I had men call me, and I’d sometimes ask, when they were so horrified at what had just happened to them, “Haven’t you heard of this before?”

They would try to lie, and lie it was. When pressed, they would admit, “Well, yes, I did hear of it, but I always assumed it only happened to really bad men, I never thought it would happen to ME.”

Ah, yes, the great and wonderful me. I am so special and different.

So, any man who married in the last 25 years well knew what was happening, and what he was risking for his children, even as he now denies it. So, maybe they deserve shaming language, because they should truly be ashamed of themselves for paying no attention to reality.

Shaming language which has no connection to reality, such as feminists do when they have no answer for what men are saying, is a totally different issue for being told the truth about men who pay no attention to the experience of other men. Your generation had all the information it needed to avoid these disasters. Yet, you plunged on assuming your personal stud-hood would protect you. You f’d up, and now your kids are with a fiend, and not with you.

Also, let me tell you something. It is not uncommon for a man to think he is doing well in divorce, for a short time, a year or a few years. He still gets to see them, things don’t seem too bad. Later, as they grow, alienation increases.

The man who saw his kids when they were very small may not see them, ever, or virtually never, when they are adults and have their own kids.

Sure. there are cases where men do very well, but the vast majority in the end are alienated from their kids. I have not seen my eldest daughter in maybe 6 years, and my divorce was in 1973. Further, I don’t especially want to see her. She is negative and hostile like her mom. We got along okay after she was an adult, but eventually things fell apart. All those years with no contact caught up to us. This is not uncommon.

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A Lonely Dad October 27, 2011 at 07:47

Migu, Avenger, In Wisconsin this is Articl I, Section 21, Rights of Suitors of the Wisconsin Constitution. Here is the Section 21: Rights of suitors. SECTION 21. [As amended April 1977]
(1) Writs of error shall never be prohibited, and shall be issued
by such courts as the legislature designates by law.
(2) In any court of this state, any suitor may prosecute or
defend his suit either in his own proper person or by an attorney
of the suitor’s choice. [1975 J.R. 13, 1977 J.R. 7, vote April In the Constitution of the United States it is The 6th Amendment: In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence. So in Wisconsin based on the case , Clarke et al. v. Brke (1886). As is usual MRA Men are filled with apathy and not knowledge!!!!
1977

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Szebran October 27, 2011 at 08:14

Seems like alot of these ex’s should be in jail. They cetainly should have no contact with their children since they appear emotionally unstable.
I know I posted a linke B4 where 1 guy did fight back against his ex-wife’s lies and fraud – and he won $800K. Cant remember that link but he’s another link where a man sued his ex wife on false molestation charges
http://www.fathersandfamilies.org/?p=7651
and won $16 million

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Boxer October 27, 2011 at 08:18

Hey Bill:

I admire your ability to put all this in words. Most (my own da’ included) can not.

As AFoR, Koanic and others have already pointed out, I hope that no matter what happens you remain open to your kids throughout your life. It may be that you lose touch. If this happens, please don’t lose heart.

I was put through something similar to what your own kids are dealing with. I didn’t see or talk to my own dad in years. His patience with me when I did make contact was incredible, and now things are good. I am glad to be rid of my mother, in contrast, and don’t think about her much or speak to her at all.

Pay, don’t pay, stay, don’t stay, in the end, things will come right again. Just don’t go nuts and commit suicide like that asshole did in NH (I don’t consider him a hero, he’s a loser who let the system beat him). His kids will never have a dad now, and they’ll be doomed to be with that snatch of an ex-wife of his for ever. Stay alive and keep writing and thinking, and let time undo the evil of the courts.

Regards, Boxer

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Firepower October 27, 2011 at 11:36

Taank

Firepower, would you please share your experiences with us? I think, given Welmer’s bravery in starting the topic, that we should gather as many perspectives and stories as we can.

Since before most of the posters here were born, it has been well-known that marriage is a losing proposition for men.

A legal contract newly advertised as inherently unfair and biased against males. And, prejudiced in favor of even females’ craziest whims.

