Official Generation X Slogan – I survived the Abortion Holocaust

by Featured Guest on January 9, 2011

The following post was written by Justin who blogs at The Truth Shall Set You Free.

The title by itself is probably all the introduction this essay needs, but the subject just screams for a comment or two. I wonder if abortion had been legalized in 1947 instead of 1973, and 1/3rd of their generation slaughtered in the womb, if the Boomers would be quite as smug and full of themselves. Has there ever, in the entire history of the world, been another culture so evil that it slaughtered 3 out of every 10 of its own children, by calling them “choices”?

Herod was a real piker when it came to slaughtering babies.

Read it, and weep, as Justin did, and does.

Official Generation X Slogan – I survived the Abortion Holocaust

We should print bumper stickers and t-shirts. “I survived the abortion holocaust” is especially appropriate for the lucky ones born in 1981. In that year, the ratio of live births to abortions reached its nadir, at less than 7:3. Yes, incredibly, in 1981, for every 7 born, 3 were aborted.

I once told my college students: “I don’t know what your personal politics are, but when you get home tonight, thank your mother for being pro-life.” The first time I said it, just ad-libbing to be amusing, I was taken aback by the stunned looks on the faces of some of the young women in class. I got the impression they had never quite personalized it that way. Maybe they were girls who had already had abortions, and suddenly realized they had snuffed out a little life that could have been their own. I don’t know.

The ratio of 7 births to 3 abortions is surreal, almost unbelievable, but you can do the math for yourself. That ratio was fairly constant for almost 20 years. For about 2 decades, from the mid ’70s to early ’90s, the ratio of births to abortions hovered around 7:3 or 8:3. It truly boggles the mind.

In 1973, marking the beginning of legalized abortion for the whole nation (proclaimed so by the Supreme Court), the ratio was not even 4:1. Two years later, in 1975, it was already approaching 3:1. By 1976, it had shifted to 8:3. It would not shift back below 3:1 for over 30 more years, until 1999. An entire generation, the bulk of Generation X and the beginnings of the Millennials, absolutely decimated.

The absolute raw number of abortions didn’t peak until 1990, at 1.6 million. For the latest year I could find data, 2005, the number of abortions is still above 1.2 million. But the total number of births is also up, so ratio is now over 10:3 (3.431 to 1). Still an astounding number.

I still remember when I found out about abortions. I was 10 years old, watching TV with mom, and something came on TV that I asked her about, and she explained it to me. I cried. Literally broke down in tears just hearing about it. She explained it in the best clinical language she could, and she herself was a loudly liberal, feminist, and pro-choice woman at the time (she refused abortions for herself, but supported it politically).

The horrible irony is, how many women’s lives would have been saved, if they carried their baby to term rather than killing it? There are whole lot of young women out there, and I know a few of them myself, whose lives would have turned out infinitely better, had they allowed themselves to become mothers. My wife thinks there might be a causal connection there, that after their abortion, they were so emotionally and spiritual devastated, that they allowed themselves to slip into that nihilistic life of drugs, sex, crime, joblessness, homelessness, etc., that defines so many of our ruined young women today. For many young women, having a baby is the absolute best thing that could happen to them.

Pity the poor young women whose minds have been so warped that they think their eduction/career gives them a good reason to snuff out their baby’s life. Lord, how sad. As we have been told: “No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.” It is a promise given to us: “But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you”. Feminism is truly the trap of the anti-Christ.

Year — births:aborts ratio
1973 — 4.213
1974 — 3.517
1975 — 3.040
1976 — 2.686
1977 — 2.526
1978 — 2.365
1979 — 2.333
1980 — 2.325
1981 — 2.301
1982 — 2.338
1983 — 2.310
1984 — 2.326
1985 — 2.367
1986 — 2.370
1987 — 2.456
1988 — 2.460
1989 — 2.566
1990 — 2.598
1991 — 2.641
1992 — 2.671
1993 — 2.702
1994 — 2.796
1995 — 2.863
1996 — 2.867
1997 — 2.908
1998 — 2.988
1999 — 3.011
2000 — 3.091
2001 — 3.118
2002 — 3.169
2003 — 3.272
2004 — 3.365
2005 — 3.431
Calculated from:
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0005067.html#ixzz1A133xqAt
and
http://www.nrlc.org/abortion/facts/abortionstats.html

{ 101 comments… read them below or add one }

aharon January 9, 2011 at 10:32

That was a good knock to the side of the head. It does put things into a different perspective considering abortion from the perspective of ‘what if our mothers had the power to and did abort us?’

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Papa Smurf January 9, 2011 at 10:38

ha! well at least the millions of ‘aborted’ life forms didnt have to grow and be born into a world ran by femi-Nazi’s and their pussywhipped lackeys. while we the un-aborted/’mistakes’ get to put up with all their constant stream of bullcrap. I dont know how much abortions costs, but cant help the feeling of being shortchanged regardless.

always look at the bright side of life ;)

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Doggy January 9, 2011 at 10:43

On the bright side, fewer boys were raised by single feminist mothers. The reason the adult male suicide rate is so high is because of emotional trauma and abuse endured by boys being raised by single mothers. It’s probably a positive development that fewer mentally tortured manginas were born as a result “womens’ choice”

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F.M.R January 9, 2011 at 10:48

Im of two minds about abortion.

On the one hand, I get what your saying and from a moral standpoint I think its horrible that the rationalization hamster can go as far as deeming human life “worthless cells in da way uv my freedum frum patriarchee!”.

On the other hand, debating the issue has left me so apathetic to it that I almost no longer actually care. On the bright side, if she chooses to defy the consequences of her actions, it means no child support for me, and she can still pretend to be strong, liberated, empowered, etc.

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Elusive Wapiti January 9, 2011 at 10:59

This comment may get slammed in the moderation queue for all the links, but here goes:

The horrible irony is, how many women’s lives would have been saved, if they carried their baby to term rather than killing it?

A good question. There’s no doubt that those women who murder their fetus in utero suffer badly, both physically and psychologically. I blogged some time ago about a woman who hung herself after she aborted her babies. Granted, some of this may be selection effect, but still, abortion is far from risk free to the abortionette.

There will be some fellow here that wonder why we care about abortion…and here’s why: I am convinced that sex-selective abortion will be used primarily against male fetuses in the West. “Gender Disappointment” is apparently a malady that affects more than a couple AW.

And then there are also freakshows like this. How would you like to learn that your mother tried to snuff you out in utero–twice–and failed?

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zed January 9, 2011 at 11:19

from a moral standpoint I think its horrible that the rationalization hamster can go as far as deeming human life “worthless cells in da way uv my freedum frum patriarchee!”.

On the other hand, debating the issue has left me so apathetic to it that I almost no longer actually care.

And, now you understand the first “Holocaust.”

When the issue first began to be hotly debated, what group do you suppose was most zealously opposed to it? Seniors. They saw the first step onto the slippery slope that might one day lead to old people being defined as “worthless cells in da way uv my freedum frum patriarchee!”

Fast forward 37 years later and proposals are seriously being talked about to euthanize people over 70 – or at least deny them medical care.

The whole long debate over “when does life begin” was brilliantly illustrated by a joke told to me by a JAP (Jewish American Princess) – “For a Jewish mother, life begins when the fetus graduates from medical school.”

On a daily basis, the manosphere takes on the issues which arise from women considering men to be nothing more than manbots, or “worthless cells in da way uv my freedum frum patriarchee!” How can we be surprised at this, when they have been taught to consider their very own babies in that way?

If the culture gives women the right to terminate any group of cells that gets in the way of their “empowerment”, maybe that is all Matthew Winkler was to Mary Winkler. Maybe “life begins” for a man when the divorce decree is signed and the child support order is entered in the court record.

It is generally considered impossible to take only little sips from the poisoned cup.

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Disgruntled Classicist January 9, 2011 at 11:19

I’m pretty convinced that modern feminism is not real feminism at all. It tries to claim that there is not a difference between men and women, and that is just dead wrong. What they don’t seem to get is that the differences are a good thing. Men and women complement each other.

Feminists pressure the modern woman into denying her natural, maternal instincts like it’s an aberration. I’m constantly appalled by the selfishness of young women these days. It’s a real shame that everyone views the natural consequences of their sexual behavior as a punishment. The man will cry foul on child support laws, and the woman will bitch about losing her empty career. It’s like everyone is working against that helpless human life, brought about by selfish and irresponsible behavior. It truly is a holocaust.

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Survivor male January 9, 2011 at 11:31

I wasn’t aborted by my mother.
I was told regularly that I was a mistake. I got slapped, pushed, kicked, and thrown around my bedroom. I was sexually abused by a babysitter, and then told by my mother I was making it up. She also used to tell me she dreamed of slitting my throat.

