Employment Game Part II : Recognizing the Need to Change Your Approach

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by Featured Guest on June 16, 2011

By Elmer

In Part I we described the femocratized landscape facing men in search of work and its default process for humiliating decent chaps who don’t understand how the game is rigged. We continue now with Part II, which rips the lid off the secret body of knowledge known as Employment Game.

The basic concept here is to change your thinking from being a passive, hopeful job-seeker with hat in hand begging for a job to that of an active work monger. It involves learning techniques of salesmanship to open up work opportunities outside of the interfaces, now controlled by females, that you have been led to believe will land you a job.

In times of yore (well, in the modern age, a brief period between 1949-1979), a guy could scan the newspaper job ads, send in a resume or apply in person, and have a reasonable chance of attaining long-term work or even a career with benefits that could support a family. All of us know that times have changed for a lot of reasons, but the job search approach has remained essentially the same. For many men, it not only doesn’t get results, it hits their self-esteem pretty hard. Trying to make sense of it, let alone developing a work-around, is a bit beyond most guys. Their needs are immediate; it can take years to get this right. I learned it because I have been such a miscreant ne’er-do-well for the last 35 freakin years that I managed to get fired, layed off, or tossed from sinking ships so many times that I learned to swim the leech-infested waters of post-industrial America and occasionally surface onto dry land, palm trees, and sunshine. So if I tell you to get a pair of gabardines, just listen to what I am saying, Numbnuts, and go out and do it.

Above the small shop level, the current HR front has little to do with finding qualified workers and more to do with putting up a façade to exclude you and funnel your resume into the trash, as well as to make an appearance to being serious about diversity and other social concerns that, apparently, you are obliged to feel responsible for. That is, out of moral suasion, willing to let some competitor slip through the filter and grab the goods. It gets even worse, as often companies have already identified an internal candidate for the job but go through the charade of interviewing some hopeful chap merely to answer legal requirements for filling the position. “Job Fairs” are PR stunts to project compliance with gender and diversity mandates. Your chance of getting a gig through one of these productions are about the same as scoring a babe through some bar scene. Your probability of getting scorned and rejected are about the same as well, but at least at the bar you can say to her “That’s OK, I had to take a shit anyway.”

Companies routinely lie in your face, yet you are expected to conform to a stereotype of a “good” employee. Let’s examine one of these lies. Nowadays every company has a “career opportunities” web page, 90% of which appear to have been coded by the same people to the point of using the same damn stock photo models. What is the message the corporation is trying to convey? That these people actually work at that company? They do not. Then does it mean that these are the kind of people they want you to believe work there? Or that these are the kind of people they are seeking? Whatever the case, it boils down to one truth: it’s a big lie. They are lying to your face from the get-go and to submit to their process you are going to have to suspend belief and play along with the charade, all while letting them examine in lurid detail all aspects of your personal life. This, my friends, is a “crazy maker”.

To keep your sanity intact, for young and old men alike it means not playing their game. It means developing a narrative and persona that you can apply on a regular basis to score new work. You are going to define and internalize an honest self-image that will take over the controls when you enter a work selling situation and guide it to a satisfactory conclusion, which doesn’t necessarily mean that you are getting the job. This takes a lot of effort but you can start simple and build it over time.

Secondly, it means understanding what your market is and who exactly you are going to approach to sell your skills. This is where you are going to have to do some legwork and research. Thanks to the internet it’s a lot easier to do this than previous times. That is one advantage the current paradigm gives you.

For the younger man, learn to identify the manager or business owner and approaching him (not “him or her”) directly with a short narrative and contact info. Do not walk into a business and ask “are you taking applications” or “do you have any openings”. If you hand your application to some low-end employee it is likely get diverted to the trash or you will be told that the position is already filled (because they want their friend to get it). Your act of salesmanship in contacting and talking to the man running the operation will demonstrate a huge difference in initiative over your competitors.

For the older guy, recognize the inherent prejudices against you and develop tactics for cutting through it. You are going to make a stand that you have endured your last interview. It is almost guaranteed that you are going to get treated badly if you go the job ad/interview route so it’s time to put that trap behind you. The methods I’m describing work best with guys around your own age, at least in my experience. They are the ones who are going to be least prejudiced against you. Guys in their 50s and 60s are generally going to treat you ok. The upside of this is that they are also the exact players you want to contact using the methods I will describe; they are the guys running companies or being the chief engineer; they are the entrepreneurs who will be most open to consulting services from the self-employed.

There’s another thing I’ve noticed about some older men who run entrepreneurial companies. They could retire but stay in their game because it’s balls; they enjoy being in the game too much. These are the guys you want to get to know and emulate. Learn to speak the language that gets them to think “Out-fucking-standing!” because you are one in a thousand that gets it.

The very act of defining your sales persona, and importantly, taking control of the sales interview, gives you a sense of control over your destiny in the face of turbulent economic forces. It is vitally important to develop high confidence. When you follow their script and engage in their role-playing, it is difficult to maintain your self-esteem. Being confronted with the haughty conceits of the employed and their false self-importance while they ask you inane questions about what you see yourself doing in 5 years, or to describe your biggest weaknesses, or worse, to engage in what-if scenarios or interview tests (devised by some HR twit, to be sure), is unendurable. Trudging home to your family after getting skinned alive like this can really make you feel unhinged.

You are going to develop your own script for your skill base and your industry. Guaranteed you are going to get shot down a lot. Get used to it. At least you are fighting on your terms. Each little paper cut prepares you for the next battle. And when you follow your own rules, at least you walk out with your balls intact.

In the first essay I ranted about the feminization of work and the need for men to learn new methods for dealing with it. The timeless craft of salesmanship provides exactly the template you need to customize for your unique talents. I am advocating “salesmanship” but not sales gimmickry. Google(salesman images). That is not what I am talking about here. This is not telemarketing or magazine sales or trying to con someone into buying 200 gallons of parking lot sealer. (By the way, for any of you ladies reading this who think my observations on the feminization of work and wide-spread discrimination of men are BS, google(saleswoman images) and compare that to what you see when you google(salesman images). The emergent behavior of the internet exposes the hideous lies of the feminarchy. Mwhahahahahaha Mwhahahahahaha)

Originally I had hoped to wrap up this series by now but the more I think about this topic the more material spills onto the keyboard of my Alphasmart NEO, thus I will have to write one final installment to send tears of joy streaming down your cheeks.

In Part III of Employment Game : Tools for Transformation, I will lay out what you need to synthesize a system to work the game to suit your needs. It consists of :

-Developing the Right Attitude

-Your Marketing Process

-Your Narrative and Marketing Materials

-The Killer Wardrobe

-Prospect Discovery

-Salesmanship and Rainmaking

-The Structure for Continual Practice

{ 82 comments… read them below or add one }

Hedgewolf June 16, 2011 at 08:01

Worth the wait, Thanks Elmer.

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codebuster June 16, 2011 at 08:17

Good, practical advice. Just reading this much is validation, because it resonates with what I’ve observed. There’s extreme bullshit happening out there, and men need to know employment game just to avoid spiralling into La-La Land. Well done. Looking forward to the next installment.

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keyster June 16, 2011 at 08:21

Very useful information Elmer, (but how you tease and taunt with your forthcoming “Parts”).

I think it’s important that you play a role (as if in a play), perhaps emulating or patterning yourself after someone you know to be naturally gifted at salesmanship; that certian charisma or energy he has.

Problem with me is that after a couple years of trudging through the politics, power plays, bloated egos and smarmy feminized corporate culture, I start to slip “out of character”, and the real me begins to reveal himself.

Being wholly A-POLITICAL and just focused on the job at hand is a death-knell. You MUST understand the political landscape and commit to working within it (even if it slowly robs your soul of it’s essence).

The married w/children guys avoid controversy and don’t make waves. They know actually working at anything is fraught with risk and its best to maintain a low profile whenever possible. DON”T be the hero out to gallantly save the company from decline and make a name for yourself with upper management. That’s not the way it works. Look good, sound good, align yourself with those in favor and by all means avoid trouble, if you can.

And don’t ever, I mean EVER, piss ANYONE off! Yes, doing nothing but being perpetually nice to people you hate was never so exhausting. But the wife and kids are depending on that paycheck so suck it up, kiss major ass and DO NOT be negative to anyone about anything! Your career is a mere box on on org chart. Nobody really likes you or cares about you, they’re just pretending to. Your just might be competing for that last open box soon.

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Uncle Elmer June 16, 2011 at 08:42

Thanks Keyster. I wrote it for guys like you and my son Shemp, who’s just getting started.

I got laid off from my last corporate job not long after they finally completed renovation of the ladies restroom near my cube to provide a “breast pumping” station. Most guys feel lucky to get one not-filthy urinal and a stall around the crapper. We should at least get a masturbatorium to maintain gender equity.

But yeah, I pissed off a lot of people. In one fell swoop I got the attention of upper management when I mentioned off-hand to someone after work that I had observed signs of an impending layoff (which I stupidly enumerated), causing a management shitstorm and public announcements that they had no plans for layoffs. Of course, I was part of the first group that was “let go” in a “census reduction” three months later.

Chinese Proverb : The nail that sticks up gets pounded down.