Since 1990, warnings to males of what really happens to their asses in settlements, alimony and custody have been fully divulged by feminists – so much so, that said warnings have been staples of even highly publicized Hollywood media.

To suddenly lament the loss of a Brady Bunch World while your wife’s divorce lawyer fucks you up the ass is a bit…too late. Especially with all those warning signs.

Braver, to have never married in the first place.

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Taxi Driver October 27, 2011 at 11:37

I’ll repeat the advice of others here. Don’t worry about your kids too much. Sit back and wait. They’ll leave as soon as they are able and turn up on your doorstep.

I won’t feed the beast either, not even a lawyer for myself. Screw ‘em. Not one penny.

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Avenger October 27, 2011 at 15:47

@Lonely Dad- all of that has to do with Criminal cases not Civil.

“and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence’

That just meant that you could hire a lawyer to assist you, not that the court would appoint one for you. The right of a poor defendant to have a lawyer appointed for himself was by a Supreme Court decision, Gideon v. Wainwright, 372 U.S. 335, and that was during my lifetime in 1963. Some States may have already had this in their Constitution but a lot didn’t so the SC ruling trumps them and now States must conform. But you have no right in a Civil case to a court appointed lawyer.
The only thing the US Constitution says about Civil cases is that if the amount exceeds $20 you have a right to a jury trial which is interpreted today as $5k-$10k depending on the State.

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A Lonely Dad October 27, 2011 at 18:23

Avenger, You really should do some more reading. I stasnd by post.

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CorkyAgain October 27, 2011 at 18:27

“So, it is highly unlikely if you married well under 25 years ago, that you did not hear what your true status was.”

“Since before most of the posters here were born, it has been well-known that marriage is a losing proposition for men.”

I got married in 1978, and believe me, there was nobody warning me against it. Maybe in California or New York, but this was in rural Illinois, the northern fringe of the Bible Belt.

At least my children won’t have the same excuse.

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Avenger October 27, 2011 at 18:52

Lonely, do you have any idea about what you wrote or the difference between a civil and criminal case? You only have a right to an appointed lawyer if you can’;t afford one in a CRIMINAL case. And as I said above, some States had this right to an attorney before the SC ruled in Gideon v. Wainwright, 372 U.S. 335 in 1963 and made it a requirement for all States. In general, you have more rights under State constitutions than under the US Constitution. What you wrote above is for Criminal cases in the state of Minn. and most of it (like a writ of error) has nothing to do with appointment of counsel. Then you tack on the 6th amendment to the US Constitution.
If you just used a bit of logic you would know that courts cannot appoint counsel in civil cases because everyone with a gripe would be filing lawsuits, lawsuits that no private attorney would take on contingency because they have no merit and little chance of winning. The courts would be bankrupt.
You’re very confused and need to develope a more orderly and disciplined mind. Perhaps some real education may help you.
Good luck.

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Avenger October 27, 2011 at 19:31

I got married in 1978, and believe me, there was nobody warning me against it. Maybe in California or New York, but this was in rural Illinois, the northern fringe of the Bible Belt.

Corky, I wouldn’t include New York because they were the last State to change to no fault (this year). In 1978 in NY you would first have to be separated for a year and then sue for divorce and the only grounds were adultery(ther may have been a couple of other grounds like insanity where your spouse was locked up in an insane asylum for years or was serving 5 life terms in prisons but I’m not even certain if this would get you a divorce) This is why people would go to Nevada for a divorce but I doubt if NY recognised this divorce. When adultery was grounds for a divorce and there were a lot of assets involved it would usually be settled privately by the lawyers because if it went to trial it would really be argued vigourously with lawyers bringing in witnesses, like private detectives who could prove your wife was a whore. And there was no point in claiming physical or mental abuse because these were not grounds for a divorce. Marital “rape” would be laughable because everyone recognised that when you marry you voluntarily give up certain rights. “Rape” would just be viewed as inconsiderate behaviour, not a crime.
The contract law in NY is the most stringent and least open to interpretation which is why it’s the world standard. This may sound strange but even companies outside the US, let’s say Japan for example, will have a clause that all disputes will be decided under the contract law of the State of NY.