Though my mother is a very sweet woman now, she has never brought up any of this with me and seems to want to pretend they never happened.

I am an upstanding and successful professional now but I deal with chronic anxiety and depression. I’m also completely unable to trust anyone.

I am happy I was not aborted, but some women should never be mothers and I had one of them.

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Peter-Andrew:Nolan(c) January 9, 2011 at 11:34

zed January 9, 2011 at 11:19
Fast forward 47 years later and proposals are seriously being talked about to euthanize people over 70…or at least deny them medical care.

Zed, the ‘demise pill’ reported in 1969 is on the way.

If you look at a place like the Ukraine which has been very successfully feminised? Men die a full 11 years earlier than women. There is no way the work force can pay for all the ‘old women’. If you look at the economics? The ONLY way for the Ukraine to be viable is to kill the old women. Period. Go look it up for yourself.

The Ukraine was a test bed for stalin in the 30s and it is a test bed again. November 08 (from my drunken memory memory) airplanes spayed areas of the population and more than a MILLION people developed a ‘new unknown disease’. Thousands died. And not ONE WORD was published in the western press. A country can have a PANDEMIC as a result of aerial spraying and NO WESTERN MEDIA reports this? I mean…AT ALL? I would have missed it to except my fav#1 was back home in the Ukraine when it happened and I was watching english sites about Ukrainian news.

Two words: ‘Logans Run’. There was a reason this movie was made. There is a depopulation agenda underway. Only a complete idiot could miss it. And that means about 99% of the population miss it.

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Carnivore January 9, 2011 at 11:36

I could say a lot, but will say this. Which baby, out of the millions aborted, might have discovered a cure for cancer? Or for Alzheimer’s? Or heart disease? Or a new energy source to decrease our reliance on oil?

I’m white, but what breaks my heart is how the black community has been devastated by abortion and yet, as a group, they continue to support the same politicians who are pro-abort.

A society which sees its people as a liability instead of its most valuable asset is doomed.

As zed indicated – this is just the start of the slippery slope. If a fetus is only a lump-o-flesh, like a wart, which can be excised up to the moment of birth, it won’t be long before the elderly and retarded and insane are also classified as a lump-o-flesh to be excised. Oh, and don’t forget, some have already said that those who don’t agree with the government’s agenda (including feminism) are “insane” (following the Soviet Union’s model). You can connect the dots.

And for the religiously inclined, I hear many flag wavers say “God bless America!”. Why should He? A nation which has murdered millions of its own, most defenseless members.

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Peter-Andrew:Nolan(c) January 9, 2011 at 11:38

Oops…November 2009.
http://www.americanchronicle.com/articles/view/128818

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Cloud January 9, 2011 at 11:42

Scenario 1 : If a woman has an abortion, it is not considered murder under American Law.

Scenario 2: If a pregnant woman has a car accident and the fetus dies, then she can sue the other driver for wrongful death.

The logic is that in scenario 1 it is the “woman doing it to herself”. But that is nonsense, because the doctor performs the abortion, not the woman. In both scenarios, someone else is killing the fetus. The only difference between scenario 1 and 2 is that the woman is allowing it in 1.

Thus, in America, you are not alive if your mother says you are not alive. In America, you are alive if your mother says you are.

This is kind of an extension of the absurd definition of rape. At this point, sex is rape if the woman changes her mind the next day.

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Peter-Andrew:Nolan(c) January 9, 2011 at 11:46

Is killing a woman who is f***ing you over in the family court ‘murder’ or is it just ‘late term abortion’?

Is killing Hillary Clinton ‘murder’ or ‘late term abortion’?

Hhhmmmm…..maybe women won’t like those questions being asked.

I bet the women will scream loudly at the idea that killing a woman is a ‘late term abortion’ while they scream out the other side of their mouth how they are ‘entitled’ to put their LIFESTYLE above the LIFE of their unborn baby. Hmmm…more lies and hypocrisy. Western women are totally repulsive to me in many way. Abortion is just one of them.

My mother told me every day in every way that she was delighted that I was born and she exhibited love to me in every day in every way….especially when I was ill or injured. Women simply do not do this now. The evidence is there for any man who looks. Women hate their children now so much they will use them as ‘mutilated beggars’ in the family court. The evidence for this is not refutable.

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MikkoAP January 9, 2011 at 11:48

A good article.

But we should also remember that for most of human history child mortality rates were enormous.

Far more children died before reaching adulthood than didn’t.

Through the scientific developments of hygiene and antibiotics it became likely that a majority of babies would reach adulthood.

I only point this out to argue against those, who would paint a rosy picture of life before legalised abortion.

No doubt abortions have caused massive loss of potential life as well as trauma for women who underwent abortion(/s) which hasn’t been widely discussed.

But if you compare the majority of human history to the situation after legalised abortion then, in terms of child survival rates, there’s not that much of a difference.

The main argument is about lost potential, not about a Garden of Eden ruined.

With modern technology, those aborted babies could have become decent, productive human beings.

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CashingOut January 9, 2011 at 12:07

Extending what Cloud and MikkoAP just said:

A lot of the defense for abortion is based in the typical “nature as guide” hypocrisy that feminists love to engage in, the general formula for this being “if something natural is pro-female, then we need to emphasize that it is a part of nature, and it is wrong to try to circumvent or deny nature. However if something natural is anti-female, then we need to ‘evolve’ past it, and ‘unlearn’ it somehow.”

Such is the case here: when defending abortions, most women point out that about a 3rd of babies are aborted by the mother naturally anyway, so it’s OK for science to come in and do what nature was anyway. Many of these are the same women who claim that sex roles and sexual desires are “learned”, not innate or genetic (in otherwords, it’s Hollywood that is telling you to like hourglass shaped women, not your hormones and your brain).

In other words, yet another absuridity of feminism.

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Opus January 9, 2011 at 12:49

Clearly a lot can be said about abortion – so I won’t – except this, that I have always thought that the ‘it’s my body’ argument, used by women, apart from having no basis, at least in English Law, is the most woeful, solipsistic, narcisistic piece of sophistry, but then we all know that reason (because of the rationalisation hamster) is not their strong point.

What I would be interested in knowing, is (because I care about women ;-) ) what are the general psychological consequences? I mean, you’ve had the abortion, put it out of your mind, the career is going well, then you’re made redundant, you’re not quite so young any more and you find the guys aren’t giving you the eye so often, you see your girlfriends all seemingly happily married with 2.4 children, growing prosperity and a good man (unlike the losers you meet). I ask, as I do not think that women are familiar with the emotion known as remorse, let alone guilt.

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Traveller January 9, 2011 at 13:32

10:3 = 3.333…
Where does it come from the number 3.431?

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Lovekraft January 9, 2011 at 14:18

Abortion, a topic that will open old wounds and expose our true beliefs.

While I have never known someone who has had an abortion, this doesn’t discount the fact that the women I have known hadn’t had one or knew someone who did. So this implies it is a taboo issue to bring up with a man.

This implies women do have a sense of shame, and abortion is still opposed vociferously. Still, feminists use this topic to push their UN agenda, comparing Congonese rape campaigns with the Western woman losing her standard of princess-hood should she become a Mother.

Western Women have tried to convince me that their ‘choice’ is theirs alone. That is their main platform, to which I reply that this is an action that should not be private, and since I am assisting it through taxes and benign acquiescence, it should be subject to debate in the open and without emotion.

So, feminists, I charge you with promoting senseless murder, thus tainting my culture. You are accountable for this decision and cannot hide behind ‘our bodies, our choices’ since abortion reflects upon my society.

If you don’t agree, then you are welcome to the slow and steady decline in moral certainty and consistency. I however will turn away, ghost, and maintain that certain actions are still subject to public scrutiny.

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mark January 9, 2011 at 14:19

Where I live, in Minnesota, there is a population of Somalis that is growing by leaps and bounds. The white women who agitated successfully for choice didn’t factor in a culture, such as Islam, which is only to happy to take on the role of breeder. Like it or not demography is destiny; if white women don’t breed then someone else will. As far as I see it this lack of ability to breed is simple, horrible evidence of a chronic lack of fitness ( in the Darwinian sense) in millions of women in our culture. Something didn’t click right in their development. I don’t know what it was but it happened.

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Opus January 9, 2011 at 14:23

Interesting Lovekraft:

I know three people who have had abortions. One did not mention it, the second confessed regret, and the third covered it up. Interesting to compare that with the bravada with which women boast of Rape!