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Firepower June 16, 2011 at 09:49

Employment is a breeze – if you’re a minority or female.
And, guaranteed if you’re both.

If you need a paycheck, and are a white male, you’d better have a degree in Engineering

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Rebel June 16, 2011 at 10:17

There is something I don’t understand…and I must admit that I have a bit of difficulty believing it can be that bad.

Up where I live, government agencies and employment agencies as well claim that within three to four years, there will be something like 750 000 jobs… with no takers..! (for a population of 7 millions)

As we now speak, there are already well over 300 000 jobs that are “unmanned”- no takers.
As baby boomers are drawn to retirement, the job market will open up like never before. It has come to a point where people who are nearing 65 are promised a heftier pension if they only accept to work for a few more years.
The shortage of manpower is actually putting our economy in jeopardy.
I believe that much of the same must apply throughout most of Canada.

I am now 71 years old and I garantee that I could get a job without difficulty: two jobs were offered to me recently. One as a sales rep and one as office manager. They had even accepted all my conditions.
I would gladly take one if my health permitted.

How can the job market be so hard in the U.S. while employers just can’t find employees here?

You wouldn’t be thinking of expatting, no?
Maybe later?

We welcome immigrants from the U.S. Where else on earth do they say that?

BTW, my niece married an American guy from Wisconsin (Milwaukee?): he’s learned French and he wouldn’t go back: he feels quite at home and enjoys his “joie de vivre”.

Why don’t you take a look on this side?

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Traveller June 16, 2011 at 10:29

Good article.

Companies are like women. Treat them like Game would teach to treat women.

- do not appear needy
- be too much confident instead of less
- part of the job is brag around about what you do
- give the impression to have more choices
… etc etc

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Ryu June 16, 2011 at 10:41

Hey Elmer, great article.

Those resumes are pretty much useless. It’s hardly worth the paper it’s printed on – someone had better meet you, not just your qualifications. Every job I have every gotten have come from a personal reco, or from selling myself. Alot of people just hand in their resume and think that’s it.

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Quartermain June 16, 2011 at 11:12

Elmer,

Your article(s) is “Out-fucking-standing!”

You, my friend is even more “Out-fucking-standing!”

I have suspected that alot the b.s. relating to (in)Human Resources and the employment game is just that, bullshit.

I noticed this for the last 30 years.

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Opus June 16, 2011 at 11:46

As I was saying only yesterday about HR Departments; the reason women join them is so that they can indulge in their own all-day private soap-opera – or as one perceptive ex-gf of mine said, when they were called personnel departments ‘not so much personnel, as personal’.

Their only purpose is to sort out the endless non-stop complaints that women like to make. Selecting a new employee is easy. Choose one, if it does not work out, the person will move on (and they usually do that anyway because whichever company they join it will not be long before they get itchy feet) and as the only people they take are already in some other multi-national, employment is thus just a revolving door.

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Firepower June 16, 2011 at 11:52

HR departments also grant females and minorities FULL legal immunity to fulfill their vengeance bloodlust against men and white men.

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keyster June 16, 2011 at 12:00

“I got laid off from my last corporate job not long after they finally completed renovation of the ladies restroom near my cube to provide a “breast pumping” station.”

Reality is stranger than fiction.

“I mentioned off-hand to someone after work that I had observed signs of an impending layoff…”

I know the feeling Elm, my mouth speaks before my brain thinks. Same exact thing happened to me. Trust no one because just when you think a co-worker is your best friend they’ll stab you in the back, in hopes YOU’LL be sacrificed before them. It’s all about gossip and inuendo, not substance, since women took over, and men began emulating them.

And the bar has been raised. It’s gotten to the point where certian corporate cultures can read your mind; how you carry yourself, facial expressions, body language, emotions, etc…and if you say anything that goes against the grain of the culture or politics, forget it! You’ll be voted off the island, because somebody needs to go, might as well be the “trouble-maker with an attitude” that everyone loves to hate. Regardless of what a kick-ass productive worker he was, he said something once in passing that made somebody a little uncomfortable….
…and he’s white and he’s single. He’s just not a “good fit”.

You and I could write a book.
It’d be a cult classic.

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Troll King June 16, 2011 at 12:03
HARVEST June 16, 2011 at 12:10

OT-

“..and the weiner is TOAST!”

-DieHard (no pun intd.)

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Troll King June 16, 2011 at 12:12

OT.

Fathers day around the corner…what is CNN saying about it?

http://www.cnn.com/2011/LIVING/06/15/fathers.pew.study/index.html?hpt=hp_c2

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Begby June 16, 2011 at 12:24

“How can the job market be so hard in the U.S. while employers just can’t find employees here?”

One word: Mexicans

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Coastal June 16, 2011 at 12:34

This is great. The culture war stuff is good, and the politics is good, but its great to talk about the practical side of things too.

And, yes, in the average business HR Depts are just the barracks for the feminist army of occupation.

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W.F. Price June 16, 2011 at 12:40

This is great. The culture war stuff is good, and the politics is good, but its great to talk about the practical side of things too.

And, yes, in the average business HR Depts are just the barracks for the feminist army of occupation.

-Coastal

In China, there’s no pretense that HR is anything other than a political department. In fact, Chinese are quite open about the fact that HR plays the exact same role as the political commissar in the PLA.

I fail to see any substantive difference between their system and ours — except at least they are honest about it.

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Born Free June 16, 2011 at 12:55

In may experience in the past thirty years women have always been a part of management and human resources has always been run by women. Women do the hiring, set the wages and do the firing. I’ve never known what they meant by patriarchy and male privilege, I’ve never benefited from it, or that there was any difference in pay between men and women.

I look forward to the part three of Employment Game.

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Troll King June 16, 2011 at 13:07
KMitch June 16, 2011 at 13:22

“Firepower June 16, 2011 at 09:49
Employment is a breeze – if you’re a minority or female.
And, guaranteed if you’re both.

If you need a paycheck, and are a white male, you’d better have a degree in Engineering”

As a young engineer, I have to agree with this. Even the lazy and the stupid are never at a loss for a high paying job and if you are lucky enough to have a good head on your shoulders, you can fly up the ladder fast.

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Troll King June 16, 2011 at 13:23

OT.

Woman and her son get into a argument, mother calls cops. Cop executes son. Thanks feminism.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qx9Mt4krDtc&feature=youtu.be

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Rebel June 16, 2011 at 13:26

And, yes, in the average business HR Depts are just the barracks for the feminist army of occupation.

-Coastal

There ‘s one thing I want to add: women in HR are cowards. If you figure that you have been shafted, threaten them with a law suit by saying they are sexist. You will see them back off in short order.
Try it: you have nothing to lose. When women see that men are afraid of them, they get bold as hell: if you show your teeth they back off in a hurry.

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Opus June 16, 2011 at 14:11

I haver never worked in Corporates-ville, so have never had any experience of a Human Resources Department.

In smaller organisations, however, the first thing I need to know is, who is having sex with the boss, because it is always that person who has the ultimate power. The French have an expression for this: ‘Cherchez La Femme’ – Look for the Woman because that is where the real power is – so much for The Patriarchy – and that power is always bitchy, petty and self-righteous.

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keyster June 16, 2011 at 17:06

“And, yes, in the average business HR Depts are just the barracks for the feminist army of occupation.”

HR’s job #1 is to stave off employee legal action of any sort as well as the infiltration of organized unions or keeping them from forming. Behind that they handle local PR, community outreach stuff and planning the company picnic.

I’ve NEVER known an HR department (typically women) that was gender biased in any way. What they are biased against is any employee that put’s the corporation at risk legally and/or publicly. Employee lawsuits are a big black mark on any HR reps record.

In a way they’re the internal investigation division like you see on cop shows.

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codebuster June 16, 2011 at 19:16

@Keyster

I’ve NEVER known an HR department (typically women) that was gender biased in any way.

What do you mean by this? That the law and affirmative action does the biasing for them?

I’ve worked in an HR department where the understanding, both implicit and expressed (especially during EEO meetings), was that if a man and a woman were ranked “equally”, then the job should be given to the woman. Mind you, that was some time ago… the laws may have changed since the mid-90s.

I put the word “equally” in scare-quotes because equal rankings are easily manipulated to achieve desired workplace-demographic outcomes. Not sure how to rank two or more people? Rank them equally, and hey presto, you have the basis for gender biasing, whilst coming across as “fair” and “unbiased”.

HR departments, whether gubmint or private, are often dominated by people who are well-trained in the feminist-dominated fields of psychology, behavioral sciences and law. Paul Elam himself, some time ago, drew attention to the sexism in the behavior therapy profession. Surely gender bias must be entrenched in their very system of education. It needn’t be overt, simply an employee following rules and selection criteria referencing “EEO awareness” and all the other sound-bites associated with affirmative action and equality laws. How could HR departments be anything other than gender biased, given the nature of our education system?

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Perseus June 16, 2011 at 22:01

I just did your google search of salesman vs saleswoman. Wow, go vagocracy.

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gender foreigner June 16, 2011 at 22:40

Dear Traveller June 16, 2011 at 10:29:

I think you’ve nailed it, for sure. It’s very difficult for a victim of women’s right to harm men to do what you’ve stated, however. I’m a lousy actor and right now, I’m severely depressed, even more than normal.

