Tofurkey and the Decline of My Favorite Holiday

by Chuck Ross on November 23, 2010

My favorite holiday of the year, the one coming upon us in two days, is on the decline. This should come as no surprise to anyone who pays attention to the arc of traditionalism in this country.

For a while now, whoever is in charge of fucking up our cherished American traditions has turned to revisionist methods to mangle our fondness for my favorite day. Stories of the Pilgrims and Indians have been littered with qualifications and revisionism. Not content to just let us assume that white settlers and brown natives got along for once and decided to eat a nice meal in celebration so that we can gorge ourselves, liberals all over would have us think that the Pilgrims tea-bagged the Indians’ Thanksgiving gravy with their syphilis infested scrotums before raping their land and using their buffalo for target practice. This modern strain of revisionism made Christopher Columbus out to be a major asshole; that was the first step in delegitimizing any tradition that extols the unique development of America.

On the micro level, my favorite holiday is lambasted for its tendency to bring together dysfunctional families, but this same sort of jibe isn’t considered when we celebrate bringing drunk dysfunctional random strangers together in celebration of sombreros, leprechauns, or slutty costumes over an uncommon celebration of Mexico, Ireland, and STDs. Valuing family and thinking outside of yourself for one day is marginalized as square at best and a tool of the patriarchy at worst.

There are other symptoms of this holiday’s demise. By all indications we should expect Thanksgiving to cease existing anywhere near its present scale within the next 20 years. By then, the fourth Thursday in November will become an arbitrary starting point for businesses to synchronize their ledgers to get an apples-to-apples comparison of year-over-year same-store-sales figures. That many hyphens in one sentence should prove to us that something is gravely wrong. The largest retailers have engaged in this most modern incantation of anti-traditionalism. Wal-Mart, K-Mart, The Gap triad – the eponymous leg, Banana Republic, and Old Navy – will be open on Thanksgiving Day. Many smaller retailers will do the same. Not only does this detract focus from the sanctity of what was once a common cultural bond, it now pulls shoppers and employees away from families – eroding connections that may benefit from an extra day of familial bonding. Those retailers being leading lights of industry, and the retail industry as a whole being the leading light of Americans’ system of values, Thanksgiving as a traditional institution seems doomed.

But that is not what has really sent me over the edge this holiday season. What has really mashed my peas this year is this emerging trend of “Tofurkey” as a vegetarian alternative to the real thing. What really hurts me the most about the slow decline of Thanksgiving is the stupidity of this concept. If you’re vegetarian why even pretend to eat turkey? The tradition is to eat turkey in meat form; if you’re going to eat tofu then you aren’t participating in the tradition so stop trying to trick yourself. Eat regular tofu in its rectangular prism shape along with your sprouts and lima beans like you do every other day of the year. You can have some mashed potatoes too this time, but no gravy. The gravy has animal guts in it, and you can pass that to me.

I don’t understand why vegetarians can’t just have a substitute protein source and leave it at that without trying to redefine “turkey”. The extra choice is like ham for those assholes who always say “I actually like ham better than turkey”.

I also have questions. I wonder if tofurkey will be in a turkey shape complete with tofu formed into legs, wings, and breasts? More importantly I wonder if there will be a tofu wishbone for poor, anemic vegetarian children to pull apart as they make a wish (for meat, no doubt). How about tofu turkey necks? And can we replace the carving knife with one usually used for butter? The most experienced male at the dinner table will give way to the hairiest female when it comes to the celebrated act of carving the “bird”.

So yes, my friends, Thanksgiving is fucked.

{ 83 comments… read them below or add one }

NMH November 24, 2010 at 06:17

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Jack Donovan November 24, 2010 at 06:19

All I can think when I look at that picture is how funny she’s look with blood on her teeth.

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Lara November 24, 2010 at 06:20

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dragnet November 24, 2010 at 06:20

“That many hyphens in one sentence should prove to us that something is gravely wrong.”

I actually laughed out loud here.

Well done, sir.

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Hestia November 24, 2010 at 06:52

May I also add another sign of holiday decline: the fact that many people no longer use china, crystal, silver, or something else beyond the everyday dining service for holiday dinners as they must be washed my hand and thus are “too much work.” Apparently sharing a meal with loved ones isn’t worth a bit of extra trouble to add this special element to the table. Personally I’d say Tofurkey on a nice serving platter on table set with care and love is more pleasant than a turkey being served up on paper plates or the everyday dishes.

Toys R Us is yet another opening up tomorrow evening for Black Friday Doorbusters a bit early. When I noticed Sears was opening on Thanksgiving the Pollyanna in me thought this had to be an anomaly, only later did I realize this is quickly becoming the norm. It’s very sad to see.

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Lara November 24, 2010 at 07:05

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WGMOW November 24, 2010 at 07:05

Tofu turkey, as well as soybean products in any shape or form, is part of a feminist plot to demasculinize (is that a word or did I just make that up?) men of all ages. It’s well known that soy products contain large amounts of phytoestrogens that suppress the growth of male characteristics in boys and can suppress the production of testosterone in men. Yeah, yeah, we’ve all heard about the estrogen in drinking water from birth control pills, but that is usually detected in parts per trillion. An 8 oz. glass of soy milk, on the other hand, contains 40 mg of phytoestrogens, or 40 parts per million. In Israel, long a bastion of traditional masculinity, their Ministry of Health has warned that babies should not receive any soy formula, that children to age 18 should not eat soy more than once a day (to a maximum of 3 times a week), and that adults should beware because of breast cancer and adverse effects on fertility. [Siegel-Itzkovich J. Health committee warns of potential dangers of soya. BMJ, 2005, July 30, 331, 7511, 254.]