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anons January 9, 2011 at 14:25

@ Cloud

“The logic is that in scenario 1 it is the “woman doing it to herself”. But that is nonsense, because the doctor performs the abortion, not the woman. In both scenarios, someone else is killing the fetus. The only difference between scenario 1 and 2 is that the woman is allowing it in 1.”

So when a Nazi officer ordered his subordinate to shoot a captured enemy soldier, he has a clear concience, just because he didn’t literally pull the trigger?

Doesn’t wash I’m afraid. Women hold all the cards over an unborn baby’s life.

If men could get pregnant, abortion would be classified as murder.

Abortion is just another pussy pass.

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Opus January 9, 2011 at 14:34

Thinking of abortion reminds me that my mother (and I am one of three) suffered a miscarraige. This upset her very much and was she made clear, also physically unpleasant. She did not choose for the ‘natural’ abortion of the foetus. How a woman can terminate a feotus at say seventeen weeks and not suffer mentally I cannot imagine.

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Binxton January 9, 2011 at 14:34

I have always thought that the ‘it’s my body’ argument, used by women, apart from having no basis, at least in English Law, is the most woeful, solipsistic, narcisistic piece of sophistry,

Creating life is a decision without which our world would become barren and non-existent. It is a decision requiring seriousness and purpose, and therefore must be led by men, with women in tow.

When you understand the ultimate purpose of reproduction, it is utterly laughable and insane that society decided to grant women this so-called “reproductive right.” What idiocy!

Women have no business deciding who lives and who dies inside her body. They have no business whatsoever deciding such matters determining the fate of human societies.

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Eric January 9, 2011 at 14:38

Abortion is, of course, the ultimate expression of the female supramicism accepted by most Anglo women. It’s a typical by-product of a gender who regards the other as an enemy and of no value other than as sperm donors.

You notice that all these Anglobitches who scream the loudest about ‘reproductive rights’ never seem to include things like fertility clinics, programs for stay-at-home mothers, or anything that implies actual male involvement. No, instead it’s about murdering our children then throwing the fetuses back in our faces, the ultimate triumph for these Anglobitch Amazons. Divorce laws that rob men of their children, funding for day care so that the single moms can slut around without the children’s father; are policies in the same vein.

What these abortion statistics prove, first and foremost, is that Anglo- American women are utterly unfit for motherhood. Their selfishness and misandry make them completely incapable of sustaining an intelligent relationship with a man.

The best way to prevent abortion is to avoid impregnating these bitches in the first place. Of course, they’ll resort to sperm banks or getting pregnant by the lowlife males they seem to prefer; but the intelligent men will be pursuing alternatives.

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Eric January 9, 2011 at 14:47

Mark & Lovecraft:

Preliminary census reports are again showing that the only marriage demographic increasing in the US is between American men and foreign-born women. So much for the Anglo-feminist lies about men and our supposed ‘commitment issues’.

Any woman who opts for abortion obviously has ‘commitment issues’ far transcending anything American men allegedly have.

What you say about the decline in our culture and female complicity in it is entirely correct. What the future is shaping up to look like in America is a major demographic shift; probably an emergent productive middle class of stable families but multi-ethnic in its composition. The new lower class will be a semi-savage class of offspring produced by feminised Amero-bitches and the lowlife males they consort with.

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Cloud January 9, 2011 at 15:00

So when a Nazi officer ordered his subordinate to shoot a captured enemy soldier, he has a clear concience, just because he didn’t literally pull the trigger?

Using feminist logic, the Nazi subordinate (abortion doctor) shooting the captured enemy soldier (fetus) is murder if he did it on his own volition. But it would be murder if the Nazi officer (the mother-to-be) told him (abortion doctor) to do it.

See my point? Under American law, a fetus is not alive if the mother tells the abortion doctor to end the pregnancy. But the fetus miraculously has the status of “alive” if someone causes the fetus not to be born against the mother-to-be’s wishes. It’s legal madness.

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Cloud January 9, 2011 at 15:02

So when a Nazi officer ordered his subordinate to shoot a captured enemy soldier, he has a clear concience, just because he didn’t literally pull the trigger?

Using feminist logic, the Nazi subordinate (abortion doctor) shooting the captured enemy soldier (fetus) is murder if he did it on his own volition. But it would NOT be murder if the Nazi officer (the mother-to-be) told him (abortion doctor) to do it.

See my point? Under American law, a fetus is not alive if the mother tells the abortion doctor to end the pregnancy. But the fetus miraculously has the status of “alive” if someone causes the fetus not to be born against the mother-to-be’s wishes. It’s legal madness.

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W.F. Price January 9, 2011 at 15:11

Using feminist logic, the Nazi subordinate (abortion doctor) shooting the captured enemy soldier (fetus) is murder if he did it on his own volition. But it would be murder if the Nazi officer (the mother-to-be) told him (abortion doctor) to do it.

-Cloud

Yes, this is one reason I have no sympathy for Rudolph and other killers of abortionists. Even if one accepts their value system, they are committing a grave injustice by shooting the abortionists, because the primary responsibility lies squarely with the woman who orders the abortionist to kill her child.

In fact, if a person is found to have hired a hit man to kill another, the person who contracted the hit is often punished even more severely than the killer, and it should be this way.

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Opus January 9, 2011 at 15:14

As a matter of English Law (if my memory serves me correctly ) a woman may terminate if two Medical Doctors certify that continued pregnancy would adversely affect the physical or mental life of the woman. That sounds reasonable, of course, but the strange thing is that no woman is ever (at least I have not heard of it) turned down for an abortion. The law is clearly flouted in that it is interpreted in the widest possible sense and certainly not as the well-meaning promoters of the Act expected or intended. The same of course goes for the Divorce/DV Law (also 1960s) and the redefinition of Rape (1990s).

I will refrain from comment thereon.

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John David Galt January 9, 2011 at 15:26

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555 Spinner January 9, 2011 at 15:39

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mark January 9, 2011 at 15:48

I am the guy who wrote about demography is destiny and I know whereof I write. I drive a school bus in suburban area in Minneapolis. I am old and retired and I have seen a lot. At the school I am thinking of, at least 50% of the school age kids are Somali. On one of my buses, a pleasant and usually well behaved Somali girl , age approx. 12, said the most amazing thing : “when I grow up I want to have lots of babies”. This child lives in subsidized housing. I know of parts of Minneapolis that are called Little Mogadishu because that is what they look like.
Perhaps not since the nineteen twenties in rural Minnesota did white children talk like that.
It is upsetting to hear this kind of talk from Somali children today, if only because all we hear is how restrained, selfless and concerned about the environment etc. etc. whites have to be. The Somali children are triumphalist; their sentiment is strangely reminiscent of the Nazi ideal.
This is going to be one weird time ahead.

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Opus January 9, 2011 at 16:07

Here come the trolls

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CorkyAgain January 9, 2011 at 16:18

Abortion IS a men’s rights issue.

As things stand today, the father has no say in the decision whether the fetus lives or dies. The mother gets to decide whether to abort the pregnancy or give birth to the child and saddle the father with 18+ years of child support obligations. I.e., he only gets to be a father on her terms, if at all.

Her “right to choose” even extends to naming a man as the father despite a failed paternity test. Courts have refused to allow that misidentification to interfere with her right to continue collecting child support from her unfortunate victim.

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CorkyAgain January 9, 2011 at 16:26

I should add: if she decides NOT to abort, he HAS to be the father, whether he wanted to or not.

Choice for her, none for him. How can that not be a “gender-equality” issue?

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Gx1080 January 9, 2011 at 16:27

Abortion is simple human sacrifice to the false idol of Feminism, one of the many shapes of Leftism.

I rather scream at the Internet that being a godless hedonist without hope.

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Anon January 9, 2011 at 16:30

Of interest to some of you gents may be the study of “Bioethics”.

Some of the implications are downright disturbing…. dig deeper.

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555 Spinner January 9, 2011 at 16:34

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555 Spinner January 9, 2011 at 16:37

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Eric January 9, 2011 at 16:54

555 Spinner:

Unfortunately for you feminists and mangina apologists, it is you who will ultimately die out; both by choice (abortion); and by attrition; as more and more sensible men realize that it’s American women who aren’t worth the waste of anyone’s time.

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The Caliph January 9, 2011 at 17:11

HOLY CRAP GM!!!!!!!!!

Now you’re denying the holocaust? How about i dont care whether it was 6 million or 6 000, mass killing of any group is madness. MALARCHY.

At the end of the day the world war hitler started killed some 60 million people.
Somehow, twisting a post about abortocaust into holocaust denial (at the end of the day large numbers of jews were killed, you can argue the figures semantics all you want) is the real HOGWASH.