Last week, I had two job interviews (both out of town, and both at my expense) in two different women’s government schools. Neither interviewing party contacted me on the dates they said they would tell me of their decision (Monday and Wednesday).

I’ve put my name off to selectively about 50 job ads in the last three months and all have rejected me. One of my head-woman references actually emailed me and asked that I take her name off my resume as a reference (the job term I had in her school went very well, she just didn’t want to be a reference any more and a principal mangina rejected me based on her refusal to discuss the success of me having been in that position).

Life is hopeless. I see now hope. I pray to God and am rejected always. Severe change is required. There’s nothing good… ….. ……. ………whatever.

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fmz June 16, 2011 at 22:49

As l’m going own way, l work, invest and exist for myself and l’ve rigged that game to my advantage, making my own rules and such like. l play the game by turning it back on itself and, yep you guessed it, around to suit, ahem, myself. Such is the ironic gamesmanship of gyow.

l urge all men to move toward self-reliance in some form or other. At least to some degree. Then ‘employment game’ graudually becomes redundant or of lesser relevance.

GYOW and be free(er).

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Robert the Street Philosopher King June 17, 2011 at 00:43

What I love about this spearhead–other than a dose of sanity in a world of so-called “critical theory” that denies common sense and the very ability to know (hence profess), educate or pursue the scientific method–is the level of intelligence. I use to grade papers as a TA in a University School of Business, it has devolved to the 4th grade level (who runs public education and now University?).That was so well written, succinct, and entertaining. Just good writing!!! SPOT ON, SIR.

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Peter-Andrew:Nolan(c) June 17, 2011 at 04:27

From the CNN Article.

“Our research shows that dads who live with their children are just far more involved.”

Gee. These fuckwits needed a SURVEY to tell them this! That’s what a nunch of retards they are.

My position is simple and has not changed on bit since November 12 2007.

Any assault on a father. Any violation of his right to be the father he chose to be? He should quit. Do nothing for THE STATES children. Stop paying taxes. Pay no alimony. No child support. Be prepared to sit in jail longer than mandella should he be put there. And make a vow to kill any man who infringes his right of freedom in such a way that he will not be able to be held responsible.

And that is what I have promised those who tormented me. The man who tries to put me in jail is going to be told he WILL be killed. Then he can choose to do as he wants. I have not yet had a man stand in front of me and threaten to jail me. I don’t think I ever will. Why? Because when I look a man in the eye and tell him I WILL do something? He gets it.

If all fathers who have had their rights violated took that leave out of my book this shit would have been over ages ago. Fathers are whimps now. They have no balls and do not have the courage of their conviction.

Look at the number again. 25% of all fathers do not live with their kids in the US. Fucking whimps will not go on strike until their rights are no longer infringed and their children are no longer abuse. And that is all ANY father is who tries to ‘comply with the system’. He’s nothing more than a fucking whimp.

THOSE are the men who are failing their children.

Guys like me who took the moral high ground and took the stand that violation of my right to be the father I choose, violation of my former childrens right to the benefit of having a father, and child abuse are crimes which must not be allowed the stand. We are the ones that are to be applauded for standing by our principles and refusing to compromise to the commission of a crime and acquiescing. And ALL women and ALL men who have criticised me are nothing but scumbag liars and hypocrites. Every single last one of them.

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Peter-Andrew:Nolan(c) June 17, 2011 at 05:43

my comment on the good mangina project article.

“What about those of us who have our daughters kidnapped? Are you going to tell us we should hug them too? You guys are such transparent manginas. You are such slavish order followers from your masters at MS magazine. You think you can serve up this tripe and get away with it? You think you will not be exposed for the traitors you are?

All this time and Tom is yet to talk about the estimated 4,000 men in Australia who kill themselves from the criminal abuse of the family courts. Rather than tell women that crime is wrong and stopping women committing crimes you run articles telling men to ‘hug your daughters’.

What a bunch of manginas you are.”

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Peter-Andrew:Nolan(c) June 17, 2011 at 05:57

Elmer,
great article. The lads need to be told that those in large corps HR departments are nothing but fem-nazis.

Your approach will work. I know that because I’ve seen it work. And for those who want to work IN a large corporate I think it is the best approach and I would stongly support and endorse what you are saying. You have obviously ‘been around the block’.

However? I propose a different approach. Rather than just offering advice to the young (and older) men? I propose to offer services that they can use and gain significant benefit from. And of course, I recommend this is fee for service based on value. I propose LOTS of men join in on this initiative. But I warn you. To become a PNA is going to be tough because I am going to personally vet every single man who applies. It will be though this vetting process that I will maintain the value of the brand PNA. Liars, cheats, criminals, scumbags, manginas will not be welcome.

I have noted here a few times that men could start their own ALL MEN associations and offer their products and services to all comers and the revenue from the company goes merely to the men who run the company.

They disberse that revenue as they see fit. Because they will be performing this work purely for the benefit of MEN the association will be MUCH better than the ‘normal corporation’.

Products and services can be procured from other companies and resold via such MEN ONLY associations.

For example? Would you rather buy your next laptop from femanazi Jeff Bezos? F*** he even TALKS like a woman. Or would you rather buy your next laptop from an ALL MALE association? Would you rather spend your hard earned to wimminz loving corps who just love to f*** you over when you go for a job? Or would you rather spend your hard earned knowing that it goes to benefit MEN?

The man-o-sphere has been totally silent on this proposal. And I mean TOTALLY.

If you men are not willing to get off your arses and start your OWN associations? They you DESERVE the f***ing over you get by the wimminz in the corps. It is YOU who is not doing what needs to be done. Who can blame them for becoming leeches and sucking the life out of men when men will not sweep them away.

Look at it this way. I have not worked with a woman in our association for 11 years now. Sure. I have to work with wimminz in big corps. And I do so very professionally and very politely. But that does not mean I have to take the losses they incure. Indeed? In 2001/2 I got 9 months work in the USA because a wimminz stuffed up a project. Her stuff up was worth six figures to me when the USD was worth something.

So. Today?

I am announcing the launching of PeterNolanAssociates. PNA.

I have owned this domain for a few years now.

PeterNolanAssociates will offer a range of services.

Firstly it will offer my normal Business Intelligence products and services. That is the mainstay of my business.

Secondly? It will offer the following services to MEN ONLY. And any other services I see fit to offer.

1. Infrastructure services to get men into business as a PNA associate. This will include web sites, marketing materials development, sales presentations, marketing plans as well as access to other paid up associates for business networking. I will be available to advise PNAs on their business and personal interests on a fee for service basis. I will find honest men of honour and integrity who are also willing to provide advice and guidance in their respective areas of specialisation or interests. PNAs who are given the PNA stamp of approval to advise and guide will be men of the highest possible calibre. The best of the best.

2. PNA will have a portal site for people to come to in order to discuss with each other their business plans, ask for advice and guidance, customer problems, you name it. The ‘Uncle Elmers’ of the world will dispense their wisdom and be paid for that time and effort by those who wish that consulting service.

3. PNA will offer law services in the English speaking world. The vision is that any man who has a criminal complaint against someone can come to PNA and we will resolve that complaint via a jury trial system which I will personally oversee and ensure is open, transparent and honest. In short? I will offer a competing service to the lawyers and guvments. We can have a slogan. “Fire a lawyer today”.

4. PNA will provide the service of getting the guvment OUT of your life and out of YOUR business. The guvment will have no place in YOUR life or YOUR business.

5. PNA associates will have an obligation to support other associates who are in trouble with the guvment and ask associates for assistance. To refuse this obligation will be to be removed from the association and have all your PNA services such as web sites shut down. I am sick of asking men for assistance and getting none. I will not allow any man to use the label PNA who isn not prepared to assist his fellow associate.

6. PNA will find men who are experts in their fields of specialisation and sell and market their skills in such as way as they can improve their own incomes and influence across the world.

7. PNA will be global and we will find trusted associates in each country where the language is not english.

8. PNA will very, very severely penalise those PNAs who commit crimes. We will ‘self police’. An associate who is the victim of a crime by another associate will have a processs of coming to me personally and I will personally run the de jure court process. The jury will consist of a 12 man associate jury. The ‘loser’ of the case will be required to pay the costs of the court case. Penalties will be up to and including siezure of all property and outlawing of the associate depending on the crime. I will not allow crime by a PNA.

9. PNA will interface to the World Service Authority and associates will be able to avail of the World Passport, World Identification Documents. PNA will support associates world wide 24×7 on a single call Skype name and single call help number. I mean ANYWHERE ANYTIME. An associate is in trouble from criminals? PNA will bail him out. Period.

10. PNA will provide ‘lawful protection services’. This will be the ability to call on PNA to carry out remedy instructions issued by the PNA Law Services or any court that is properly convened and is approved by me, personally, in issuing Remedy Instructions.

11. PNA will interface to the World Service Authority. It will interface to the United Nations.

12. PNA will be a common law based association with very, very severe penalties for perjury. The law being defined as the jury trial of 12 fellow associates.