So the next time your wife or girlfriend tries to feed you some soy-based glop in place of real food, tell her to stuff it (and not in the turkey) and hie yourself down to the local bar and grill. Order up a huge hamburger or a giant turkey grinder (that’s a sub to all you non-New Englanders) and celebrate masculinity with a few brews.

And a happy traditional Thanksgiving to all you manly men out there.

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sharpcool November 24, 2010 at 07:07

NMH:

the fact is we destroyed native American indian culture by our greed to expand.

Who’s we? Speak for yourself, I didn’t destroy anything. If you want to be a pathetic guilty white liberal that’s your business.

Happy Thanksgiving.

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Lara November 24, 2010 at 07:10

Setting the table is the most fun part. I don’t know why more women don’t enjoy this anymore. American women are getting less feminine, there is no doubt about that.

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W.F. Price November 24, 2010 at 07:15

Using tofu as a meat replacement is just wrong. I like tofu, and ate it fairly frequently in China, but over there it serves roughly the same purpose cheese does in the West. There actually plenty of vegetarians in East Asia (South Asia too, I’m sure), but for them it’s a religious sacrifice more than anything else, although sometimes extreme poverty makes meat too expensive for those who would otherwise eat it. I suspect it’s quasi-religious in the West as well — all this talk about saving the planet by being a vegetarian is so much smoke.

But think about it this way: making a turkey out of tofu looks to a Chinese pretty much the same as making a pig out of cheese would to us, i.e. pretty disgusting and just plain weird. If you aren’t going to eat meat, why pretend you are? Eat your cranberries, stuffing, etc. – and even your tofu – but please don’t pretend tofu is a turkey. It’s an offense against tradition and propriety.

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mdavid November 24, 2010 at 07:17

Keep in mind that Thanksgiving is not a religious feast day; Puritan America ditched them (Easter, Christmas, All Saint’s Day, etc.) and only slowly have people in America been reclaiming the historical Holy Days (holidays).

We don’t celebrate Thanksgiving ourselves, although nothing against it (we can’t fit it in with all the traditional feasts). But like all celebrations that don’t have a religious background, Thanksgiving will slowly fade. That’s all we are seeing now.

I do find it sort of amusing that Thanksgiving is a “family holiday” in this era of feminist family breakdown. It’s sort of sad or funny or something to watch everyone attempt to patch broken families together for a single day while the women pretend they can still cook from scratch.

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pb November 24, 2010 at 07:20

“If you aren’t going to eat meat, why pretend you are?”

It’s the pull of unthinking tradition. Liberals usually aren’t consistent free-thinking liberals as they think they might be.

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alpha November 24, 2010 at 07:24

Just another festival corrupted. The politically correct nonsense just won’t stop.Personally I am a vegetarian(and not a Christian /American)
but the article has a point-a tradition is a tradition.
Follow it-or don’t follow it. But why mess it up?
Like I said before, it seems some group(s) just prefer to warp all traditions(for what reason, I have no clue)

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Sean November 24, 2010 at 07:28

Jack Donovan November 24, 2010 at 06:19 said…

“All I can think when I look at that picture is how funny she’s look with blood on her teeth”.

Jack…your satanism is showing.

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Philip November 24, 2010 at 07:34

Support the life of turkey’s every where, eat one this Christmas.
Or farmers will stop rearing them!
Then no turkeys get to live at all.
Eat meat with pride.

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Lara November 24, 2010 at 07:36

So what if it isn’t a religious holiday. It is actually more fundamental than that. It is being thankful for the things that are right in front of you.

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NMH November 24, 2010 at 07:54

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Sean November 24, 2010 at 08:02

sharpcool said:
Who’s we? Speak for yourself, I didn’t destroy anything. If you want to be a pathetic guilty white liberal that’s your business.

Sure…but some of us are happy to say ‘we’ when we’re citing the perceived historical achievements of our ancestors…trying to attribute or expropriate their greatness as our own…but likewise, we’re not responsible for those achievements either…

W.F.Price…I used to eat tofu also, until as WGMOW mentioned above, realised that all soy products are estrogenic, detrimental to males and cause permanent damage to testicular tissue if eaten to excess…yikes!

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woggy November 24, 2010 at 09:01

Thanksgiving is my favorite holiday also. Our ancestors did take over this country from Native Americans, which was wrong, but that isn’t what we are celebrating on Thanksgiving. That isn’t the spirit of the holiday.

Anyone who believes our (white) ancestors “took” the land away from the Indians is a simplistic idiot.
The Indians were overwhelmed by a people with superior learning, superior skill, superior work ethic, and a superior family structure.
ALL of these superior attributes found in western culture in those days have been under severe attack since Marx codified misery by penning the Communist Manifesto.
Increasingly, western mushheads have been parroting the “we stole it and don’t deserve it” line- an effective smokescreen that obscures the true intent of the malefactors who beset us.

Not only does this detract focus from the sanctity of what was once a common cultural bond, it now pulls shoppers and employees away from families – eroding connections that may benefit from an extra day of familial bonding.