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Malestrom January 9, 2011 at 17:36

Guy’s be disciplined, don’t feed the trolls. Just thumb down the comments for the convenience of future readers and move on.

But on to the issue at hand. The abortion epidemic is an abomination that I am greatly ashamed has happened during my time, seeing as how is it unquestionably the most heinous and disgusting atrocity which our species has yet committed. All my female family members know that if they ever had an abortion I would never speak to them again, I would regard them in the same ligh as an uncle that I found out had raped a toddler.

As others have said, no society that takes to the slaughter of it’s own unborn babies with the kind of enthusiasm and gusto that we have can possibly survive, and I for one am actually glad of that fact. I am glad that such a travesty is incompatible with civilizational survival, when I think of the fact that we in the UK massacre 250,000 unborn babies every year I actual feel happy that we’re on the decline. Our western culture is just too degenerate and wicked to be allowed to endure.

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Denis January 9, 2011 at 17:37

I’m a gen-xer and I really don’t think that “abortion” defines our generation. Gen-xers have lived their entire lives with feminism and women’s “equality”. I don’t understand how we continue to be blamed for any percieved (falsely or not) injustices of the past.

Abortion is a human rights issues. The only part that is relevant to men is the lack of men’s choice. Do we really want to go there? Do we want to demand an equal decision to abort, same as women? Do we want to demand an equal decision to force a woman to continue her pregnancy? That might make some social conservatives sleep better that they have saved some babies, but does it doesn’t really change anything for marginalized fathers that are discriminated against in family law.

I think it’s a red herring.

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555 Spinner January 9, 2011 at 17:54

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555 Spinner January 9, 2011 at 17:57

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Lovekraft January 9, 2011 at 18:05

@ 555 spinner:

Wow, you sure are on a roll today. Let me guess, you are stuck between the feminazis on one side, and traditionalists like we MRAs on the other.

Why don’t you just go back to your video games and leave these battles to the grown-ups.

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zed January 9, 2011 at 18:10

@ Anonymous Age 68,

I think it is about time for a repeat of your description of “destroyers.”

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Zorro January 9, 2011 at 18:11

What came first, the abortion or the statistics? From a realistic point of view, abortions were around before coat hangers were invented. Ancient cultures were replete with herbal remedies for “curing” this malady, and such cures still exist today in third world countries. Maybe we should evaluate the social mores instead of the Supreme Court rulings. I doubt that many of the young (or old) mothers-to-be consulted with the laws of the land before making their decision. Perhaps their priest, but then we would need to discuss the issue of how many illegitimate babies were born to nuns with those same priests as fathers? Maybe the compromise in the priesthood was to switch to young boys where that danger didn’t exist, just lifelong mental torture. Bottom line is that a woman will do what a woman wants to do, and whether the choice to abort is better than the choice to raise an unwanted child in an emotionally hostile and economically deprived environment is better, who is to say? The only thing we can say with certainty is that the statistics are inaccurate, that it has happened since the dawn of time, and will continue into the future farther than we can see.

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Aaron January 9, 2011 at 18:42

“Who gives a hoot?”
I do. Don’t you?

“Abortion is not a gender-equality issue”
“Gender-equality” is meaningless.

“(except to the small extent that hatred of women motivates the pro-life view)”
Boy, that’s a lot of people you’re generalizing there. I certainly don’t hate women, what about you?

“Legalize choice for men, and there will be more abortions.”
You mean for men to be able to decide for women? Who wants that?

“As there should be.”
Do you have kids? Are you queer? Do you have an underlying desire to control women (like a lot of fat, disgusting feminist women do) because you were / are a loser who can’t get any? I think that’s it.

Other person:

“I don’t give a fuck about abortion.”
Wow, you’re strong.

“It’s a dead issue.”
Declares the “hardcore” Internet warrior who types edgy things on forums on issues they admittedly don’t care about.

“You are never going to stop it.”
Wow, really? And here I thought stopping all abortion the World over for the rest of eternity was a realistic objective.

“Nor will you stop feminism.”
Wow, profound. That’s like saying, “Nor will you stop philosophy.”

“You will spent your life shouting at a computer screen and then die of a heart attack from being sedentary. You will regret coming to the spearhead and wasting so many days of your life tilting at windmills in the final seconds of your worthless lives.”

Here are some ideas:
1) don’t try to predict the future
2) don’t try to read people’s minds… in the future
3) be less dramatic and more rational
4) don’t project your crappy lifestyle and self-loathing onto others… or at least try to hide it better

“Now vote me down like the good little monkeys you are.”
I voted you up.

“That mouse click is about as much power as you’ll ever wield over society so enjoy it.”
I don’t know… I think I have a lot more power when I’m talking to other guys about how to straighten out their lives. Or when I’m an audio tech whom a few thousand people in part depend on to get what they came to hear.

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Anonymous age 68 January 9, 2011 at 18:52

This is one of the worst comment threads on here in a while.

We have a moron who says he was able to prove the Holocaust was hogwash in 15 minutes on the Web. What a genius! He is better at revisionism than the feminists are. In fifteen minutes, he is able to completely rewrite the well documented slaughter of millions of people. The Germans were excellent record keepers, and many government and camp records of the Holocaust exist today. It is not clear if he is mentally ill, or perhaps mentally ill, or maybe even mentally ill. No, perhaps I am wrong, and he is just mentally ill.

Then, someone else calls us good little monkeys. He probably has never picketed a courthouse or met with the governor of his state on men’s issues, but he calls people who have, good little monkeys. Oh, wait a minute, this must be something to do with the men’s movement. Sorry, I forgot.

>>The man will cry foul on child support laws, and the woman will bitch about losing her empty career.

Very few men on the planet object to feeding and providing for babies who live with them. Margaret Mead admitted this many decades ago. It is being ordered at gunpoint to send money in the mail to kids they don’t see that they get on their ears. Or, when the amount paid drastically exceeds actual costs, in some cases exceeds actual income, and may not even be used for the child.

>>I am an upstanding and successful professional now but I deal with chronic anxiety and depression. I’m also completely unable to trust anyone.

http://www.eftuniverse.com tells how certified practitioners send vets home who have been in vet hospitals for decades with PTSD.

A physical exercise program works better than anti-depressants. Fact.

A high percentage of people who try EFT find it really works. It may not be easy, but there are certified practitioners at the usual cost rate.

We went in to Mexico City for Christmas, and I forogt my Dramamine, which usually means I get very carsick on the bus. I did EFT on myself, one of the first times ever, and no dizziness or nausea at all.

>>I only point this out to argue against those, who would paint a rosy picture of life before legalised abortion.

You lost me there. Antibiotics came out over 30 years before abortion was legalized in the US. My siblings and I were born between 1937 and 1952, and in that period infant mortality was very low. I can’t even remember but one infant death after live birth among the people we knew. My eldest brother even survived bacterial meningitis, which is dangerous and scary even today in 2010. All 7 born alive still live today, 100%. It was in fact a rosy picture for anyone in the mainstream of working; middle; or upper class USA.

>>Now vote me down like the good little monkeys you are. That mouse click is about as much power as you’ll ever wield over society so enjoy it.

Do feel free to tell us about the power you have over society. I am easily impressed.

Actually, IMO those who resort to name calling on Men’s URL’s are probably closer to the lower primates, but what do I know.

Glad to see your goat is that easy to get.

>>Do we want to demand an equal decision to abort, same as women? Do we want to demand an equal decision to force a woman to continue her pregnancy?

New to the Men’s movement, I can tell. No, we do not wish to harm a hair on the head of a baby, born or unborn, nor do we wish to force women to do anything they don’t want to do. We want men to be able to simply reject any responsibility for any baby by filing a legal document, even our own biological offspring, just as women do via abortion deaths or adoption. I do not mean to be critical as such.

Such a law would bring women to the negotiating table on abortion very fast. To get women to give something up, you have to be able to take something from them. Right now, there is nothing men can take from them to force them to compromise on unlimited abortion rights for themselves. If they were not sure of support from a man, even a husband, (married women can kill their babies), they would be more than glad to talk.

>>You ‘men’s rights activists’ have achieved NOTHING in the history of mankind except start a few lame and bitter blogs.

Also more name-calling from the same guy in the paragraph before the quote. Moderators, just how much of this guy’s s**t do we have to tolerate here? He has nothing to say, except insults and name-calling.

So, we have done nothing (which by the way is not true, you just have no idea of the history of the men’s movement. But, do tell us all you have achieved? I am easily impressed.

>>I think it is about time for a repeat of your description of “destroyers.”

No need, just read 555. Typical big shot do-nothing destroyer. Still if I can remember it, maybe when I get time.