13. PNA will not allow ‘tire kickers’. You will choose the PNA way or life or you will not. Period.

In short the PNA vision is to be a global association of men who provide an alternative way of life and way of doing business to the dictatorships that are now in place.PNA will provide the ability to defend those rights. PNA will welcome MGTOW. All participation will be voluntary and all commitments will be by oath. If a man does not see the value? Don’t join.

PNA will support worthy projects that benefit boys and men.

No woman will EVER be allowed to be a PNA. Not ever. Should a woman become a PNA via deceit she will lose all her property. We will sieze it from her as there will be an affidavit to sign to become a PNA to the effect that the man is a man.

Gentlemen. If you guys will not get off your arses to start your own associations? I will start mine and “lead the pack” as it were. I will be well paid for doing so. The opportunity has been there for some time. I don’t particularly want to run this association. But I can see no-one else wants to. So I will do it.

It will take some weeks to get set up. So watch this space. We shall see how we go.

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WickedVirtue June 17, 2011 at 06:29

PNA….

Bloody hellfire, my eyes just bulged out of my head.

Sign me up.

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Matt K June 17, 2011 at 06:57

OK, chaps. I happen to know the a very high up legal counsel for the EMEA for a large corporate. I know him on a non-professional basis and easily well enough that I can get honest answers on some of this stuff. For example, he has already said to me that his first question –the first one!– when a manager wants to fire someone is not ‘what did they do?’ but ‘are they female or minority?’ and that if the answer is ‘no’ his response is pretty much that the manager can do what they like.

From the most basic economics, all else being equal, companies should always be more likely to hire from such discriminated-against groups as they’re cheaper to get rid of should things not work out, so their reduced job security would be offset to a degree by having an easier time in the hiring process. However, Mr Lawyer says that as far as he is aware, that does not happen in his company.

Suggest some questions for me and I’ll ask him next time I see him. No guarantees, and it might take a few sessions with him over a few weeks but I’ll do what I can. (PS as far as I am aware, this guy will not be a mangina: he has a son & so will have an eye on the little man’s future.)

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Uncle Elmer June 17, 2011 at 07:42

Thanks for the commentary guys. Actually have a sales meeting today, well, someone wants to hire me on commission for sales engineering based on a recent Kramer-like performance that I will elaborate on later.

random comments :

“In smaller organisations, however, the first thing I need to know is, who is having sex with the boss, because it is always that person who has the ultimate power.”

Worthy of its own essay, surveying a company’s sex dynamic. Two words : Watch Out. If some chick is flirting with you there is about 100% chance some other (married) guy fancies that she is his property.

“What they are biased against is any employee that put’s the corporation at risk legally and/or publicly.”

And for older guys what this often means is that the HR lady will not hire you because you represent a higher degree of risk, which will reflect back on her. She will opt for the safe bet, younger more compliant.

“HR departments, whether gubmint or private, are often dominated by people who are well-trained in the feminist-dominated fields of psychology, behavioral sciences and law.”

Agree, infuriating for the tradesman or engineer. Someone posted this link in my last essay about HR chicks and their similarity to women’s list of factors in choosing a mate :

http://captaincapitalism.blogspot.com/2010/11/how-female-romantic-wish-list-for-men.html

“I just did your google search of salesman vs saleswoman. Wow, go vagocracy.”

We will see how long before Google Corporation gets wind of it and corrects this little “error”. In the past a google(invented by a woman) returned zero hits. Now you get thousands of “lists of things invented by women”.

“One of my head-woman references actually emailed me and asked that I take her name off my resume as a reference…”

You can work 10 years next to a dude and think he is your “friend”. When you get laid off he will act like he doesn’t know you. I asked a guy to provide a reference and the chickenshit called the company and said corporate rules forbad him from providing a reference. This after I supported his project for 3 years. Dudes that watch action movies every week and drive “hot” cars will piss their pants when someone asks them to just put in a good word for them so they can get some work.

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Uncle Elmer June 17, 2011 at 07:56

“Your approach will work. I know that because I’ve seen it work. And for those who want to work IN a large corporate I think it is the best approach and I would stongly support and endorse what you are saying. You have obviously ‘been around the block’.”

Thanks Peter. I am tool old to get a chair back in the corporation but am working for smaller engineering firms (dominated by men) that do business with them. So now I meet with the big boys whereas before was just a worker-drone. When I was in the corporation noticed that proposals/sales was closely guarded turf and attempts to get into it were rudely rebuffed by the entrenched. Saw this in two major corporations and other guys mentioned the same phenomenon.

One interesting aspect of sales engineering is that you step up to “strategic” level discussions, and if you have learned anything about talking with these guys they will take your words seriously.

I think the real players get control of organizations by following the methods I am talking about. If I had started this 30 years ago maybe I would be a millionaire and own a company or two. The best I can hope for now is a decent income. I am coaching my younger son Hermann about this paradigm.

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Opus June 17, 2011 at 08:44

You guys may get some mild satisfaction if I say that, on one occasion, I literally reduced an HR Ditz to tears. (Rather goes with the territory for a trial-lawyer). I wasn’t trying to do so, but I must say, now, it gives me some perverse satisfaction that I did so. Equality is so wonderful and it is just a pity Darwin (or God) failed to equip women for it.

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Opus June 17, 2011 at 08:53

I would also like to say – being a bit more to the point – that in my observation no one ever got fired from a job by reason of their (total or partial) incompetence. People only get fired because someone does not like you (sufficiently) and by the same token people only get employed not because of their intrinsic ability or suitability for the job but because someone likes you (for whatever reason, sexual or otherwise).

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Uncle Elmer June 17, 2011 at 09:58

True Opus. Techniques in Part III will enhance your “likeability” factor without being a phony about it. Just target who you want to like you.

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John Boy June 17, 2011 at 12:45

They say, “sales is the only job where you wake up every morning and you are unemployed”. The point being you have to continously prospect for new clients. The process is really no different in sales than it is in a job interview. You are simply selling your services to a potential employer instead of a client or customer. In fact, always look at your employer as you would a client. You can be an entrepeneuer while working for someone simply by understanding their bottom line and how you make them profit. Very handy to know during a layoff.

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Gunn June 17, 2011 at 14:26

Its not often that I think, about articles on this site, that “this guy is a fucking idiot”. Well done, Elmer, you are a fucking idiot.

So, per your ‘employment game’, whatever the fuck that means to you, young guys need to find entrepreneurs aged 50-60 who recognize them as the 1 out of 1000. Wow, thats a recipe and a half for success.

To the guys saying ‘great advice”, read back the article and ask yourselves, what actual advice is being proffered?

For all his stuff about self-sovereignty, at least P.A.N. offers constructive advice – learn a skill, learn it well, apprentice yourself to a master, and stick with even a low pay packet until you’re recognized as a journeyman in the field.

Elmer, on the other hand, is on a fucking ego trip, telling you how he’s the guy who can do shit, but without letting you know how you can get there too.

I sound angry about this shit, because quite frankly, I am. Young men are given too much bad advice these days, and I don’t expect that to be part of the Spearhead experience. You dropped the ball on this one Welmer.

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Zweihander June 17, 2011 at 15:14

From Opus:

“I would also like to say – being a bit more to the point – that in my observation no one ever got fired from a job by reason of their (total or partial) incompetence. People only get fired because someone does not like you (sufficiently) and by the same token people only get employed not because of their intrinsic ability or suitability for the job but because someone likes you (for whatever reason, sexual or otherwise).”

*Sigh* It’s as I feared and it still pisses me off. Time for me to stop being a floater on this site and just come clean. I know exactly what you mean by the experience of being shafted by female coworkers. It was about six weeks ago and I still can’t let it go. The sting of betrayal is like a cancer; it just slowly grows and grows and eats away at you and once you think you got rid of it it comes right back.

Here’s the deal: I got hired on by a mortgage servicing company (Orwellian for debt collector) in late February after looking for work for over seven months. I faithfully trudged through my assignments which were eye-straining, number-crunching analytical tedium in a cubicle cell assessing property values and equity for homes in danger of foreclosure. Whatever I was trained to do I did to the best of my ability to the letter. However, my immediate supervisor was a woman and a minority, and one of my colleagues was one of those giggly, tee-hee, valley-girl, blond, entitled princess types. The other was a guy who at first I thought was gay, since he spoke somewhat effeminately, but I found out shortly he was actually married. My honest mistake on orientation, but this guy would be the epitome of a p****-whipped mangina. I only realized in hindsight that he was playing double-agent against me to ingratiate himself with the devious, underhanded backstabbing broads.

Two weeks before I was let go, I noticed signs. Looks, glances, or the purposeful avoidance of looks and glances. It’s said that communication is 70-80% facial expression and body language instead of verbal, and I tell you that’s damn right. I would tell myself that I was just being paranoid, but I just couldn’t shake the uneasiness that I was being set up. It was confirmed a week before I was let go, when I was sent a “daily log” via e-mail, where we, or I was told we, had to catalog every single one of our activities and list how long it took for each one. Before I got to my desk to do this, Miss Blond Princess gave me a look and a smile which struck me as odd, because she never looked me in the eye. Once I saw the daily log I immediately put two and two together, I knew that she knew. Right away, I IM’ed a colleague in a different department if they had to fill out this micro-managing, time-wasting POS too and I was told no, of course not. So, then I ask my supervisor, Mrs. Fat Minority, what the deal with it was. I inquired if it was handed down from on top and I’ll never forget her answer, it was an exasperated, “Just do it!” Right then I just knew; my days there were numbered.