I’ll say something here that often gets the ” I can’t believe he said that” look when I say it to someone’s face:
Hell is very appropriate place for those who foist misery on the rest of humanity, and I take comfort in the thought of it.

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Keyster November 24, 2010 at 09:07

I’ve celebrated the last several Thanksgivings with friends. Every year one female named Beth, who is a “vegan”, cooks her Tofurkey with it’s gravy and everyone feels obligated to fuss over it. We all have to help monitor it in the oven and participate in helping her prepare it. We can’t sit and eat until Beth’s tofurkey is also ready. It’s “tradition” among this group of people for everyone to have a serving or at least taste Beth’s tofurkey and comment about how surprisingly good it is, (lest she feel left out of the group because she chooses not to eat REAL turkey). “Wow Beth, your gravy is great over the stuffing!” “It tastes just like turkey!” “It’s really not that bad!”

I thought it was a joke at first; all the ridiculous fawning over this yearly ritual surrounding Beth’s precious tofurkey, but it’s not. I won’t be joining them this year.

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NMH November 24, 2010 at 09:15

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alpha November 24, 2010 at 09:23

[[The Indians were overwhelmed by a people with superior learning, superior skill, superior work ethic, and a superior family structure.]]

um, and the GUNPOWDER helped too? hehe

seriously, though, arguing over how much american indians were oppressed is kinda going in the wrong direction isn’t it?

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W.F. Price November 24, 2010 at 09:31

The Indians were overwhelmed by a people with superior learning, superior skill, superior work ethic, and a superior family structure.

-woggy

Don’t forget the disease — by the time smallpox and other assorted infections swept across the continent entire regions were depopulated.

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Richard November 24, 2010 at 09:42

I cannot provide a reference for this – but I heard the following:

The settlers would not have survived if the Native Americans didn’t show them how to “live off the land”.

That is part of what Thanksgiving is all about: The Native Americans were generous enough, and hospitable enough to welcome immigrants onto their land – and offer their knowledge of what crops to grow etc…

As far as slaughter goes: I also heard that 90% dies from measles, small pox and influenza. This means that the majority of Native Americans died from diseases that the European settlers unwittingly brought with them. They did not die from a massive evil-white-male genocide plan.

As the article suggests – people try to paint a very negative picture of the past – an inaccurate one at that.

It is sick.

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CajunQM November 24, 2010 at 09:49

Heard a comedian on satellite radio the other week. He brought up the point that when a vegetarian goes eat at someone’s house that eats meat, the host will prepare a vegetarian meal for their guest. But when the meat eater goes to the vegetarian’s house, all that’s served is vegetarian meals, no meat at all! Also the comedian brought up about the vegetarian food being made to look like hamburgers, hotdogs, etc.

“Often times the truth is said in jest!”

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Lara November 24, 2010 at 10:06

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universe November 24, 2010 at 10:23

Darn.
I wuz hopin’ that we could have blamed feminists for the lowered standards of this holiday. Wait a minute…they’ve got to be involved with this somewhere :) .
Yes, I agree Chuck, there’s more to this day by being satisfied with what one has than about eating a broiled bird. Hopefully we won’t all have to collectively chow down on tofu in the future.
Aside from the issues we concentrate on, our standard of living far exceeds most of the world’s population, but it seems there’s been a cost involved – loss of children, family cohesion and faith in our systems . We grouse about these issues because of the decline of our culture and standards we were once raised with.
I’m thankful that there a many more men cluing into mra/fra issues.

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Renee November 24, 2010 at 10:27

Well as for me, it’s interesting to note that more stores are opened for Thanksgiving, but I just watched a news segment saying that many customers liked the idea and apparently it’s in demand. So it’s not really the retailers as much as the American customers themselves.

And I have to agree with NHM in that making a big deal about Tofurkey is pretty ridiculous. As if Tofurkey in and of itself is detrimental to the tradition of Thanksgiving, which it’s not. And what’s wrong with changing tradition up a bit when it comes to food? In fact, isn’t it true that the pilgrims and Native Americans probably didn’t even have turkey but instead lobster, seal, swan, and deer???

On the micro level, my favorite holiday is lambasted for its tendency to bring together dysfunctional families, but this same sort of jibe isn’t considered when we celebrate bringing drunk dysfunctional random strangers together in celebration of sombreros, leprechauns, or slutty costumes over an uncommon celebration of Mexico, Ireland, and STDs. Valuing family and thinking outside of yourself for one day is marginalized as square at best and a tool of the patriarchy at worst.

You kind of lost me here. I’ve never seen any implication that valuing family and thinking of others is lost during Thanksgiving or that it’s lambasted, marginalized, and seen as a tool for it.

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Philip November 24, 2010 at 10:36

That Lara sounds like one confused lonely Female.
Im guessing she has an IQ of around 85.

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Renee November 24, 2010 at 10:38

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Robert November 24, 2010 at 10:55

For what it is worth I wish all of you who are reading this; a very happy thanksgiving and blessings!

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Carnivore November 24, 2010 at 10:56

What is the main point of Thanksgiving? Eating turkey, remembering the Pilgrims and Indians coming together, family time together? All secondary, although I agree with this article that there’s less and less of that. I’ll give you a hint on the main point. It’s called THANKSgiving. And whom, or rather, Whom, do you think we should be thanking? Another hint: it ain’t the Indians, Pilgrims, federal government, Obama, Ron Paul or our brave men fighting to preserve our freedom. That main point has been gone for a long time; not surprising, then, that the secondary aspects are disappearing.