Zorro, you make a good point, up to a point. One of the feminist arguments in favor of legalized abortion was that women had all those abortions anyway, poor, poor, poor dearies. In fact, before Roe v. Wade, there were by all estimates very few of them. Another red herring by the feminists that most men do not question.

Also, to make it clear, another case where no records exist, because the few doctor abortions that happened, were not documented, so the feminists announce the unknown numbers were large. Sort of like telling us just how many unreported rapes happen each year.

Things that can put people in prison for many years, and those laws were vigorously enforced, tend not to happen an awful lot.

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scatmaster January 9, 2011 at 18:57

Malestrom :
Guy’s be disciplined, don’t feed the trolls. Just thumb down the comments for the convenience of future readers and move on.

I have made that suggestion concerning other trolls but some won’t listen. The result the trolls keep coming back.

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zed January 9, 2011 at 19:06

>>I think it is about time for a repeat of your description of “destroyers.”

No need, just read 555. Typical big shot do-nothing destroyer. Still if I can remember it, maybe when I get time.

Yes, we certainly have one in our midst. But, I think your description, particularly the part about the guy who destroyed one church congregation then followed the minister to his new congregation, would be a useful sort of “intro for those new to the MM” like Lee suggested.

There is a weird pathology that shows up often among men. It may be as common among women but masked by their numerous other pathologies. The best short description in the public domain I can give is one of the lines from Eric Clapton’s “I shot the sheriff.”

Every time I would plant a seed, he would say “kill it before it grows.”

It’s the same kind of punk mentality that thinks defacing a statue like “The Thinker” with a can of spray paint makes the punk somehow more powerful than the man who made the statue.

They are like ants at a picnic – sit there long enough and you can guarantee that some of them will show up.

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Elusive Wapiti January 9, 2011 at 19:09

@ Denis,

The only part that is relevant to men is the lack of men’s choice.

Except insofar as the abortionettes will selectively murder our unborn brothers. I am steeply concerned about this.

Do we want to demand an equal decision to abort, same as women?

To abort the obligation to pay the woman chilimony, yes. The same right as she has to jettison her own obligations, either thru abortion or adoption.

Do we want to demand an equal decision to force a woman to continue her pregnancy?

If I had my druthers, abortion would be illegal period, so I guess I’d be all for *gasp* forcing a woman to continue a pregnancy.

But it’s okay, nearly all women are just fine with forcing men to labor for their benefit for two decades, so I don’t lose a lot of sleep over requiring a woman to continue a gestation to term, a matter of merely months.

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jaytheman January 9, 2011 at 19:10

@ 555 spinner:
please go away. you keep claiming its unfair we are down voting you. why don’t you try being civil. oh yeah thats right your a stupid very obvious troll. why the mods haven’t band you yet is beyond me.

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Anonymous age 68 January 9, 2011 at 19:12

Here is the piece on destroyers. Your comment about the church issue tells me where you read it. First this one from DGM-3
###
My view is that to know what can and cannot happen, one must know the history of the men’s movement. Every generation of MRA’s does exactly the same things as the previous generations, because they know no history. I don’t know anyone who has the same perspective I have, so I will need to write my views myself because there is nothing to link.

With the start of feminism 45 years ago, there was a parallel men’s movement. From time to time, someone who has no knowledge of the history will announce, that indeed the men’s movement can be successful if effective, competent leaders are found. These are fighting words for experienced MRA’s, as much so as is NAWALT.

The problem has never been a lack of effective leaders. The problem has been a lack of effective followers. If there are 10 MRA’s, there are 10 leaders. If there are 100 MRA’s there are 100 leaders, all going different directions.

When I say no followers, I do not imply the leaders have no people at their meetings. They certainly do come to meetings, but they do nothing else but sit around with their thumbs in unpleasant places, as if it were a spectator sport.

If the leader arranges some sort of publicizing event, they either do not show up at all, or show up drunk, or unbathed.

Also, the minute the leader does anything, he is subject to attacks. “You’re doing it wrong. You’re doing it wrong.”

The Destroyers as we called them, keep on attacking until the leader burns out and leaves, and then the destroyer says, “I knew he was doing it wrong,” and wanders off, proud of his high level of intelligence, and announces MRA’s are sort of worthless.

And, no Destroyer ever actually does anything useful or productive himself. Never.

Now, we come to what I think may well be the actual reason the MRM always fails. As I said, there are plenty of leaders.

THE MEMBERS NEVER DEFEND THE LEADERS FROM ATTACKS.

“Each man has to fight his own battles.”

“Everyone has to paddle his own canoe.”

Traditional male values.

This is counter-productive for an effective organization. No leader can lead a group while single-handedly fighting every Destroyer and feminist in town, while the members sit and watch the fun.

Let me give a personal anecdote that IMO perfectly demonstrates this problem.

In 1978, I began writing militant op-eds to our local newspaper. After my first visit to Mexico in 1983, I went back and became dramatically more militant, because I had a small taste of a more sane society.

The next year, the local FR group had two members commit suicide out of 35 members. One man poured gasoline all over himself and lit a match, because he wasn’t getting to see his little daughter.

They came and asked me to help them deal with this. After a few months, I agreed. As long as I worked with them, there were no more suicides among the members.

We set up the organization with a board of directors, and I was spokesman, rather than a standard president situation. We had BOD meetings, and anything I did had to be approved, then I did it. Need I say I did it mostly alone?

The State president in the state capitol would once in a while pick up his local newspaper, and there we’d be, with some publicity event, from across the state.

Three years later, the local DV center decided we needed supervised visitation as a norm for all visitation by those evil, abusive, pedophile divorced fathers, so they started a campaign to implement a supervised visitation program, run by guess who?

At the last minute, they realized, oops, we need to be able to say the father’s rights group also recommends our supervised visitation program. The director sent us a letter, asking for our support. As instructed by the BOD, I responded we would need more information.

We had a new member on the BOD, an old guy, and when we discussed it, he thought it was a good idea, and we should accept it. The others voted against him.

In a few days, we discovered he had gone on his own, as member of the BOD, against instructions, to the director, gave her all our phone numbers, and told her he was sure if she approached the BOD one at a time, they’d be willing to support the program.

We called a BOD meeting. He was angry and totally out of control, shouting, “I will not be controlled.”

The obvious correct approach was for the BOD to toss him out, for violating their instructions.

Never happens. They sat on their thumbs while he and I fought, as if it were a personal conflict between the two of us, instead of him brazenly violating the BOD instructions.

We went home, him still insisting it was his personal rights which I was violating. I called the other BOD and asked who wanted the treasury and other things I had for the group. No one would accept the things, so I sent the money to the State president and declared the organization dead. I can’t remember, but I think they never had a legal organization again. They had meetings, but no actual charter of any kind.

The State President promptly appointed me as Counselor-at-large out of his office, working in my city. Things got better, because I was free of a bunch of do-nothing losers who permitted their spokesman to be attacked for following their instructions.

The jerk admitted before he died that he had been in the wrong, but that did the local group no good at all.

I continued to do counseling for another 7 years, then tired of constant attacks mostly from men, said to Hell with it, let them destroy these spineless wimps, and made plans to GTHO.

I am not necessarily a real ‘smart’ man as such. What I know has mostly come from tons of experience, and hard knocks, and there has been so much of each of those things in my life. ;D I learned from the incident above the importance to any organization of aggressively defending your leader, that as member of any group it is indeed your job to do so.

This is intended as a teaching event, not a personal attack on the members. If you men really care about the men’s movement, you will learn you MUST defend your leader or board admin, as a way of life. It is your job to defend him, not his.

Or, not, which is the normal male mode, and the real reason MRM has always failed.

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LaughAtSpinner555 January 9, 2011 at 19:17

It’s manginas like Spinner that make your average joe care very little about other men. If I heard some mangina was at the recieving end of feminazi laws, aka screwed royally over by family court, I’d laugh instead of feel pity.

Too many manginas, not enough real men. For every real man you have 1000 manginas. Spinner is just another eunuch who surrendered his balls duiring that feminazi wimmins studies class I bet he took in his youth. If he still had a pair I bet he’d get an erection while reading feministing.org lol.

Sorry to say, but the ‘caring’ side of your average joe gets chipped away every time a so-called ‘brother’ backstabs his own sex.

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zed January 9, 2011 at 19:24

Thanks Aa68.

I have made this point many times –

The problem has never been a lack of effective leaders. The problem has been a lack of effective followers. If there are 10 MRA’s, there are 10 leaders. If there are 100 MRA’s there are 100 leaders, all going different directions.

One of my standard jokes is that it is pretty easy to get any 3 random MRAs (or libertarians, with whom MRAs have much in common) to agree on just about anything. All you have to do is shoot 2 of them.