During this week, a couple other girls not in foreclosure, like the four of us, but still under the legal department and sitting in our cubicle subsection would give/avoid looks and let out a few laughs like they just couldn’t contain their mirth. And Mr. Candy-Ass Mangina, who pisses me off the most would IM me with affirmations of what I was doing; which then struck me as odd. He would never talk with me in person; only over the IM. What he said directly contradicted the criticisms of my supervisor, so it perplexed me. On the day I was let go, I found out something I couldn’t believe; my phone had NEVER been turned on to receive outside calls. I could call out and leave VM’s. But no one outside the office could call me. I even called with my cell to confirm it. An hour after I left work that day, I got a call from my staffing agency; that my assignment with the company had been immediately terminated and that I was not to return on Monday; not even to return my ID badge. I had to send that in.

To this day, I cannot get a straight answer on why I was let go. My staffing agency gave me BS company lines that were obvious farces such as “I made some mistakes and didn’t document them,” and “I didn’t take notes in my training,” which I did but not extensively yet what does it matter if I did my job right. When I tried to press my staffing agency on exactly, precisely, what mistakes I made they would hem and haw, beat around the bush, until saying they had to get another line but would call back. They still haven’t called back.

Understand, I was given no goals, no deadlines (I had to ask for them), and no evaluations. Resources that were allowed Mr. Mangina Tool, such as asking other department for information were forbidden for me by my supervisor. And the staffing agency was obviously no more than outsourced HR, clearly in bed with the bastard corporation and didn’t give a rat’s ass about me the employee. So, I’m trying to think of options. I can’t collect unemployment because I wasn’t there long enough and I’m not sure how effective suing for wrongful termination would be. After all, the law is in bed with the femskanks as well, so it would be an uphill battle and best and I have very limited funds.

Do you guys have any ideas?

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Uncle Elmer June 17, 2011 at 16:25

“Its not often that I think, about articles on this site, that “this guy is a fucking idiot”. Well done, Elmer, you are a fucking idiot.

So, per your ‘employment game’, whatever the fuck that means to you, young guys need to find entrepreneurs aged 50-60 who recognize them as the 1 out of 1000. Wow, thats a recipe and a half for success.

To the guys saying ‘great advice”, read back the article and ask yourselves, what actual advice is being proffered?”

—————————————–

I suggest YOU reread the two paragraphs qualifying the different approaches for younger and older men before calling someone else a fucking idiot.

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Bill Brasky June 17, 2011 at 18:13

“I just did your google search of salesman vs saleswoman. Wow, go vagocracy.”

Holy Sh*t. I’m unimaginably jaded, yet i couldnt believe my own eyes.

We live in a nightmare world of hate and lies.

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codebuster June 17, 2011 at 20:32

For all his stuff about self-sovereignty, at least P.A.N. offers constructive advice – learn a skill, learn it well, apprentice yourself to a master, and stick with even a low pay packet until you’re recognized as a journeyman in the field.

I’m curious Gunn. What country are you from? This is a mindset that is very typical of where I live (Australia), and it is based in the assumption that you’ve got to “pay your dues” (sounds very punitive, doesn’t it). This mindset (paying your dues) is utterly pervasive throughout Australia and it manifests in different forms. For example, I’ve worked as a sales engineer where the focus is on building relationships with everyone from the factory floor to management (a variation on what Australians refer to as mateship). What a load of garbage. I just want to sell. I don’t want to play footsies with dickheads just to make a sale. I have no dues to pay. I’m a skilled professional and I don’t owe anyone an explanation. That, I suspect, is the gist of what Elmer is also alluding to, in a world that is increasingly beginning to resemble a global penal colony.

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Anonymous June 17, 2011 at 21:45

I recently was asked by an interviewing staff member of an obscure service delivery organization to not return for my second day of employee training. Her rationale? She just didn’t “feel right” about me, and felt I wasn’t applying for the “right reasons.” This occurred after she became aware that I was applying for the sole purpose of fulfilling job duties, gaining experience in the field, and earning a modest paycheck to support ONLY myself.

So in this case the subjective impression of some old woman meant more than my credentials, experience, or work ethic. And having quantifiable, realistic goals was seen as antithetical to the organization’s “mission.”

God forbid some crone in power doesn’t “feel right” about you. And if a young floozy coworker doesn’t “feel right” about you, prepare for a charge of sexual harassment, because your next joke, date proposition, or hand on the shoulder just might create an “oppressive environment.”

Feminism has become an outright purging of normal men from the workforce under the guise of progressivism. The only way to integrate in a job setting is to act like a neurotic beta cuckold: seem obsequious to a fault. If you want to go your own way, be DISCREET around coworkers. This is a rebellion we’re waging. They aren’t going to pay you to undermine the society that keeps them fat and entitled.

All I had to do to lose my shot at an easy job was to make it known that I was there to: 1. do the job, 2. gain experience, and 3. make ONLY enough money for personal living expenses.

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Opus June 18, 2011 at 01:51

@Anonymous

I have considerable sympathy for your plight. As you will have observed; facts (doubtless being an oppressive tool of “The Patriarchy”) are an irrelevance, and the only thing that ever matters are her “feelings”. Feelings however (as Schopenhauer obseved) change – all the time. Women either take an instant dislike (which may at some later point instantly change to its opposite) or instant like, in which case she will probably be propositioning herself sexually to you before you have even left the first interview.

It might reassure you if I observe that in the days when there were Harems the only males allowed in were the Eunuchs. Feminised Corporations are just a new version of the Harem (or Convent – it’s the same thing).

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Bill Brasky June 18, 2011 at 06:42

This article is excellent.

I understand the gripes about it not being realistic for the masses, but today a young man with above average intelligence and work ethic, sans engineering degree, needs to know this.

My crazy ex GF is in HR, and she fits all the stereotypes. Domineering, hardcore daddy issues, talking about getting her “phd” now, although she writes like an 8 year old. Got “raped” by a guy when she was a virgin, then fucked him for a year or so before a former white knight showed up. Fuck…

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Uncle Elmer June 18, 2011 at 06:51

“So in this case the subjective impression of some old woman meant more than my credentials, experience, or work ethic. ”

After a few encounters like this I realized it was pointless to pursue work through the advertised job search channels.

What Gunn says about developing trade skills works in the old model, but these days there may be little chance that work will be available after becoming a master.

My essays are about marketing your skills not acquiring them. The topic of finding your career talents and interests is worthy of its own series of essays, more so now that the education system has also been feminized.

My son Hermann got his GED and is now taking machine tool classes. In my last gig there was an old journeyman tool and die man who offered to talk with my son to tell him how the industry works. Now that Hermann has a little understanding I need to invite that old guy over for a beer.

Most guys cringe at the thought of having to perform the marketing function just to find a job. Once they find long-term work, what skills they had for selling themselves atrophy. If they get laid off it is a real struggle to act out the sales role to find new work, and hitting the new feminized employment structure can be demoralizing.

“I’m a skilled professional and I don’t owe anyone an explanation.”

That is what is so infuriating about it. In the feminized model, instead of telling some guy you have X years of experience at some craft and are available starting in two weeks, you have to jump through hoops devised by women to measure subjective qualities that are easily interpreted to exclude you.

A guy who did some carpentry for me also had some psych background and applied for a job as a counselor. He was on older chap with a lot of life experience who probably had a lot to offer men in need of counseling. He respected me enough to use me as a reference and some woman called me up asking a bunch of questions about him. I could sense the disdain and suspicion in her voice, but I tried to put forward a good case for him. I never heard form him again; I suspect he drifted off into oblivion. Doubtless the job went to some young chick with zero life experience but plenty of psych coursework about how the world works.

If I sound too “salesy” it’s just to get your attention on the need to change your understanding on how the process for gaining employment has become feminized and that you need to recognize different channels to get the job.

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Uncle Elmer June 18, 2011 at 07:20

Another thing I am hearing in the comments and have witnessed myself is that ordinary men in the feminized corporations are in such abject fear of getting terminated for subjective reasons that they accept the necessity to act like neutered betas to survive.

I have known former military men, ski racers, college baseball jocks, martial arts dudes, you name it, being in total terror of the corporate feminarchy. In their leisure pursuits they perform dangerous acts but on the job they are totally cowed.

In one corporation I worked the dept manager was a former Army colonel who should have been buds with rowdy Army vet Elmer, but he openly disdained me. We had a lesbian group leader, an openly gay group leader, and some generic “career-women” leaders. And he sucked up to them completely. The man had a military pension, why the need to be subservient to the diversity mob? That was the corporate mandate and he felt obliged to comply. A team player.

And the gay dude didn’t like me either. But he was open about his desire to bone the handsome young blond new grad on my team. Positively swooned whenever the kid was within range.

The software we were developing was a complete mess by the way. The whole point apparently was to build software to retire on. I’m no code genius but I suggested a standard POSIX function as an answer to one issue and was roundly ignored. They hacked on their own concept for months until they came up with an answer and one guy who worked for me said at the meeting “That’s what Elmer suggested a year ago.”