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sestamibi November 24, 2010 at 10:56

No Richard, that’s not what Thanksgiving is all about: the Pilgrims giving thanks to the Indians for their forebearance.

What Thanksgiving is about is the gathering together of BOTH groups to give thanks collectively to God and to express gratitude to Him for the blessings He provided and for their prosperity in the face of very adverse conditions.

Which is why I go ballistic when I hear it referred to with ever-greater frequency as “Turkey Day”.

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Firepower November 24, 2010 at 11:01

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Anti Idiocy November 24, 2010 at 11:44

I can’t remember what company made it, but I tried tofurkey about a year ago. It was fucking horrible.

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White & Blue November 24, 2010 at 12:09

“The settlers would not have survived if the Native Americans had not shown them how live off the land”. Makes good sense; after all, these
folks had just crossed the Atlantic Ocean, and came from a land where no one ever ate food, because they couldn’t shoot animals with their rifles, harvest wild fruits & vegetables, or even knew how to fish. Of course, agriculture was unknown there as well. Utterly helpless until saved by a Stone-Age people who showed them how to scratch a furrow in the dirt with a stick & put a seed in the dirt which would grow into food. Learned this in school, did you?

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Firepower November 24, 2010 at 12:21

You’ve all helped me – so much – to realize that Men like, Geronimo, James Madison and General Geo. Patton, would be proud of their legacy: men who aren’t ashamed to accuse tofurkey as yet another key component of their downfall.

You’ve all made me feel finally like *sniff* crying!
Grouphug anyone???

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Chuck Ross November 24, 2010 at 12:46

Not that any of us care, but Angelina Jolie refuses to celebrate Thanksgiving and will be out of the country for the holiday. She reportedly said that “Brad can cook a turkey himself if he wants to”, but he knows he damn well better not.

My theory on this is that Jolie is actually just jealous of all the attention that turkies are getting – being that she looks like one herself.

Firepower November 24, 2010 at 12:53

hey, Bradd Pitt is an Alpha around here

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Firepower November 24, 2010 at 12:54

at least the tweens, kiddies, Brandons and Jareds think so – and that, after all, is what counts.

That, and their fantasy football league

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Lovekraft November 24, 2010 at 13:10

why would any MRA feel comfortable submitting himself to the phoniness, hush-hush attitude prevalent in most modern family get-togethers? It’s like we are being tolerated on a short leash, with our invitation revokable should we say the *gasp* un-PC thing.

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Firepower November 24, 2010 at 13:13

Shucks: for the same reason
we post here

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Lord Viktor November 24, 2010 at 13:14

@NMH:

Men stick to facts. the fact is we destroyed native American Indian culture by our greed to expand. .. .

God, dude, EVERY NATION was formed in this manner! Doesn’t matter if you’re speaking of America, Native America, or the goddamned nation of Nigeria!

EVERY COUNTRY IN HISTORY was formed through the destruction of the previous culture and civilizations before them. Every culture was created either through the assimilation or destruction of previous cultures.

And, oh yeah, speaking of the Native Americans, they are just as guilty of the same shit as you accuse us evil Americans of.

I’ll give you two big examples. There are plenty more (ohhhh, there’s much more) but I have a life, you understand.

Example #1:
Ever heard of the Beaver Wars? The Beaver Wars were waged between several tribes of Native Americans out of greed. The invaders wanted the territories with the beavers and so started raiding and pillaging, much how the white mane raided and pillaged the Indians when they landed.

Example #2:
Ever heard of the Iroquois Confederacy? It was a Native American nation made up of several who previously tried to kill each other off for each other’s resources but failed, so they banded together and went to war with all the other tribes. Why? To expand their empire, of course!

Much how the White Man felt it was his “Manifest Destiny” to wrest the land from the Native Americans, so the Iroquois Confederacy felt it was the will of The Great Spirit for them to subjugate and/or destroy anyone who refused to bow down to their rule.

And subjegate and destroy they did! Whoo-hoo!

And so it has been all throughout history through all the ages of Man, man!

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Firepower November 24, 2010 at 13:16

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some dude November 24, 2010 at 13:21

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Lord Viktor November 24, 2010 at 13:32

@Chuck Ross:

Not that any of us care, but Angelina Jolie refuses to celebrate Thanksgiving and will be out of the country for the holiday. She reportedly said that “Brad can cook a turkey himself if he wants to”, but he knows he damn well better not.

My theory on this is that Jolie is actually just jealous of all the attention that turkies are getting – being that she looks like one herself.

The only reason why Pitt went for that. . . .thing is because she was such a bad girl, a counter to Aniston’s goodie-goodie wholesomeness.

But in the final analysis, he and Jolie? It’s like putting gasoline on your pancakes. That shit just doesn’t go together!

Jolie couldn’t have emasculated Brad Pitt anymore than if she had grabbed a pair of garden shears and swapped off his testicles!

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BWB November 24, 2010 at 14:07

This reminds me of one of my favorite “The Far Side” cartoons here:

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f228/portugues90us/tofubeast.jpg

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Snark November 24, 2010 at 14:25

Eh.

Less Maddox, more Spearhead please.