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Migu October 27, 2011 at 23:43

My dad is 16 years divorced. We tried it all. What worked in the end was nothing. We did however manage to ruin a few political careers.

If you have the money you can win. He who gives the greatest bribe is he whois damaged least. They call it the squeeze in China.

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Anonymous for good reason October 28, 2011 at 02:39

What is the problem with no fault divorce? If they don’t want to be together, let them part.

The problem is the government enforced money distribution. Let them part but don’t interfere.

Let the kids with the one that is willing to support them. There are millions of moms with deadbeat poor dads. The poor ghetto moms get along because they have to.

If mom wants money from dad, maybe she should offer something in return. At least unlimited visitation rights. Or friendly behavior and collaboration. Or dad pays but he decides where the money goes to. Or even sex (was that not the original reason most men marry?)

The way it is now, that fathers have to pay support beyond their entire income, because their income dropped, this is sick. And going to jail for it!

I don’t understand why there is not more resistance. Family court is worse then criminal court. It can ruin a man’s life and put him in jail. No more chance for a good life. Financial ruin forever. NO chance even for bankruptcy.

I am surprised men don’t become terrorists. They used to do a Boston Tea party over much smaller financial tributes. Unjust terrible laws. And on top of it LYING ex wives with false accusations, that get away with it?

If the life is destroyed, why don’t men just become killers and suicide bombers? kill the bitch, together with the family court judge (yes, poor sap is just a cog in the system).

No, I can not advocate this. But if my life was destroyed for good, no passport, no job, no drivers license, a few years in jail, all for a lying lazy ex wife? I would understand people snapping.

Yes, the kids would be orphans. Maybe you have a grandma or an uncle.

Again, I can not really advocate this. But if a man’s life is maliciously destroyed by a toxic legal system and a characterless liar, why don’t more men snap? Become Breiviks? But target the really guilty parties.

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Anonymous for good reason October 28, 2011 at 02:43

A few terrorist murders would call attention. Then we would only need the “cornered violated man syndrome” similar to battered wife syndrome.

A battered wife can always walk away. A cornered violated man can not flee anywhere. If his passport has been taken, then he REALLY can go nowhere. If he still has his passport, he can flee. But he will not even get recognized as a persecuted refugee fleeing an oppressive regime.

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A Lonely Dad October 28, 2011 at 08:29

Avenger, You always have the RIGHT TO ANATTORNEY!! What you are doingis juvenile!! Of course you have to pay for an attorney in a civil case, but in divorce the monies can be charged to the estate. This shouldn’t be a problem as they do it all the time for a female. Grow a set and open the books and find out for yourself!!!!!

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Migu October 28, 2011 at 10:35

A lonely Dad.

You know I use to believe too. Those rights you have on paper are meaningless. It’s all about who you know, or who you can make miserable if they don’t agree with you. That is the game of government and it’s courts.

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My Blueyed Son October 28, 2011 at 12:29

Upfront -I’m a woman – if the mother of a son is allowed to claim that gender. If you love, defend , care or speak out about your son you forfeit all female rights and privileges.

I’m reading through these comments with tears streaming down my face.

This beautiful sunny fall week started off driving with my son to sign away his parental rights. Her offer was No More CS if you sign away your rights.

I told my son it can’t be possible, it’s another scam. She’s lying. She’s up to no good. She and her mother are PROs at this – you know nothing about it. Don’t trust her. Don’t believe her. Don’t fall for it.

They met at a bank. She’d written some sort of document, telling him to notorize it, she’d file it in court and he will be free. I insisted my son allow his father and I to read it over first.

When she caught sight of us waiting in the car, she ripped the paper up, saying she needed to go back to her attorney for a rewrite.

And now we wait.

I didn’t know my grandson’s last name until the one weekend, two years ago, we were allowed to meet him. I read it on a prescription bottle. My son didn’t know her last name. “I didn’t even buy her dinner”.

Five years ago at this time my son had just bought an impressive house. He had a boat, a sports car, a job he loved, and a very hot Calendar model girlfriend.