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Uncle Elmer June 18, 2011 at 07:48

After I got voted off the island I noticed that the corporate web site had a group photo (the classic overhead foreshortened perspective shot) featuring the white-haired colonel, the one black male manager, a couple of corporate-attired women, and a lesbian mex-chick technician in smiling “team-player arms folded” pose.

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Opus June 18, 2011 at 08:59

Maybe the sort of people who read The Soearhead are a certain type of person.

I recall one interview where (not withstanding my C.V. which they had and from which they knew my qualifications and therefore my skills and abilities) they chose to ask me some technical questions. On being asked some technical question, I replied, (because I was used to and half-suspecting this stupidity) without so much as batting an eyelid, that I had passed my professional qualifications some time earlier, to the satisfaction of The Lord Chancellor as they could see and that I did not therefore come to interviews for the purpose of being retested, and that if my qualifications were not good enough for them they should not have invited me for interview. End of interview; more or less, not that I cared, but I do not take kindly to that sort of stupidity, where one must conclude that they either have no idea what to ask me, or where (as was the case) there was no need for an interview in the first place.

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Uncle Elmer June 18, 2011 at 11:53

“there was no need for an interview in the first place.”

After getting ejected the last time I did some contracts then got wind of a job for the old company at a different site. Since I was “legacy” they had to interview me. I was just eager for the job which I was qualified for.

The interview consisted of 3 phds, a top-level manager, and a woman “Engineering Manager”. When we started she said this was a new kind of scenario/situational style interview, and that she would ask canned questions to which I was to respond, with them asking questions afterward.

She started asking the situational questions and after I would respond she would ask the others “any questions?” to which there was complete silence. The phds appeared not to want to piss off the high-level alpha. The interview dragged on for an hour as I sank lower and lower, incrementally revealing aspects of my character to people who clearly didn’t want me. The questions were designed to get me to blab about me.

In retrospect :

I violated the sales rule : he who reveals the most about himself, loses.

And instead of playing their rules I should have grabbed control of the interview to make a sales pitch and split. Granted, I should have recognized that I had no chance. It would have been better if they had just told me “get lost”.

But when you’re a job seeker you walk in hoping to say the right things and believing that you will get hired if you follow the rules. There comes a time when you gotta break the trance even if it means losing the gig. The next opportunity may just fit perfectly with your new attitude.

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Charles Martel June 18, 2011 at 11:57

Good article. My own take on this is that feminism has exacerbated a problem that already existed. Namely, that the schemers will always best the doers in any non-entrepreneurial organization.

Jerry Pournelle defined this problem in his Iron Law of Bureaucracy: In any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people: those who work to further the actual goals of the organization, and those who work for the organization itself……The Iron Law states that in all cases, the second type of person will always gain control of the organization, and will always write the rules under which the organization functions.

Women don’t invent, innovate or take risks. Many corporate women don’t actually understand what their employers do or the reason for their company’s existence (to make a profit).

So just as women are natural socialists, totally comfortable with the idea of spending other people’s money, they are also natural bureaucrats, focused on internal politics and on the creation of ever more byzantine rules and processes.

Joseph Tainter, in his book The Collapse of Complex Societies, described the end point of this ever-expanding bureaucratization. “Societies collapse when their investments in social complexity and their “energy subsidies” reach a point of diminishing marginal returns.” In other words, when too few people are doing real work, supporting legions of non-productive “workers” in bureaucratic non-jobs, something has to give.

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oddsock June 18, 2011 at 16:26

Charles Martel

“In other words, when too few people are doing real work, supporting legions of non-productive “workers” in bureaucratic non-jobs, something has to give.”

Correct. This is exactly what we are seeing in all the developed countries.

As I mentioned in a previous thread. This was also said to me by a Union Official when discussing the effects of Maggie Thatcher destroying the UK industrial infra structure and the old apprenticeship system.

“At some point they will have to accept that we will still need some fecker who can actually pick up the paint brush and paint ”

You see, everywhere I have worked there has been a large and ever increasing army of female non jobs created to service some monitoring quality or audit trail. The people that actually make something to sell are few and far between and even these can hardly function because of the requirement to keep the non job army in employment. The part that really gets up my wazoo is that most of these female little hitlers think they are superior to a skilled craftsman.

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Zweihander June 18, 2011 at 16:39

@KMitch (or anyone else who has an answer):

Regarding a degree in engineering–roughly how long would that take if I already have a graduate degree in Public Admin.? (really a degree in Marxist, feminazi, multiculti BS). It’s a degree for local gov. but jobs in those positions have virtually disappeared and the few that are left go to those who have an “in.” (Elmer’s comments on how HR is merely a cover was an epiphany)

Speaking of HR, it’s been a constant barrier for me as my resume just becomes “lost” in a slew of others and I hardly even get an interview.

Back on point, since I could probably find employment with just a Bachelor’s in Engineering based on what y’all are saying, I could probably avoid taking all the non-core classes again and just take the specific degree courses which would save some time. Also, financing is an issue; I have already approx. $50k in student loan debt. I’m thinking that unless I can expedite the process I should train up in a technical field or trade at a local community college. It would still take time but it would be more affordable. I just got to get out of debt and be able to support myself; I’d be content with that at least for the time being.

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oddsock June 18, 2011 at 17:00

Zweihander

My two pence worth. A lot depends on your own abilities and interests. Engineering covers just about everything in the known universe. If you are more inclined to be a paper pusher type engineer I would suggest something that will keep you office based for most of your time. I have known quite a few of these paper tigers. None of them could even manage to knock a nail in straight. Probably why they chose office type engineering.

If you prefer to get your hands dirty? I would suggest something along the lines of mechatronics. Quite a few college/uni’s run such a degree here in the UK. It maybe called something different? They are trying to cater for the engineer of the future. As the name suggests it is a mixture of robotics electronics mechanics with a strong CAD/CAM element.

As I am unsure as to where you would follow an engineering degree? I can only suggest routes available here in the UK. Perhaps start on a lower level course that is considerd first or second year of a degree and can be used as a follow on to the next stage. This way you can get some real hands on experience, e.g. Mechanical & Production engineering at a BTEC level to start with.

If none of the above appeals to you I would strongly suggest a trade school but dont expect to do 13 weeks and come out a craftsman. Again, you can still follow mechanical machining plant weld/fab or perhaps the building trades ? At least then you can decide if you want to move onto a degree but with skills you can use and sell if you don’t.

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Charles Martel June 18, 2011 at 17:03

<blockquote.The people that actually make something to sell are few and far between and even these can hardly function because of the requirement to keep the non job army in employment. The part that really gets up my wazoo is that most of these female little hitlers think they are superior to a skilled craftsman.

Well, here’s a nightmare scenario for you. Maybe this upside down pyramid of hordes of useless government “workers” and corporate bureaucrats is sustainable for longer than we imagine.

In 1870, more than 70% of the US population worked in agriculture. Now, that number is less than 3%. This was made possible by male ingenuity in the invention and manufacture of farm machinery.

Over the last century, the same male ingenuity has been applied to every human economic activity. In the US, manufacturing employment has been declining for 50 years while manufacturing output has increased. Output per worker in US manufacturing has increased 38% in the last decade alone. US manufacturing employment has shrunk from 17 million to 12 million over the same period.

We’re moving towards a world in which there are very few real jobs as you and I understand them – jobs that have immediate tangible outputs. This is not a world that favors traditional masculine skills. It’s the world of the paper-pusher, the bureaucrat, the corporate politician. There’s no doubt that these ongoing economic structural changes favor women over men.

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oddsock June 18, 2011 at 17:15

Charles Martel

“Well, here’s a nightmare scenario for you. Maybe this upside down pyramid of hordes of useless government “workers” and corporate bureaucrats is sustainable for longer than we imagine.”

Yes, I agree, to a point.

Everything you mentioned we can and have observed. Having said that, IMHO the spanner in the works will be resources and perhaps polution?

We just simply cannot keep producing stuff at this rate. Its simply impossible. Perhaps we really have reached peak oil? We have certainly reached peak finance. I suspect what we are now seeing is a slide ( I hope it’s a gentle slide) back towards agriculture and a more simple less consumeristic life style.

One thing I am sure of. One way or another the earths resources will run out.

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Charles Martel June 18, 2011 at 17:20

@Zweihander

Regarding a degree in engineering–roughly how long would that take if I already have a graduate degree in Public Admin.? (really a degree in Marxist, feminazi, multiculti BS). It’s a degree for local gov. but jobs in those positions have virtually disappeared and the few that are left go to those who have an “in.”

My guess is that it would be much easier for you to find a job in your field if you were not male, or were some other minority. I suppose that goes without saying.

If I were a young guy in your situation I would move to North Dakota. Thanks to the enlightened policies of state government and thanks to the Bakken oil formation, there’s no recession in North Dakota. More of an economic boom with lots of available jobs actually. I’m sure you could find work there, maybe even in your field. Then, if you wish, go to school part time or in the evenings to learn something useful.

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Charles Martel June 18, 2011 at 17:31

@oddsock

We just simply cannot keep producing stuff at this rate. Its simply impossible. Perhaps we really have reached peak oil? We have certainly reached peak finance. I suspect what we are now seeing is a slide ( I hope it’s a gentle slide) back towards agriculture and a more simple less consumeristic life style.