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Snark November 24, 2010 at 14:28

It’s not often I disagree with you, Welmer, and I do consider you one of the finest writers in this business … but if you feel that your traditions are disgraced because somebody eats something in the shape of a turkey that isn’t really a turkey, you might be a little bit too sensitive.

(I know you didn’t write this piece, it’s in response to your statement that “It’s an offense against tradition and propriety.”)

And consider who this is coming from, I’m certainly no enemy.

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greyghost November 24, 2010 at 14:34

Happy Thanksgiving all. The only family i have here is the one I made and we are going to make ourselves a big dinner sit around in our boxer shorts(me) and pajamas (wife and Kids) over eat and enjoy ourselves and I’ll be cussing at the Dallas Cowboys through the TV screen. Just like any good american family.
PS no fake meat in our house.

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W.F. Price November 24, 2010 at 14:43

(I know you didn’t write this piece, it’s in response to your statement that “It’s an offense against tradition and propriety.”)

And consider who this is coming from, I’m certainly no enemy.

-Snark

It’s kind of a joke, Snark, like the entire tofurkey thing. I don’t think anyone really takes tofurkey all that seriously.

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misterb aka misterbastard November 24, 2010 at 14:58

thanksgiving is a white man’s tradition.

Though its meaning had changed in each generation. I noted that more of today’s youths and the general public are thankless lot.

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woggy November 24, 2010 at 15:17

NMH:
When, in the future, the Muslims overwhelm your descendents and enslave them or sentence them to death for not believing that Mohammad as the prophet they better their mouths shut.

You predict that this will happen, and I happen to agree. What goads me over it though is this:
It’s only going to happen that way because our “masters” have decreed it, and to see to it, they’ve induced a collective self loathing, self destructive guilt complex on a people whose abilities are superior- the gulf of knowledge between western culture and our assigned oppressors far exceeds the gulf of knowledge that existed between the white settlers and the American Indian.

Renee:
So basically their land was taken from them due to being overwhelmed. Oh and good point NHM about the “superior family structure”. To sum it up, germs, guns, and steel (or something like that).
Hey, you’re catching on.
Germs?
In the 1600′s, western culture hadn’t yet learned enough about germs to employ them as weapons. What no one bothered to tell you-or you hadn’t bothered to figure out for yourself- is that just as many, if not more, white European settlers died of infectious disease than did the Indians.

Guns and steel?
A DIRECT RESULT of superior learning and technology-deal with it.

I’ll admit I was a bit skeptical when some of the guys here have said that were it up to women, we’d still be living in mud huts.
The fact that you miss the point, and indeed eschew the reality- that learning=technology=domination- sort reinforces the idea that yes indeed, the ladies would have us living in mud huts and they would still be dying in childbirth.

Anyway, NMH and Renee, you’ve managed to prove the point Chuck Ross was trying to make.
Thank you very much.

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misterb aka misterbastard November 24, 2010 at 15:24

Actually it was the vikings who mapped North America. In truth Columbus didn’t discover America

The land is almost identical. But you would have to bear in mind, on which plant not to eat.
When situation took a downturn. Your ancestors were dropping like flies. from exhaustion, sickness, malnutrition, starvation.

Thomas Jefferson is an Atheist.

the Puritans are not as innocent as the media once portrays them, sure they accused women and their husbands of witchcraft, so they can take their lands.

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misterb aka misterbastard November 24, 2010 at 15:33

One of the tactics of conquest. is backstabbing. So there you go.

I sometimes still pity you white men. Don’t know why. I hate to say, that you’re being bred out, white people are in decline. And it aint us Indians. More like from Latinos and Muslims from Arab Peninsula.

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Jabberwocky November 24, 2010 at 18:06

My Holidays are spent with four sets of divorced parents and there new hodgepodge family units. Its not fun, and a logistical and political (family politics) nightmare.

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Renee November 24, 2010 at 19:24

Woggy,

Guns and steel?
A DIRECT RESULT of superior learning and technology-deal with it.

Hey I was really simply pointing out redundancy of having something taken from you vs being overwhelmed. What you said, and what Laura said falls along the same lines. Deal with that.

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Keyster November 24, 2010 at 19:49

FYI – The most delicious turkey you’ll ever have is brined.

http://www.slashfood.com/2009/11/11/turkey-brining-101-how-to-brine-that-bird/

Follow the instructions exactly, no shortcuts.
It’s like turkey candy, melts in your mouth.
Try it…next year or at Christmas or anytime.

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Beltain November 24, 2010 at 20:07

I guess the “lets blame the whiteboy” crew should at least be happy North America isn’t sparsely populated by stone age tribes these days. Tribes which also took the land (and slaves) from other stone age tribes. Because if it was I am pretty sure tofurkey would NOT have been invented nor would we have the acres and hectares of soybean to produce it from like we do today. Not to mention the resources to feed such a large percentage of the rest of the White hating world.

Those evil pilgrims had this planned all along dontcha know.

Well-loved. Like or Dislike: Thumb up 16 Thumb down 1
GT66 November 24, 2010 at 22:14

WGMOW wrote:

So the next time your wife or girlfriend tries to feed you some soy-based glop in place of real food, tell her to stuff it (and not in the turkey) and hie yourself down to the local bar and grill.

If any woman even attempted to serve that soy crap to a turkey addict such as myself, I would go postal. Or at the minimum, I’d throw a fit and ruin the day for everyone there.