Days after he bought the house she lost her job and couldn’t seem to find another. She moved her father in – he was a truck driver and rarely in town – to pay rent. Daddy lost his job soon afterward and couldn’t seem to find another.

About nine moths into this my son came home to find the water and electricity shut off and an eviction notice on the front door. Girlfriend, who had been taking care of the bills, and her father had been gambling the mortgage payments and investing in get rich quick schemes.

He love this girl very much, but booted her and her father out. Several months of black out drunken partying followed while his home was forclosed, his car and boat reposessed.

Somehow in the fog of all this, one of many cocktail waitresses who spent the night announced she was pregnant. She saw the house, the boat and the car still in the garage and thought she’d found the mother lode, not realizing it was about to be gone “like a fart in the wind” as my son put it.

Actually three women were claiming to be pregnant at that same time, but only the one persisted. I truly thought my son was going to commit suicide by alcoholic poisoning. I don’t know how he lived through that time.

She showed up with her belongings and unhouse broken dog in her car, ready to move in.

“What was your name again?”

She screamed she was going to do it all herself, just like her Momma did, and that was the last he saw or heard from her…until the baby was 10 months old.

Here’s your son. This is harder than I thought. I want money.

She left the baby with us over the weekend, and asked my son to decide how much he wanted to pay for support – no court involvement.

The amount my son named was not what she had in mind.

DNA test. Yes. It’s yours. Court appearances. She contacted all his aquaintances asking for help to prove him an unfit father. Her mother holding the baby over her head, screaming “Say goodbye to your son forever”.

She wrote the Judge my son was an alcoholic. The the baby had been neglected and had severe diaper rash, and that we’d slept with him.

She was awarded $4,200.00 back payment& attorney fees, $650.00 a month child support. She and her mother came by his place of work to scream at the secretary and collect back payment.

She contacted all his neighbors to explain he was a “deadbeat dad” that owed her thousands and asked if they saw him trying to move out to contact her.

He lost his job several times, betting deeper and deeper into arrears. Never saw the child after her accusations, fearing they wold escalate.

He needs rotator cuff surgery, his teeth are rotting out of his head, and his child support payments have been upped to $750.00.

My once bright, ambitious son now looks broken, beaten down and twice his age. He’s not even 30 yet.

“Am I a dirtbag Mom for wanting out of this? For signing away my rights?”

…maybe someday….someday your son will see. Maybe one day – if he’s not ruined beyond repair – he will come to you. He may want his father’s name. He may want his claim to a family that would have loved him.

Reading some of the comments here, I thought I was lying to my son, giving him false hope.

Maybe not…if it was a daughter, I wouldn’t even hope, but maybe being a son…

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 8 Thumb down 6
nugganu October 28, 2011 at 13:46

Just had the mother of my child phone me, drunk, threatening to take me to court, and that I was facing jail time, and that I wouldn’t see my child again.

Ugh.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 11 Thumb down 0
nugganu October 29, 2011 at 05:05

Seriously contemplating filing a form 13 with our family courts at this stage – it is the form usually reserved for a mother seeking child support from the father, only I have filled it out the other way around, seeking to pay child support. Attach my paystub and my last 3 tax returns, and voila!

That wouldn’t make the mother look very good at all, and will surely work in my favour, I think.

At this stage in the game I can’t see what choice I have facing threats of the nature she has been making.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 4 Thumb down 0
A Lonely Dad October 29, 2011 at 08:37

Migu, You will never have any “RIGHTS’ as long as you let a “court officer” represent your STRAWMAN!!!!!!

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 1 Thumb down 5
SixStringsForever October 29, 2011 at 14:39

Disgraceful story,but it typifies why increasing numbers of men are shunning the sick joke that has become marriage nowadays.
I just don’t trust any woman……..not in the workplace and certainly not in wedlock,their “entitlement ego” is completely out of control and when the wheels do come off as they all too frequently do the vast majority of men will find themselves in a world of pain.
You gotta ask yourself is it really worth it???

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 6 Thumb down 0
Ted October 29, 2011 at 16:27

“You gotta ask yourself is it really worth it??”

No

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 0
oddsock October 30, 2011 at 02:22

Come on guys stop being so suspicious. We all know that NAWALT ! Pfttt! Just ask any white knight mangina.