Peak oil is one of the two great hoaxes of the late 20th century. The other, of course, is global warming. The purpose of both hoaxes is to fool the ignorant masses into supporting public policies that are NOT in their best interest.

The planet is stuffed full of simple hydrocarbons, primarily methane. Crude oil is a naturally-occurring substance, formed by polymerization of simple hydrocarbons at great depths in the Earth’s crust. There’s an infinite supply of crude oil. It’s well-know in the oil industry that depleted oil reservoirs slowly refill. The Western explanation for this phenomenon is horizontal migration of oil. The correct explanation is that depleted reservoirs refill from BELOW.

The Russians have understood this for more than sixty years, which is why Russia is the number one oil and gas producer in the world.

The ONLY oil supply problem we have is that some of the really easily accessible oil reservoirs – on land and close to the surface – have been depleted.

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Bill Brasky June 18, 2011 at 18:04

“There’s an infinite supply of crude oil. It’s well-know in the oil industry that depleted oil reservoirs slowly refill. The Western explanation for this phenomenon is horizontal migration of oil. The correct explanation is that depleted reservoirs refill from BELOW”

Absolute, utter, and complete BS.

“The ONLY oil supply problem we have is that some of the really easily accessible oil reservoirs – on land and close to the surface – have been depleted.”

Why havent they been refilled by earth’s oil filled core you claim exists?

Our civilization is built on the extremely cheap, easy-to-get oil that has been largely depleted.

There is a great deal of it left, but it is getting increasingly expensive and dangerous (see deepwater horizon) to extract.

The concept of Energy Returned on Energy Invested is paramount in understanding this. It’s not about how much is down there, its about how much energy it takes to get each new unit of energy out of the ground.

This ratio has gone from 1:100 in the early days to extremely dismal ratios that I dont have in front of me at the moment. Suffice it to say, they dont compare.

http://www.yesmagazine.org/planet/peak-oil-a-chance-to-change-the-world

You need a wakeup call with regards to the health of our planet as well. Look up great pacific garbage patch. Even is AGW isnt real, and it probably is (according to those who spend their lives studying these things) our way of life is utterly unsustainable and headed for a spectacular collapse.

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Uncle Elmer June 18, 2011 at 18:25

Zweihander : “*Sigh* It’s as I feared and it still pisses me off. Time for me to stop being a floater on this site and just come clean. I know exactly what you mean by the experience of being shafted by female coworkers. It was about six weeks ago and I still can’t let it go. The sting of betrayal is like a cancer; it just slowly grows and grows and eats away at you and once you think you got rid of it it comes right back.”

————————–

Your post was stuck in moderation for a day. I have had similar experiences. It can be hard to accept that people can be so vicious but everyone should be aware that the potential exists in any work situation.

Your only choice is to move forward. Your questions about engineering are a good sign that you are looking for a way out. This will be a long road, but festering in a crappy work situation can kill you.

Despite the injustice of it all, you need to develop a “ready reply” about this situation so you can replay it easily if asked in an interview. Reinvent the gig as just a short term contract that you did and put a positive spin on it. Either that or strike it from you work experience and don’t mention it.

I’ve told my boys in an interview always talk up your last gig, even if you were in the penitentiary “I liked how everyone pulled together to work as a team, what a great bunch of guys!” etc etc. Don’t badmouth former situations, no matter how badly you were treated.

Yesterday my son Hermann asked me “Dad, when did you start hating everything?”

I said “Oh, about the age of 12 or so”.

He said “Yeah, about the same for me. Why is that?

I said that negative experiences tend to stick in your mind about 10X stronger than any pleasurable one. Bad events will surface and haunt you whereas pleasurable ones are difficult to recall. It’s just how the brain works and probably a survival mechanism. I said that it is one of the challenged of life to not let your mind feed you a lot of negative thoughts because it will do it unchecked if given the opportunity. It’s damn difficult to shut it off and just exist.

So in your upcoming work interview be aware that you can fall into this trap when they ask you to “tell us about a time when you didn’t work up to your peak performance”.

This also gets back to not playing their game and taking control of the interview.

There are some books out there on standard interview questions and it can be a good exercise to read through them to develop your script. Probably these things are on the web.

OK I looked, there’s plenty. Google( standard interview questions )

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Charles Martel June 18, 2011 at 19:09

@Zweihander

I can’t collect unemployment because I wasn’t there long enough and I’m not sure how effective suing for wrongful termination would be. After all, the law is in bed with the femskanks as well, so it would be an uphill battle and best and I have very limited funds.

Forget it. I’ve done some hiring and firing in my corporate career and the bottom line is you can fire an employee for a good reason, a bad reason or no reason, as long as you don’t violate their civil rights. As you’re a straight white male, you have no civil rights.

I was fired once because my boss was stealing from the company and I turned him in to the owners. I was fired from a different job because I saved my company $3 million and embarrassed my boss, the CEO, in the process.

Every young man should know their corporate career will be over by the time they are 50. You need to plan for this by developing skills that allow you to earn a living independently in some way. Cue Uncle Elmer.

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Uncle Elmer June 18, 2011 at 20:19

“Every young man should know their corporate career will be over by the time they are 50. You need to plan for this by developing skills that allow you to earn a living independently in some way. Cue Uncle Elmer.”

You are correct sir! There will be no gold watch for most of you guys. I got laid off on my 50th birthday. The thing that pissed me off the most was that I should have continued my extended Christmas/New Year’s break in SE Asia where I was having a riotous good time, I tell you what. But I came back and they “let me go”. Took my 401K and went straight back overseas and eventually married a nice, traditional vietnamese lady. In the four years since I developed my concepts of Employment Game, though had many experiences before the corporation that provided useful, though painful, lessons.

As for litigation, I agree, forget it. Focus on putting food on the table and not getting embroiled in a long lawsuit where you might end up paying most of your award (if you get one) to the lawyer.

And many states are “at will”, meaning they can fire you for any reason, any time. Understand this and adopt the attitude that they don’t owe you anything, because they don’t. It’s the law.

Learn to walk out like a pro.

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Lee Raconteur June 19, 2011 at 04:42

To hell with the companies in the USA.

You will only sell your soul for a paycheck.

Leave or start your own business, but don’ t work in the corporate femocracy.

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Quartermain June 19, 2011 at 06:39

There has a time or two when I got the feeling that I was being weeded out, I would just simply say “May we end this interview?”

Of course I didn’t get the job but I had satisfaction of taking the power of the interview away from them.

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Charles Martel June 19, 2011 at 11:28

@Bill Brasky

You need a wakeup call with regards to the health of our planet as well. Look up great pacific garbage patch. Even is AGW isnt real, and it probably is (according to those who spend their lives studying these things) our way of life is utterly unsustainable and headed for a spectacular collapse.

I know you don’t recognize it as such, but that’s just unreconstructed propaganda from the feminist-environmental complex. The ONLY thing that’s unsustainable about our way of life is out-of-control government spending and the ever-increasing wealth transfers from the productive to the unproductive.

I remember reading Paul Ehrlich’s “The Population Bomb” in the 1970s. Ehrlich predicted that 50 million Americans would starve to death before the year 2000 because our way of life was “unsustainable.” LOL.

Anyway, sustainability. How do you measure the availability or scarcity of something? By its price, right? Well, the inflation adjusted cost of gasoline has been between $1.50 and $4.00 a gallon for almost a hundred years. The golden age of low gas prices was the 1990s. We’re at the upper end of the historical range now, but the current oil price is nothing special.

http://www.inflationdata.com/inflation/images/charts/Oil/Gasoline_inflation_chart.htm

Why havent they been refilled by earth’s oil filled core you claim exists?

Good question. Simple answer. Depleted oil reservoirs refill SLOWLY. How slowly? Well, that depends on their location and their relationship to the underlying geological structures.

I understand why you have a problem with this. The Western scientific community has a huge investment in the idea of oil as a fossil fuel. It’s career death for a scientist to stray more than a few inches beyond the boundaries of current scientific orthodoxy.

How then, do you explain that Russian-Ukrainian oil theory accepts that oil is abiotic – a naturally occurring substance?

http://www.gasresources.net/Introduction.htm

If you’re a Western scientist, the answer is you don’t try to explain it. You ignore it, you ridicule it. You stick your head in the sand and ignore that the Russians are drilling super deep wells that go way deeper than the biogenic source rocks of Western oil theory. You also ignore the fact that Russia, long-regarded as having little potential for oil production by the West, is now the world’s #1 oil and gas producer.

But Western oil orthodoxy is beginning to crack. A research team from UC Davis, Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory and Shell Projects & Technology recently published a computational study in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences that shows how methane polymerizes at high temperatures and pressures to form hydrocarbons with multiple carbon atoms.

http://newenergyandfuel.com/http:/newenergyandfuel/com/2011/04/20/an-idea-on-where-petroleum-comes-from-improves/

An article at New Energy And Fuel describes how UC Davis Professor Giulia “Galli and colleagues used the Mako computer cluster in Berkeley and computers at Lawrence Livermore to simulate the behavior of carbon and hydrogen atoms at the enormous pressures and temperatures found 40 to 95 miles deep inside the Earth. They used sophisticated techniques based on first principles and the computer software system Qbox, developed at UC Davis and LLNL.