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Avenger November 25, 2010 at 00:09

White and Blue-I’m glad you wrote that because I was going to.
They had shotguns and could easily kill game. The ocean and rivers are right there and you can get all the fish you want or just collect oysters or lobster near the shore.
And while these separatists from the church of England may not have been countrymen or outdoorsmen many were from rural areas and they certainly knew how to live off the land at a time when most people did so. Even if you lived in a town all your live you certainly came into contact with farmers selling their produce or animals and had some knowledge of these things, much more so than people today who just go to the supermarket and have no idea where things come from. So the story that they somehow needed the Indians to survive never made much sense. The company that financed them also wanted them to land in an area where they could establish a fishing industry on the Hudson where Manhattan is today but they accidently landed on Cape Cod also a good area for fish. What probably happened is that most of them were sick when they landed (half died the first year) and that by the ned of November the weather was already cold and snowy that year. They may have been too weak for hunting or fishing and also had to worry about shelter. I believe they did find a couple of small abandoned houses that were probably built by traders who used to trade with the Indians before any colonies were set up and also some abandoned Indian houses but it wasn’t much to live in in the cold winter.

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Robert November 25, 2010 at 01:07

If anyone plans to serve deep fried turkey, be careful. Safety while cooking can never be stressed enough.

Here is a good tip if you are roasting/baking a turkey in the oven; wrap the wings with aluminum foil until the turkey is about ten-fifteen minutes from being done (remember to use a meat thermometer to ensure the internal temperature of the breast is 160 degrees F). The foil keeps the wings from drying out/burning while you roast/bake the turkey. It might be a little labor intensive but you can loosen the skin from the turkey and rub the breast/abdomen of the turkey with seasoned butter or olive oil to keep the meat moist.

Of course you can cover the turkey in aluminum foil while roasting/baking it and let it steam cook until it is almost done then, uncover it to let the skin brown

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Snark November 25, 2010 at 01:15

It’s kind of a joke, Snark, like the entire tofurkey thing. I don’t think anyone really takes tofurkey all that seriously.

Was it a joke?

Really?

please don’t pretend tofu is a turkey. It’s an offense against tradition and propriety.

Hahahahahahaha?

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Robert November 25, 2010 at 01:18

I almost forgot, if you are going to be baking pumpkin pie, or any other pie where the filling takes as long to bake; wrap the outer crust with aluminum foil to prevent it from burning. Unwrap the outer crust and let it brown while the filling finishes cooking. Depending on what type of oven you are using, you should check the pie close to the end of the baking time stated on the box it came in. If you are making a pumpkin pie from scratch you already know the length of time it will take to finish baking.

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BoxANT November 25, 2010 at 01:59

While it was tragic that so many natives died from diseases brought over by european settlers, you have to keep in my how those europeans gained their immunity to aforementioned diseases. Previous generations paid the price in blood, lots of them.

Additionally, when you have a more advanced culture come into contact with a less advanced culture, it is no surprise that the other gets consumed. I mean, lets me honest, natives did not even have a written language or even a the wheel.

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Avenger November 25, 2010 at 02:33

Just buy a smoked turkey and heat it. Most people can’t cook anyway. If you really want to cook a turkey then get the smallest one you can find. Get 2 if you need more.

http://www.smokehouse.com/burgers.nsf/item/Herb-Roasted-Turkey

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Troll King November 25, 2010 at 02:58

Of course, Sharpcool, (lol), you nor I have not touch a native american–I was a little loose with the word “we”. However my (and possibly) your caucasian ancestors did. It is important to be aware what our culture, in the past, did to another. There is no revisionism here in accepting this dark fact in American history. If you say that this attitude about being aware of our past is liberal well then I am a liberal

Ummm, are you from spain? As far as I know I have zero relatives from spain and from what I have read of history, not revisionist shit either, is that the spaniards were horrible to the natives. I remember reading one book on the subject and it had a catholic priests first hand accounts of spaniard conquistadors making bets on who could cut a native down the middle with one chop of their spears.

Now, I don’t know about all you. But my family descends from mainly scottish and scotts irish roots with english and some germanic and plenty of Irish thrown in for good measure. It’s possible(but I have no real proof) that I have some black in me from a slave my great great great ancestors on my dads side owned. I wonder mainly because english and Irish people don’t tan the way I do, but it could be from a ancestor from east eurasia/middle east. Interestingly enough, there were plenty of turks and moroccans and greeks and other lightly dark skinned people that settled in the appalachian region in the early days of america. It’s why so many of the white guys around here in TN have such olive tones to their skin and dark curly hair even though their families have been here for 150+ years.

True story. I worked with this guy, a meat cutter, who was pasty and blond haired. He was cool but he was also a racist. He was the type that wouldn’t say anything to a black mans face but when he left the room,then he started in. That kind of person really pisses me off and I am convinced it’s a feminine thing to do and even more I think most guys learn racism from their mothers. But all that aside, he needed help digging a hole for a swimming pool one day so he paid me couple bucks and some beer to help him. It was hilarious watching this guy go from paper white to brown in the course of a few hours. See, most white people turn red and then brown. I dont burn but will turn pink and then by the next day I have a nice tan. He went from being white to looking like a mexican in like six hours.