Not all hand grenades detonate immediately.

Do you feel lucky ?

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 3 Thumb down 4
Thankful Waver October 31, 2011 at 00:47

YEEEEEEEEE HAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWW!! You done wrangled that thar hamster, oddsock!!! Nuggets o’ gold and buckets o’ moonshine to ye, sir!

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 5
resourceful & dedicated single mother November 5, 2011 at 13:35

Men have the same rights to child custody and support in a divorce or breakup as women do. Just because most men decide that having their free time is more important to them than having their children full time and raising them with their own values and daily love and care, doesn’t mean women should be criminalized and slandered for asking for financial support (which by the way we do not get rich off of, and I think if you have ever had kids living with you, you know that well). Remember, men have choices and so do women. This story is written from only one point of view, and although I don’t disbelieve it totally, I have never seen a couple divorce where all the fault lies on one person. It has also been my experience in dating, marriage, and divorce, that many men fabricate and exaggerate stories about their exes to make themselves look as innocent as possible. Yes be careful who you choose, and be loving in your relationships as well. But choices were made by both parties, remember men have these choices too. You can:
1) keep your relationship and work things out with honest effort
2) not have sex in the first place
3) get your support modified based on your income
4) take responsibility for your own part in preventing pregnancy
5) choose your kids over your own free time and decide to raise them in your own home and be the custodial parent (then you collect the support from your ex, if you can get it from them… But I guarantee that most times it doesn’t even cover the necessities it’s meant to help with)

Think about this perspective before you go woman-bashing. There are those of us who have first hand knowledge & much experience with how hard it is to raise children on our own, and what a struggle it is for single mothers to pay for housing, food, electricity, child care, medical bills, clothes, school supplies, etc., without receiving a dime from a true deadbeat dad who abandoned his children to go party and drink and drug. Although I’m sure most fathers are not like this, there are many who are, and even more who are just unwilling to take on the kind of dedication and selflessness it takes to raise children full time, and mothers get stuck with most of the responsibility for that. Remember, it’s not just coming home after work and making dinner! It’s help with homework, school conferences, sports, clubs, transportation, refereeing fights, well child doctor visits, discipline, and spending daily time with them (just to name a.few things!) We love our kids with all of our hearts, genuinely and selflessly, and trust me… We don’t get rich off the measley few dollars you send us. Kids are expensive, and we all go without to ensure the well-being of our kids. If you can’t afford your support, you have the right to have it re-evaluated. It is based on your earnings and there are laws on how much can be collected which protect YOU, the non-custodial parent. Child support services are there to help you, so get on the phone, the internet, and use your resources instead of sitting in front of a keyboard placing blame on others!

One more piece of advice for anyone in a hard situation who cannot afford an attorney ~ as a resourceful broke single mother I’ve used this MANY times: there are some free legal advice websites which have real attorneys, 24 hours a day, to answer your legal questions. They ask for a donation based on your satisfaction with the quality of the answer, but you don’t have to give it. I always do because I’ve gotten very good help and it is worth it to support the service hey offer. It’s wonderful! I know there are others, but the one I’ve used most is justanswer.com. If you’re in a pinch and need help it’s a lifesaver! I don’t know the names of other sites, but I know they’re out there if you look. Use your resources, love your kids, and always do what’s right. Even if your ex doesn’t. :)

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db August 6, 2012 at 07:15

Its funny the same court system that demands that i pay child support regardless of my employment status, is the same government entity that allowed my foreign owned employer to outsource my job to India. I feel that if they allowed my job to be outsourced that they should pay the child support. By the way the same court is responsible for allowing my wife to file a no fault divorce, leaving me no options accept to move out and pay. i gave up looking for work and trying to be a long distance twice a year father. Let the court cleanup their own mess and take care of my family i have no reason to try any longer. To the corrupt court system, i give up, take it all and put me in jail, i will never work again.

Like or Dislike: Thumb up 2 Thumb down 0
gilgamesh December 5, 2013 at 23:37

Are you the same Koanic from mypostingcareer dot com?

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