Pro-sex, pro-porn Erica Jong can share a stage with “all heterosexual sex is rape” Andrea-Dworkin-the-Hut, and despite having nothing in common besides both having a vagina, they can support each other in the name and spirit of “generic woman.”

Men, on the other hand, will argue each other to the death – resorting to weapons if necessary – over such weighty issues as “paper or plastic” or “boxers or briefs.”

It’s the way we seem to be stacked. I’ve given up trying to change it.

As long as I can keep myself clear of the blast zone, I’m quite happy to shout hints all day – “Watch out for that land mine” – knowing that some other dude’s pig-headedness can no longer harm me.

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Anonymous age 68 January 9, 2011 at 19:27

Some years ago, a female fellow worker who knew just how insane my mother was, told me one day, “You gotta’ read this book. It describes your mother to a T.”

It is called ANTAGONISTS IN THE CHURCH, and I am confident you can find it on Amazon used books or similar URL’s.

It was written by officials of a national church support organization. Every church, repeat, every church, will have what I have called a Destroyer in the MRM. They call them Antagonists.

These are people who cannot sleep if they are not causing problems. They will say anything, tell any lie, cast out any insult, to drive away a pastor of a church, or an elder. Most churches break up when this happens, because they try the “Christian” approach, of avoiding confrontations and using prayer instead of automatic firearms. (Just kidding. Sort of.)

Antagonists vary. Some moderates will poke their foot out as you walk by, to trip you, so to speak, but will not work too hard.

Others like my mother never give up. One pastor was driven out of his church in the Midwest, by an Antagonist. He got a job in California, and the first Sunday, the Antagonist was in the front pew. He had driven all the way to California to continue his destruction.

After the book explains what an Antagonist (Destroyer) is, it tells how to deal with them. As I said, in the previous posting, the organization must work as a team to defend the person attacked, and the Destroyer must not receive any Christian generosity. Strictly go for the throat.

It also tells the pastor when to leave. If the accusations are serious and are true, bail.

If they are not true, but the church body believes them, bail.

In my case, the family generally believed my mother’s lies about me, such as the false claim that I had sat on her sofa “with tears running down my cheeks” (0ne of her standard lies) and confessed adultery in my first marriage. One brother even carried that lie into the place where he and my second wife and I all worked, and five men came to tell me what he did. The adultery never happened. I disowned the family because most of them believed the lie.

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555 Spinner January 9, 2011 at 20:18

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555 Spinner January 9, 2011 at 20:21

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Anti Idiocy January 9, 2011 at 21:19

Europe is already hitting a wall because of this abortion, birth control, and destruction of the traditional family. This article, despite some disagreement that I have with it, does a pretty good job of describing what’s coming (though it doesn’t mention the mechanisms of birth control and abortion).
http://newswhip.ie/national-2/the-world-in-2050-europe-is-dying-by-demographic-collapse

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Anti Idiocy January 9, 2011 at 21:27

@zed:

It’s the way we seem to be stacked. I’ve given up trying to change it.

As long as I can keep myself clear of the blast zone, I’m quite happy to shout hints all day – “Watch out for that land mine” – knowing that some other dude’s pig-headedness can no longer harm me.

That’s pretty much where I’ve gotten to be after so many years of trying to get men and women to wake up. But I am getting more enjoyment out of the circus recently. What with so many men finally getting fed up with women just as economies are finally going over the cliff as a result of insupportable debt addiction, things are getting interestinger and interestinger.

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Anti Idiocy January 9, 2011 at 21:35

Here’s a report from an economics conference in Denver.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/09/economists-it-doesnt-look_n_806420.html
Note especially the quote from the Harvard economics professor (woo hoo!) Dale Jorgenson

the United States should brace for social unrest amid blame over who was responsible for squandering global primacy

Expect to see many a bitter, unemployed man blaming feminism.

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jaytheman January 9, 2011 at 23:08

@ 555 spinner:
who’s the one getting pissed. damn chill the fuck out dude. i was just calling you out for what you are obviously doing. which is trying to get everyone on here pissed. theres a difference between having a reasonable argument and the shit you pulled on your first comment.

555 spinner
Now vote me down like the good little monkeys you are. That mouse click is about as much power as you’ll ever wield over society so enjoy it.

yeah you really don’t expect people to get pissed when you say shit like that. you say its mangina’s that are killing the mens movement on here. nah its anger inciting little assholes like you that get their jollies from saying fucked up shit on the internet. so go ahead say fucked up shit to me because its all you seem to be able to do. if you want to talk normal then i’ll respond in kind

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DevilDog January 10, 2011 at 00:01

I never understood why the Father has no choice in this decision. That’s not equality, 50/50, that’s not fair. It’s the Fathers seed, HE planted that seed inside of there. It’s her body, his seed.

Oh right…Fathers don’t matter, Single Mothers are the archetype for ideal family structure, they can do it all by themselves. (Thats what they say, but their actions say otherwise)…

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Migu January 10, 2011 at 00:41

I’ll just say this.

Every year in November I send a birthday card to my aborted baby brother Nathan. He is 17 this year. I send that card to the woman that birthed me.

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trashed January 10, 2011 at 01:37

“Misandrosogynist”….?

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555 Spinner January 10, 2011 at 03:08

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Denis January 10, 2011 at 05:09

Rather than giving men the same right to decide as women, the consensus here seems to be to take away women’s rights to decide. Again, that might make some social conservatives feel better, but the reality is that there will be more unwanted babies and more fathers forced to pay for them. It doesn’t change anything for men.

Keeping with the theme of men’s choice, what about adoption? A woman can still get pregnent and decide to put the baby up for adoption, or she can keep the baby and make the father pay. Shouldn’t fathers also have the same right to adopt away their paternal responsibilities?

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Denis January 10, 2011 at 05:30

After perusing Justin’s blog at The Truth Shall Set You Free, I don’t understand how it could be considered an MRA site. I didnt’ find any articles of relevance.

@Anonymous 68, who are these leaders that you speak of? There are no leaders in the MRM and it would be counterproductive to attempt to create a heirrachy. Anyone who has the audacity to think themselves a leader is just fooling themselves.

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Migu January 10, 2011 at 05:49

How about you just make sure you can take care of kid before you

A. Open your legs.

B. Stick it in.

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zed January 10, 2011 at 06:12

After perusing Justin’s blog at The Truth Shall Set You Free, I don’t understand how it could be considered an MRA site.

No one ever said it was an MRA site. It just seemed like a good article.

EW has posted a couple of times descriptions of the decline of empires. One characteristic which shows up is that instead of pulling together to salvage their culture, people begin to turn on each other.

I’m beginning to see a lot of Boomer bashing going on around the net. Among the gen-x and early gen-y folks it seems to be a triumvirate of issues, all related to a sense of abandonment – divorce, abortion, and mothers with careers creating latchkey kids who had to pretty much raise themselves. I’ve discussed this with Bill and he says he has seen some pretty bitter hatred expressed toward the Boomers.

If some group came in and killed 1/3rd of a group you belonged to, batted many of the rest around like shuttlecocks while they indulged themselves in any hedonistic pursuit they damn well pleased, and pretty much left you on your own to deal with it all, it’s not at all hard for me to understand why you might be pretty pissed off at that group.

In a war it is expected to devalue the lives of the enemy. However, devaluing the lives of the people who share your same culture leads to cultural suicide. Normal human self-centeredness keeps people from realizing the implications that if you don’t value someone else’s life, they are not very likely to put any value on yours.

It is a shorter step from handing women the power to kill any baby they choose to handing them the power to kill anyone they choose than most people realize. Personally, I see a connection between the acceptance of abortion and Mary Winkler being allowed to retroactively “abort” Matthew Winkler. (EW, your link added here would be greatly appreciated.)

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Firepower January 10, 2011 at 07:54

Official Generation X Slogan – I survived the Abortion Holocaust

by Featured Guest

I dunno, chief. I see plenty of peeps that age – it’s just that they’re all black or Mexican.

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Migu January 10, 2011 at 08:26

Hey moron, you know people who were never born by definition cannot have a ‘birth day’ don’t you?

What kind of a fucking abortion nazi sends his own mother that sort of shit.

She should get a restraining order against you.

Oh don’t worry, I thank her on my birthday for deciding I was “worth it”

Besides she was pregnant with Nathan after my father had a vasectomy. I mean who really wants a half-brother right?????

Could you Imagine how bad it would’ve made my mother look? I mean every one in town would look at the evidence of her infidelity every day. Can’t have that now, better to snuff that life in order to not ruin another eh? Besides she gets to decide who lives and dies it’s her body that makes it…………….

I thank her all the time for revealing to me the nature of womankind.