I really don’t see how that’s possible unless he has some dark skinned ancestors. I understand how working under flourescents can make you whiter but I don’t understand how you can tan so fast so quick under natural sun. After seeing that I came to the conclusion that a lot of racism is the result of projecting self hatred of family mistakes out onto the world. It’s always women, around here anyways, that spend so much time on family status. You esp. see it with the sunday christians, as I call them, who go to church on sunday thinking it washes their sins clean from last week and gives them status too…if you have worked retail then you know how they are on sunday after church. They are what some sociologists call ‘good poor’ because they don’t look poor and put a lot of time and energy into trying to impress others to show they aren’t poor. While the ‘bad poor’ are those who look poor.

Both are either lower middle class or just above the poverty line on a socioeconomic scale. I noticed it in school when the kids that wore 50$ tshirts and 200$ jeans got off the bus in the projects and I saw they had nice cars but lived in gov. subsidized housing. While some of my friends that didn’t wear expensive cloths and still lived in a trailer were treated much differently. I think one of the reasons we look down on the poor so much is because of the ‘good poor’ and their attitudes. They are assholes and they abuse the system and one side of the political spectrum get’s pissed at it while the other side understands that they are trying to move up into the coveted status position of SWPL.

The thing to remember is that just like not all white-ish or euro descendents had a hand in killing off natives, not all poor are the same.

Happy thanks giving.

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Robert November 25, 2010 at 03:29

The internal temperature of the turkey should be 180 F. I don’t know where I got 160F. I am still debating with a feminist prosecutor.

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Troll King November 25, 2010 at 04:01

why would any MRA feel comfortable submitting himself to the phoniness, hush-hush attitude prevalent in most modern family get-togethers? It’s like we are being tolerated on a short leash, with our invitation revokable should we say the *gasp* un-PC thing

this is why I hate and loathe family get togethers. It’s also why you can tell that society is created by women and civilization created by men. Society is so phony and ritualistic. All about emotive impressions and stuff.

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Jay Hammers November 25, 2010 at 04:27

Anyone who eats tofu is looking to poison themselves. Unfermented soy is a poison.

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V3N0M1300 November 25, 2010 at 04:28

Vegetarians are completely full of shit. Not do animals eat other animals all the time, but plants are living things as well. You could just as easily say tofurky is cruel to…whatever the fuck tofu is made from. Oh, and there’s no scientific evidence that suggests vegetarianism is healthy, unless the meaning of healthy has suddenly changed to “full of estrogen.”

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Beltain November 25, 2010 at 05:08

Troll King

Ever seen the tan set on a lilly white skier? Pigment variants allowing quicker tanning has nothing to do with racial inter mixing as far as I know but is a safety mechanism built in that can be triggered with more sun exposure. Skin dryness and oil production also has some play there. I knew some Germans who would glow in the dark but once they started hitting the slopes their faces would be as brown as a paper bag on the exposed parts.

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woggy November 25, 2010 at 07:59

Hey I was really simply pointing out redundancy of having something taken from you vs being overwhelmed. What you said, and what Laura said falls along the same lines. Deal with that.

Dear Renee,
There is a tremendous lesson to be learned from history where weakness of faith, family, (real) education, technology and industry are concerned:
Be ahead of the curve or be out in the cold- but you already claim to know that.
Redundancy?
I’ll tell you what’s redundant. Harping about the beginnings of the United States- the patriarchy, the abuse and exploitation and all the rest of the overblown “misdeeds” of our forefathers- is redundant.
Another comment (the author’s name escapes me now) aptly pointed out that the course of human history is marked by more advanced people displacing those less advanced.
If you can find one square foot of habitable earth where this conquest/displace dynamic has NOT come into play, you’re free to ex-patriate to such place.
Then- and only then – will your sawing on about “taking” land not be tiresome, hypocritical and….redundant.

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Renee November 25, 2010 at 08:58

Keyster,
I’ve been wanting to try brining and eating brined meat for the longest :)

Woggy,
“Sawing about”??? I only made TWO small comments about it. If anyone is “sawing away” at this side topic it’s you. I was simply taking about the similarities in phrasing, grammar-wise. That’s all. Sheesh. Good point by the way.

GT66,

If any woman even attempted to serve that soy crap to a turkey addict such as myself, I would go postal. Or at the minimum, I’d throw a fit and ruin the day for everyone there.

LOL, I think a simple by firm “No thank you” will suffice.

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Sean November 25, 2010 at 09:28

Excellent posts, Troll King…the only thing I would add is that ‘racists’ cannot be reasoned with…not ever…not with logic, experience, history or otherwise.
Would save a lot of time if people of colour, white folk of honour & integrity really understood this.
Like I said elsewhere, people will talk all day long about ‘ancestors’ as long as it reflects positively on them…and conveniently bypass the rest.

Happy Thanksgiving to all.

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Zeev_Zwaard November 25, 2010 at 09:34

“So yes, my friends, Thanksgiving is fucked.”

You are right of course,

If Thanksgiving was the only thing that’s f#cked…

We have f#cked the whole country and our future and our children future, too.

In fact, we have probably managed to f#ck the whole of human civilization with the United States of America being its main moral, political and military pillar and support and most of the rest with few exceptions being just hangers on.

If we decided to re-found the country along the lines the Founding Fathers envisioned… And a thorough cleansing…

But we won’t.

So, yeah, we’re f#cked.

Why would Thanksgiving be the exception?