The team found that hydrocarbons with multiple carbon atoms could form from the methane molecule with only one carbon and four hydrogen atoms. This needs temperatures greater than 1,500º K (2,240º F) and pressures 50,000 times those at the Earth’s surface; conditions found about 70 miles below the surface.”

Anyway, huge topic and an enormous paradigm shift for anyone psychologically invested in white man bad, noble savage good, global warming, etc. A large red pill – difficult to swallow.

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Bill Brasky June 19, 2011 at 13:35

Charles,

Quite a response….you are more up on the subject of abiotic oil than me, obviously. Civility and reasoning always catch me off guard too, hah.

H0nestly, I don’t know what to make of the Russian info that has been coming out. As you guessed, I have only heard it ridiculed.

The first response that comes to mind is that the concept of peak oil can be applied to any resource our world depends on. The implications of peak phosphorus for the ability of the evil white man to feed the hordes is pretty interesting. Others include fresh water, rare earth metals (and now metal in general, especially copper), plutonium, etc.

Having the wrong timeframe didn’t make the limits to growth people wrong. I like to use the analogy of those high school shop class bridge building projects. If you add a pound to the balsa bridge every year, you could be well over its safety factor for decades before it breaks.

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Charles Martel June 19, 2011 at 15:10

Bill:

Well, I’ll confess now that the Peak Oil idea has some merit, imho. As you said, a lot of the low-hanging fruit is gone. There’s plenty of oil out there, but it’s getting more technically difficult and more expensive to extract.

Where I really part ways with the Peak Oilers and the Global Warmers is in the conclusion that Something Has To Be Done. This mindset leads to ever-expanding and more intrusive government. If big government and big business can sell their phony green ideas to the masses, we will stand still and shut up as we are buried under ever more burdensome layers of taxes and regulation. I think of these forces as the Feminist-Environmental Complex.

What ever happened to our confidence in the invisible hand of capitalism? If oil is truly running out, its price will rise. When the price of oil rises, other technologies will become economically viable and the free market will implement them. Until then, every solar panel, every wind generator is just one more economic malinvestment, subsidized by the taxpayer to the benefit of some well-connected special interest group.

I don’t know for certain that oil is abiotic, btw, but I think it’s a mistake to dismiss this possibility out of hand. There’s too much interesting contrary data.

http://www.aapg.org/europe/newsletters/2008/06jun/techAbyssalAbioticPetrol.cfm

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Renee June 19, 2011 at 18:22

Firepower,
Employment is a breeze – if you’re a minority or female.
And, guaranteed if you’re both.

Wow….I’m both, and it has been HAAAARRRRRRD! Perhaps I’m in the minority in regards to black women and unemployment chances (although it seems that I see alot of blacks in job fairs where I live – VA), but still. When it’s presumed that something’s easy for a group of people, when it’s not or not that easy, we tend to want to make a clarification (think of Obsidian’s post…you know…THAT post).

So shoot, maybe I can find something here to help me out lol.

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Firepower June 20, 2011 at 11:30

Renee

Firepower,
Employment is a breeze – if you’re a minority or female.
And, guaranteed if you’re both.

Wow….I’m both, and it has been HAAAARRRRRRD!

well, step into the INternet Truth Machine:

what is your degree
how many black girls apply for the jobs YOU do
are you overweight, hot or average.

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Uncle Elmer June 20, 2011 at 11:48

“When it’s presumed that something’s easy for a group of people, when it’s not or not that easy, we tend to want to make a clarification (think of Obsidian’s post…you know…THAT post).”

—- —

Renee, the methods I describe will work for anyone. As this is a men’s site I am directing my talk towards them. You can benefit from what I am saying by ignoring the anti-feminist rants

In fact, I expect savvy women to listen and learn and end up competing with men using these tactics.

The first post I saw here by Obsidian demonstrated his sense of entitlement to a job. He projected a passive attitude towards attaining work and I called him on it.

He is not alone in this thinking, and many white folks have the same attitude.

However, I encouraged him to keep writing, blogging, and taking on all these Crackers. Our dustups were good for business anyway.

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Gunn June 20, 2011 at 13:34

@Codebuster

I’m from the UK. I’m not really talking about a punitive attitude; rather, I think that throughout time the things that are worthwhile take time to learn well.

I have a solid set of qualifications, which has meant that I’ve been able to get decent jobs throughout my career to date. What I dislike about this post is the sheer negativity, and worse, the defeatism. I have learnt to recognise bullshit in all its form throughout my career, and the worst jackasses are the ones that claim that they’re helping when all they’re really doing is ego-boosting themselves.

For what its worth, thats the impression I get here; this is the second post (presumably in a series) and so far, there is no real advice proffered; merely statements to the effect of “look at me, aren’t I fucking great”

ymmv

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Uncle Elmer June 20, 2011 at 15:54

“For what its worth, thats the impression I get here; this is the second post (presumably in a series) and so far, there is no real advice proffered; merely statements to the effect of “look at me, aren’t I fucking great””

—————————————

Kindly point out the exact statements I made to that effect and try not to be dyslexic about it this time.

You are talking again about qualifications and skill building and these essays are about marketing. I don’t know about the situation in the UK but many well-qualified men in the US have lost their jobs and have run into the wall of feminism that I am describing when they attempt to find new work.

I have excellent qualifications too, or is that more “look at me, aren’t I fucking great” talk?

I give you a thumbs up anyway. Stay tuned for part III, I look forward to your input.

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Renee June 21, 2011 at 12:25

Steps in the “Truth Machine”

Firepower,
what is your degree
Biology, minor in Space, Earth, and Atmospheric Sciences. Originally tried to find jobs related to the sciences but was unsuccessful. Then tried to find jobs related to administrative work. Have been told that there are such things as being TOO qualified.

how many black girls apply for the jobs YOU do
Ummm, no clue. I’ve applied to sales associate, administrative, receptionist jobs with no success. I can count on one hand how many times I was called for an interview.

are you overweight, hot or average.
Well right now I weigh 153-155 lbs and I’m about 5’5″ and I’m 27. I’m currently trying to go down to 120 (I never had to worry about my weight before so loosing weight is new to me lol). So I guess that makes me average (don’t know what your standards are).

Summary:
Graduated in 2008. Didn’t find a job until 2010. I worked as an office clerk working for the 2010 Census from Apr-Sept. In Dec I found a job as a customer service representative over the phone working for a vendor that was for Verizon Wireless. Lasted until Feb.

Now let me say, there are certain jobs that I will not do: waitress, call centers (which was my last job – it didn’t work out), fast food (my very first job outside church was at Dairy Queen – first and last fast food job). So in that regard, if I applied to these jobs, I probably would get one of them. But I know how I am and there are certain jobs that aren’t meant for me. In fact that was what my supervisor at the call center pretty much told me before I resigned (he was trying to give me a way out so I wouldn’t get fired lol).

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Renee June 21, 2011 at 12:28

Thanks for clearing that up Uncle Elmer ;)

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Uncle Elmer June 29, 2011 at 18:29

You’re welcome.

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Pogo July 11, 2011 at 13:56

Only one way out and that is self-employment. Work for yourself, make money, then hire whites and males (or heaven forbid! White males!) and see how competitive those other companies stay in the long run. You can make bank by simply staying small enough to avoid affirmative action and keeping your house clean. Need ideas for a business? Or just to make money? Be creative! 4 year ago a friend of mine simply bought $100 of ginseng seeds, planted them around the forest and in 3 years will have 250k(!!!!) of prime wild ginseng to sell to eager Chinese buyers… another started a free gloss magazine addressing superficial, quite useless “wimminz topics”. It takes all of 20 hours to write (restaurant review or product place) and photograph some superficial shit, put the biggest advertiser’s daughter in an article as a “model” (keep the advertisers happy) and collect 10k a month in ad revenue for this “thing” which he puts out at salons and restaurants. There is so much wealth out there today, just go grab it. I myself work in government for a nice, easy paycheck (grad degree in public admin.) and spend most of my time reading newspapers, the internet or planning my side business…

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uncleFred July 15, 2011 at 14:27

Hello Uncle Elmer,

Thanks for the pointer to this post I enjoyed it quite a lot. I’m in my late 50s. I am a partner in a small boutique high tech consulting firm. We sell to the fortune 50 and startups looking for heavy lifters. I was between out of a contract for about eighteen months a while back. The first gap longer than three weeks in my 30+ year career.

Your advice is solid. I doubt that I could survive the process to be a “real” employee, that’s one reason why I’ve gone the consultant route, although many of the problems are the same, we don’t get the personal questions and we focus on talking to the VP with the budget to spend and his senior people. We bypass most of the HR barricade, but we still have to deal with some of it.
My advice to older guys is the same as yours, find the guy that makes the hiring decision and get to him before you even talk with HR. That is the key, those people tend to care about competence not quotas or diversity.

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Gabriel July 22, 2011 at 20:18

I work in a call-center. I have over 22k of debts, 29 years old, law degree(s) and economics. Anyone interested to hire me ?

Seriously, it would add so much to this website to have a job section, attracting people who are in agreement.

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