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Peter-Andrew:Nolan(c) January 10, 2011 at 09:32

And if they forget the abortion they can always have a ‘tragic accident’.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1345618/Ive-killed-Amy-Dennings-grief-leaving-son-bath-2-minutes.html

Notice how this is couched as a ‘tragic accident’ like leaving an 11 month old baby in a bath tub is not an incredibly stupid thing to do. This is manslaughter. It is complete negligence on the womans part. I have raised 4 children. Guess what? None of them were EVER left in the bathtub alone…EVER. When he was 2 my son slipped off the ledge in out pool while I was vacumming it not 5 feet away from him. I didn’t hear a sound. My daughter called to let me know he’d fallen in and I retrieved him with no harm done. From them he was not even allowed to sit on the step while I vaccumed out the pool. Kids and water are a very dangerous combination and all adults should be well aware of this…..except if that adult is female because if a female allows a child to be drowned it’s only an ‘accident’.

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Peter-Andrew:Nolan(c) January 10, 2011 at 09:33

PS….of course I meant as babies…. ;-)

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Peter-Andrew:Nolan(c) January 10, 2011 at 09:38

zed January 10, 2011 at 06:12
“It is a shorter step from handing women the power to kill any baby they choose to handing them the power to kill anyone they choose than most people realize.”
Yes..in Germany in the 30s it started with the ‘retarded and mentally’ ill. Those who were a ‘burden to the women’. The women simply dropped them off at the local ‘health service’ which was where they were killed. After a while it escalated to those who were deemed ‘mentally retarded’ because, you know, they opposed some guy called Hitler and if you opposed him you had to be mentally retarded, right? It got to children being able to ‘inform’ on their parents for ‘mentally defective’ or ‘subversive activity’.

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Migu January 10, 2011 at 09:43

I dunno, chief. I see plenty of peeps that age – it’s just that they’re all black or Mexican.

White women are not worth reproducing with. At least the welfare queens keep their kids, albeit at the expense of their men.

Hmmmmmm. And most think women are the enemy. It seems to me our “fellow men” are the ones that put us prison. Thank god they are a small minority, men are dangerous doncha know? ;)

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Migu January 10, 2011 at 09:46

It got to children being able to ‘inform’ on their parents for ‘mentally defective’ or ‘subversive activity’.

If you don’t let my boyfriend spend the night I’ll call Child Protective Services

Seen it happen on numerous occasions.

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Binxton January 10, 2011 at 09:53

Denis January 10, 2011 at 05:09

Rather than giving men the same right to decide as women, the consensus here seems to be to take away women’s rights to decide. Again, that might make some social conservatives feel better, but the reality is that there will be more unwanted babies and more fathers forced to pay for them. It doesn’t change anything for men.

The point isn’t to “make some social conservatives feel better.” The females privileges, and consequent injustices against men, we see today are in fact part of a larger, deeper sickness that pervades all of western societies. The fight against feminism is unlike anything man has ever faced before.

And so the changes required to correct the imbalance against men will not be piecemeal reforms, nor will they take place in isolation from other aspects of society, which is why I’m very skeptical (to say the least) about any so-called men’s rights movement.

A movement towards true balance of the sexes must have as its end the removal or reduction of women’s choices and freedoms, including abortion. Taking away a woman’s right to kill her unborn child is only one step among many vital in correcting the imbalances that currently exist in western societies.

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Denis January 10, 2011 at 10:57

“I’m very skeptical (to say the least) about any so-called men’s rights movement.”

-You should be skeptical, just as I am skeptical of anti-abortion becoming a platform of the MRM and promoting more government control over people’s lives. The MRM is about “men’s rights”, not solving the worlds problems, addressing every genocide or trying to reform f-ed up women.

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Josie Gallows January 10, 2011 at 12:34

This is tacky. The birth rate could be a lot of different things depending on a lot of different factors, birth control being a large factor all across the board. The argument also depends heavily on your feeling on when a person is a “person” and not a pre-human collection of cells.

More unwanted lives in a world that barely deals with the living as they are would only be worse. To me it isn’t about the women or their bodies and their misguided liberation. To me it is about the very real dysgenics and poverty issues associated with reversing Roe v. Wade. I really hate this type of moralizing because it ignores the elephant in the room, which is that women who have abortions are the ones that usually ought to have abortions.

Two categories: women who will produce inferior stock to begin with or women who are superior stock that shouldn’t be having babies at 15 years old. While I’m glad my mother happened to grant me a Maternal Pardon I could also be equally as thankful that my great grandfather on my mothers fathers side didn’t accept any small pox blankets or Germany wasn’t beside by too many plagues 200 years ago.

I support a woman’s right to choose as much as I support a man’s right to not have to suffer from that choice and be paternally enslaved.

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Binxton January 10, 2011 at 14:50

To me it isn’t about the women or their bodies and their misguided liberation. To me it is about the very real dysgenics and poverty issues associated with reversing Roe v. Wade. I really hate this type of moralizing because it ignores the elephant in the room, which is that women who have abortions are the ones that usually ought to have abortions.

Yes, dysgenics is a very real issue that ought to be factored in a society’s reproductive or birth control policies.

Producing superior stock (and minimizing inferior stock) should be a goal in any future society. And yes, there are certain categories of women — and men — who should not be reproducing at all, and for which abortion may be a viable option. Drug addicts for example. Welfare recipients are another.

The issue of abortion has degenerated into a question of “rights”; of one’s “right” to have one, of her “right” to this, or his “right” to that. This is an infantile and egocentric way framing the issue. Abortion in itself isn’t really even the issue.

The issue is the survival of one’s genes, of the survival of civilization. Our world hinges on the perpetuation of the species; we could not expect a better future society for men and women otherwise.

A society that grants women this freedom and choice to kill her unborn child on the basis of individual rights, without any consideration at all about the nature of women or the long-term repercussions to society, is utterly sick and corrupt, and ultimately cannot survive.

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Lavazza January 10, 2011 at 15:44

Most women who have abortions do not want to stay childless forever and go on to have children later on, so it’s more of a postponement than a holocaust. The same number of children will be born, only later (as with abstinence and birth control).

When it comes to getting the abortion figures down Finland has made a lot of progress the last 5-10 years.

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Eric January 10, 2011 at 16:03

555 Spinner:

LOL, like anybody cares about the ‘growing feminism’ in North Korea. It’s just like the meaningless statistic that Chinese women have more abortions than American ones. Feminism does best when it’s promoted at the point of a bayonet; which is about the only way that it can be imposed on non-Anglo cultures. (And then rejected by non-Anglo women with contempt when the threat of force goes away like the former USSR).

‘Men’s rights has achieved nothing except for a few lame and bitter blogs’.—- Ummm, tell that to the now-double-digit percentage of American men who’ve abandoned feminized Amerobitches in favor of foreign women. It’s the only US marriage demographic that’s going up, according to the US Census Bureau. And even for MRAs who don’t favor marriage, there’s a lot less social stigma attached to staying single than there once was; recently 39% of American men said in a nationwide poll that marriage is obsolete.

Look, too, to all the recent wailing in the feminist/mangina media (I’m sure that you read that stuff eagerly) about supposed ‘shortages of good men’ and ‘decline of chivalry’ &c. The MRM has done incalcuable good at combatting the shaming tactics and guilt-tripping laid on us by such media outlets.

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Malestrom January 10, 2011 at 16:54

Don’t. Feed. The trolls.

That is all.

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Gx1080 January 10, 2011 at 18:28

@Malestrom

I agree, but I like to indulge in simple thursts with people that will never recognize logic.

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Peter-Andrew:Nolan(c) January 11, 2011 at 02:10

Migu January 10, 2011 at 09:46
“If you don’t let my boyfriend spend the night I’ll call Child Protective Services”

Yes. Women are so incapable of understanding ‘what comes next’ that they have no idea that the FIRST step was to remove the ‘father’ and the NEXT step is to remove the ‘mother’. For those who missed it the application form for US passports is going to be ‘gender neutral’ and have ‘parent 1′ and ‘parent 2′ on it. All so they do not ‘discriminate’ against gays, right? We are starting to see the phaseing out of ‘mother as saint’ in the lame-stream-media. This is why we are seeing articles about how ‘bad’ women are.

And what does the word ‘discriminate’ really mean? It means ‘discerning’, ‘to be able to differentiate qualities of something’. To have a ‘discriminating pallate’ for wine was once a compliment. So ‘discrimination’ is being used to brow beat to people into ‘everyone is the same’. If you did not have a ‘discriminating pallate’ for wine the EUR10 per gallon wine is just as good as the EUR50 per bottle, right? And so it is in the west now. Women claim no-one is allowed to be any better than anyone else. This is the ludicrous claim that a good father and husband is no ‘better’ than a murdering, paedophile rapist. In THAT environment? Why would any man strive to ‘make himself better’ or ‘make the most of himself’? The men here have seen where ‘making the most of myself’ got me with western women. Unbridled hatred spewed endlessly.