——
alpha November 24, 2010 at 07:24
“But why mess it up? Like I said before, it seems some group(s) just prefer to warp all traditions(for what reason, I have no clue)”

To destroy its moral meaning in order to sap the spirit and the will of the men so that when you climb the walls to attack the city they won’t get up to fight you.

——
As far as the indians, I’ve read somewhere that one of their main interests was to get the European’s help to liquidate a neighboring tribe. The indians were as peaceful as army ants.

——
misterb aka misterbastard November 24, 2010 at 15:33
“I sometimes still pity you white men.”

The fat lady hasn’t done her part, yet.

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White & Blue November 25, 2010 at 11:13

Excellent writing, Avenger. And thanks to Chuck for the article. Interesting info (perhaps) follows-

The myths, legends, and sheer mysticism about Thanksgiving are
rampant. The historical truth is one of the most powerful stories of
America and why it /i/s/ was successful.

When the pilgrims landed in Massachusetts they were organized on
communist grounds. Almost 400 years ago, which was about 200 years
before Karl Marx was born, the pilgrims were a “Commonwealth”. Many
states still retain that title as part of their name. It means that
all production from farming, fishing, hunting, and all forms of
production and distribution was centralized. The government doled
things out on the basis of need.

And the people suffered. People were malnourished. Many were sick
because they were so weak from famine that they could not fight off
disease. People died.

The Governor was William Bradford. He solved the problem by creating
private property rights. Anything you produced was yours to eat or
use.

The following harvest was so bountiful that people were amazed. They
declared it a miracle. They also held a harvest festival/feast. Such
events are still common in Europe. It was the first thanksgiving.

How do we know this? Governor Bradford kept a private journal. He
documented the problem and the solution.

Is this taught in schools? Hell no.

Governor Bradford’s journal was looted by the British during one of
the wars of independence. It showed up in the archives of the Bishop
of London in the 1850s. It took a long time to negotiate the release
of the document, but eventually it was returned and stored in the
Massachusetts state library. The original is still legible, but uses
early 17th century spelling and terms.

By the time the journal was returned the myths and legends were well
established. The educational system was already corrupt and teaching
the evils of government control versus the virtues of private property
has never been popular with teachers who know that they work for the
government.

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Renee November 25, 2010 at 12:12

In my last post, “by” is supposed to be “but”.

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Fender Cyborg November 26, 2010 at 13:44

White America is toast, plain and simple. At least for white men, but soon it’ll be toast for white women too. White women will be toast as soon as the government is run by Mexicans and other people won’t give a shit about affirmative action for stupid white bitches. By recent calculations that should be about another15-20 years. Because by then, white people won’t be a majority.

White women have left us white men all to rot… they’re too busy worshiping the gods of consumerism, liberalism, political correctness, and the herd mentality.

But the gravy train will only last until white women have overpriced themselves to the point where they aren’t breeding enough to maintain political power in the USA. When the tide shifts to Hispanics being the majority. White women will be left in the cold. Because by then America ought to just be renamed Mexico II.

Oh, well. Not like I fucking care. I’ll be getting the pop corn ready.

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Anonymous age 68 November 27, 2010 at 13:02

The only reason indigenous folk didn’t rape and pillage the land is because as a primitive matriarchy, they didn’t have the technological ability to do it. When white men started paying for skins, the indigenous pillaged the animals, such as beaver, nearly destroyed them.

Let’s look at my wife’s ancestors in Mexico. They slaughtered an incredible number of humans by ripping their still beating hearts out of their chests. Clearly that was better than the evil white man, right?

It was the surrounding tribes who allegedly sought to use Cortes’ army to defeat the Aztecs, who had been very cruel masters. If the Aztecs had not been such cruel masters, and motivated all the tribes to help Cortes fight them, Cortes might have lost.

In the US itself, they had slaves, and at times killed them for fun. There was an archaeological site which showed the primitive folks ran a large quantity of animals off a cliff solely to get what they wanted to eat. The indigenous people were not pure and one with nature at all.

But, the important thing is if they had the ability, they’ have gone to Europe and wiped it out as they wiped each other out on a regular basis.

The reason the Europeans won is because they had patriarchy, of sorts, and motivated men kick butt on unmotivated men in a matriarchy intent only on fighting and killing each other.

I do think the US is f*cked, but as one man said the fat lady hasn’t sung yet.

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David M. Green November 28, 2010 at 10:54

It’s been known for years that farmers pump their livestock with female hormones and there are chemicals in plastics that break down into compounds that mimic estrogen. So if you are eating meat on a regular basis and/or store and cook your food in plastic containers then you getting a pretty good dose of estrogen in your diet.

Milk is also one of the most dangerous foods that individuals over consume which causes a protein imbalance within the body so calcium is leached from the bones instead of being absorbed.

My wife, son and I gave up eating meat for health and religious reasons over twenty years ago and we don’t miss it. Nor do we badger our relatives who eat meat or tolerate the intolerance of dietary bigots.

So get over it and enjoy the holidays… :)

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Firepower November 30, 2010 at 12:16

Anonymous age 68 November 27, 2010 at 13:02

The only reason indigenous folk didn’t rape and pillage the land is because as a primitive matriarchy,

the fact your comment garnered more negs is proof that trolls have taken over this place

inf*ckingcredible

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Jay Hammers November 30, 2010 at 15:55

David, I’d suggest eating some grass fed beef, wild-caught salmon, and the like, if possible, rather than cutting out meats altogether. Human beings are omnivores.

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