So now? The children of these single mothers are being offered the opportunity to bully and even have mum jailed for the night. LOL! And the wimminz are all upset about it despite the fact they did EXACTLY the same to the menz for decades now. The more I look into this the more I find it astounding how ‘thick’ women are at being completely unable to understand the obvious consequences of their actions. The kids putting them into jail for ‘child abuse’ being one clear example of something that was inevitable.

Lavazza January 10, 2011 at 15:44
“The same number of children will be born, only later”

I think you must have missed the statistic that the birth rate per woman has halved across most of the world in the last 40 years.

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Lavazza January 11, 2011 at 02:49

Nolan: “I think you must have missed the statistic that the birth rate per woman has halved across most of the world in the last 40 years.”

I am aware of that, but correlation does not equal cause. If the cause is a desire to have few children and late, it can also be reached by birth control and abstinence. For example I saw a stat that women born abroad has more children than ethnic Swedes, but daughters of foreign born parents have fewer children than ethnic Swedes. The cause can, of course, be access to free abortion, but it can also be changed attitudes/desires when more integrated in Swedish society (which seems plausible, since foreign born women in Sweden also have access to free abortion). The downward trend can also be seen in countries with less access to abortion and I do not think that child birth rates has risen in Finland where abortion figures have been going down for 5-10 years.

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Lavazza January 11, 2011 at 02:52

Then again access to free abortion must be a part of the answer why child rearing is being postponed and why child birth rates are dropping. For the question whether access to free abortion plays a minor or major part, the jury is out, at least in my mind.

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Lavazza January 11, 2011 at 03:09

I could not find any really recent studies but here is one from 2004.

“The incidence of adolescent pregnancy and adolescent birth is widely divergent. For most countries comparable figures are available on birth rates among adolescents aged 15–19 years. In some countries figures for pregnancy rates are also known. The highest adolescent birth rates occur in sub-Saharan Africa, and in some countries in South Asia and Latin America. Intermediate figures are found in the Middle East and North Africa, in the USA and Eastern Europe. In developed countries the highest incidences of adolescent pregnancies, abortions and births are recorded in the USA, with a tendency to decreases in recent years. Somewhat lower figures are obtained in Canada, Australia and the United Kingdom. Other countries in Western and Northern Europe, such as the Scandinavian countries and
the Netherlands, have low pregnancy and birth rates. The lowest adolescent birth rates are found in the Scandinavian countries, Switzerland, the Netherlands, Japan, Korea and China. In the Scandinavian countries and the Netherlands pregnancy rates and abortion rates are known. In spite of the fact that in these countries abortion is free, pregnancy rates and abortion rates are remarkably low, due to the fact that contraception is also easily available for adolescents.”

http://whqlibdoc.who.int/publications/2004/9241591455_eng.pdf

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Lavazza January 11, 2011 at 03:25

But if would be asked to make a guess, it would be that access to free abortion plays a minor role as a cause for low birth rates and that attitudes/desires and/or a culture of using birth control or abstinence plays a major role as a cause for low birth rates.

The US seems to have the worst of both worlds (a high rate of what, to a large part, must be unwanted child births and a high rate of abortions).

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AntZ January 11, 2011 at 09:15

“… life of drugs, sex, crime, joblessness, homelessness, etc., that defines so many of our ruined young women today …”

WHAT are you talking about? Drug addicts are predominantly male, prison inmates are almost exclusively male, we are in the middle of a “mancession” of male unemployment, the homeless are vastly more likely to be male than female!?!

I know you have an agenda to push, maybe a worthy agenda, but absurd statements like this have no place in a dialogue of reason. If abortion is causing young women’s lives to go down the tubes, why do men “enjoy” a virtual monopoly on dispossessed/derailed lives?

Young women have abortions because it is CONVENIENT for them. It is the ultimate act of selfishness. It is not the woman’s life that goes down the tubes during an abortion, it is the unborn.

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Tinman January 11, 2011 at 21:04

HOLY SHITE! I NEVER THOUGHT I COULD HATE FEMINISM MORE THAN I ALREADY DO….BUT THIS JUST MADE ME HATE IT MORE?!?!?!
HOLY FUCK! EATING BABIES?!? O_O

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Tinman January 11, 2011 at 21:06

http://www.prisonplanet.com/feminists_joke_about_roasting_babies.html

oops, the link didn’t show in my first post.

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JohnE January 11, 2011 at 21:18

[We should print bumper stickers and t-shirts. “I survived the abortion holocaust”...]

Yeah, if you want to identify as some kind of whiney emo or something.

“I’m so lucky – I wasn’t aborted” – Please, get over your drama.

Anyway, the sort of women who have abortions are generally the sort of women who should not be raising children, so in the big picture it all works out.

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Robert in Arabia January 11, 2011 at 22:16

Anonymous age 68 January 9, 2011 at 18:52
Stated:

We have a moron who says he was able to prove the Holocaust was hogwash in 15 minutes on the Web. What a genius! He is better at revisionism than the feminists are. In fifteen minutes, he is able to completely rewrite the well documented slaughter of millions of people. The Germans were excellent record keepers, and many government and camp records of the Holocaust exist today. ”
Anonymous68 is correct that the Germans kept excellent records. The records do not show that millions of Jews were killed. The records are kept at an archive in Arolsen, Germany. You cannot look at them. If they should that millions of Jews were killed, you would see them on TV every night. You don’t.

http://notinfallible.weebly.com/1/post/2010/09/the-most-documented-crime-in-history.html

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skadhi_the_raverner October 30, 2011 at 07:26

Survivor male: “I am happy I was not aborted, but some women should never be mothers and I had one of them.”

Well that can best be used as an argument for for compulsory birth control. When an argument is polarised between Christian pronatalism for everyone and Enlightenment individual rights, people tend to overlook alternative viewpoints.

Denis: “Abortion is a human rights issues. The only part that is relevant to men is the lack of men’s choice. Do we really want to go there? Do we want to demand an equal decision to abort, same as women? Do we want to demand an equal decision to force a woman to continue her pregnancy? That might make some social conservatives sleep better that they have saved some babies, but does it doesn’t really change anything for marginalized fathers that are discriminated against in family law.

I think it’s a red herring.”

Firstly there are men who correctly feel as though their babies have been murdered even if you don’t, and they feel like shit afterwards. What about the rights of those men then?

You are yourself like the feminists who are obsessed by ‘choice’ and ‘equal decisions’ and indeed leftist ‘human rights’. Responsible people will not end up in such a situation in the first place, and if they ever do, irresponsible people will still do the right thing by the innocent life they’ve created.

And perhaps the entire ideal of ‘rights’ is the red herring, what about duties, responsibilities and organic bonds?

The last point is the reason why good men do not wish for the equal ‘right’ to abort their own child, but are willing to support a child they created on purpose or through carelessness. (That is, not those who were trapped by women who had lied to them about using birth control.)

I admit I don’t care about the ‘rights’ of careless men who impregnate without thinking of the consequences. The state should force them to cough up. I’m female and if I was pregnant and then dumped, I’d want support – and its not the state’s fault, so why should the state pay if a man’s responsible.

What did the ancient Persians believe? If a man seduces a maiden and convinces her to ‘get rid of it’, then the man, the girl and the doctor or midwife are *all* guilty of murder – and they were right.

Men should not have ‘rights’ or sympathy if they disrespect women, and pro-choice encourages men to treat women in certain ways. There’s a reason why so many men support legal abortions, because they themselves want unsafe sex without responsibilities to the women they use, or thoughts for the children they conceive. In fact all of feminism seems to have served to remove the social mores protecting women and children from bad men.

Josie Gallows: “I really hate this type of moralizing because it ignores the elephant in the room, which is that women who have abortions are the ones that usually ought to have abortions.”

If you follow through Steve Sailor’s rebuttals of that ridiculous Freakonomics argument, then there’s actually no evidence for this whatsoever. It does, however, appeal to the unwarranted self importance of those who believe that they’re of a different category from people who have abortions (ie intelligent people vs unintelligent sluts).

Besides the number of professional women in stable relationships and marriages who choose to kill their own child, populations with a high birthrate will naturally be more competitive than populations with a low birthrate (in this thread someone has mentioned Somali immigrants and compared them with native whites). In fact anyone who doesn’t understand such things should not speak of what is dysgenic.

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