According to a study of 6,000 Australian women, shacking up with a man leads to women packing on the pounds. All of the women studied were between the ages of 18 and 23 at the beginning of the study, and by the end of the ten-year study most of them had “partnered” with a man and about half had given birth.
The women who remained single gained the least weight – 11 pounds – while those who had given birth gained an average of 20 pounds. However, the women who were partnered but had not given birth still gained four more pounds on average than the single women.
The study appears to confirm a common, yet usually unvoiced, source of frustration for husbands. Possible reasons for the weight gain cited by researchers include a “more active social life,” although that might seem counterintuitive to many married people, particularly those who have children. Other possible explanations, such as the increasingly sedentary lifestyle adopted by many married women or a sense of complacency (no longer need to find a mate), were not mentioned.
{ 128 comments… read them below or add one }
I looked up figures to see in which sex the weight gain is worse and came up with this as a preliminary:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/2007-10-22-marriage-weight_N.htm
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Looks like men gain more, but women appear to have an edge relatively speaking.
For the record, I’m 20 pounds lighter than when I was with my ex — I only eat when I’m hungry now, and it’s easy to stay thin that way.
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Men apparently gain more weight – I believe it. We should try harder to avoid it, same as our wives. But men are typically taller, broader, and more densely built (muscle) than women, so a greater weight gain does not have the same impact on our looks. More importantly, our looks have less of an impact on our relationships than women’s.
Perhaps guys dumb enough to get married in the first place should insist the wedding vows contain, “love, honor, and run a mile a day”.
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Looked around and there’s data that says the opposite with the Dutch: http://jasonshafrin.com/papers/Marriage.pdf
Yet the US data looks sound as well.
Are there cultural differences?
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And just for fun, let’s thrown in data by ethnicity:
http://ssw.unc.edu/jif/aahmi09/presentations/5E%20Fitzgibbons%20Shafer%20slides.pdf
(significant increase in obesity in hispanic and AA females but not white. Or in any of the males in this dataset. Why’s the data all over the place? Je ne sais pas. Maybe interpreting it wrongly due to trying not to spend too much time on this.)
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@Bhetti
Maybe you could do an in-depth report for girlgame. Health is your specialty after all.
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Nothing to see here, folks. Just more “hate facts”, courtesy of the patriarchy”! Clearly this was only financed to set back the glorious cause of feminism/Mother Gaia. Nevermind that this matches your own experience and observations; feminists know better than to pay attention to something pesky like reality. Get back in line, man servant!
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Eh, whatever. Guys gain weight too, though perhaps slightly less as a percentage of their initial weight. Most of it is just the lifestyle (and, of course, childbirth, where applicable). It would be totally wrong to think that the women no longer care about gaining the weight (at least none of the ones I know, including mine).
If the women were still as enthusiastic about sex, 10 or 20 pounds here or there wouldn’t make much difference, if any. Might even be a bonus, depending on where she started.
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Bob: It’s true the weight gain doesn’t have as much of an impact on looks with men, depending on his build. I agree it’s not so much looks directly to worry over but the problems with the associated effects which change your behaviour, as well as weight gain being possibly symptomatic of a change in attitude too. Notably, a decrease in testosterone.
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“It would be totally wrong to think that the women no longer care about gaining the weight (at least none of the ones I know, including mine).”
So women are now helpless victims against the piles of fat that are added to their bodies, eh? Those 20+ pounds just attack the poor dear and she’s absolutely powerless to do anything about it. Who the heck can lose weight, anyways, right – much less keep it off in the first place! Those cheetos and colas are just invading her defenseless mouth, day after day, and at the end, when she’s all nice and bloated for you, well… I suppose the treadmill and vegetables are also warring against the poor dear.
Give me a break, Anon. I hope you enjoy screwing your wife’s third belly fat roll.
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Welmer: I like that idea for GG. It is an area worth indepth discussion, from its huge impact on a relationship to areas of misinformation regarding how to maintain a healthy body.
Since we’re suggesting things, speaking of demonstrating low impacts on looks. Maybe you could toss us some more pics of you in allegedly ‘redneck’ outfits. Handling a gun optional.
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@Bob,
Testosterone Dips after Vows
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Breaking news from The Spearhead: Women Are Too Fat
Just kidding, you guys know it’s always love.
But really, the line that stuck out to me was that the study “appears to confirm a common, yet usually unvoiced, source of frustration for husbands.”
INDEED! Clearly, men – married or not – are not voicing this frustration enough.
When did it become unacceptable to call someone out for their weight? Excluding France and Mexico, of course.
Why should any man walk on eggshells around his fat girlfriend or wife?
Have you guys ever read those ‘fat activism’ blogs? It’s some offshoot of feminism, and it’s hilarious. Really, really funny, if you have the time.
I say that men must raise their voices and criticise women ever more for letting themselves go!
An overweight wife or girlfriend is unacceptable. Period. And no the same doesn’t apply in reverse. That’s just stupid.
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Lost a lot of the good redneck ones due to ex seizing the computer. One of my favorites captures flying brass casings gleaming in the sun as they arc through a cloud of gunsmoke — I need to find that picture if it still exists. But here I am around the same time as the other one but cleaned up:
Presentable Welmer
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In a word -
W-A-R-P-I-G-S
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Another waste of money on a study that we do not need.
Most people do put on weight as they get older. Single people often cannot be bothered cooking only for themselves. I know that when I was single I would have salad or fruit for dinner because after working a long tiring day, there was no real incentive to cook. Now of course, I have a family, so I am cooking meals every night. Obviously it would be easy to over indulge if one was not careful. Like eating leftovers for example.
People eat way to much, much of which has little nutritional value as well. Ditch the sodas, potato crisps, cookies. Also fast food like pizzas and burgers.
Hubby and I make our own pizzas, and use nutritious and fresh ingredients.I make the dough and the fresh tomato sauce infused with garlic and herbs, whilst he puts the toppings on them and does the cooking. The kids love ‘em.
Most importantly too, many people lead sedentary lifestyles. Exercise should be an integral part of one’s day. I have, since I was twenty, exercised daily. I rarely miss a day. I usually work out for 1 hour a day at home incorporating weights..
My family is an an active one, none of us are overweight.
This is all common sense, really.
Eat sensibly, don’t skip meals and exercise.
I do have one real weakness though…I am a sucker for a few glasses of semillon sauvignon blanc..
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I think there’s a correlation between happiness and weight gain or loss.
Some gain weight when they are unhappy. Some when they are happy.
Some cultures say if you dont’ gain weight after marriage then your wife or husband is not taking good care of you.
A chubby wife or husband is considered a satisfied one in some cultures.
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I thought big was beautiful!
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My wife was quite trim for several years after our marriage, but after the third child in particular she just became quite overweight. Being nice and tall and rangy is fine, but a girl like that can really pack on the pounds.
I think she is finally getting on top of the problem, and has a bit of a figure returning. But she could still lose a stone, or even two.
Even in her late forties, she is still quite pretty and could have a real MILF thing going if she tried. She has always had a good basic figure.
Women get lazy about this, and I think it is kind of disrespectful to their husbands. I have never been happy about it. Since I have got tougher with her, partly in response to the whole “game” thing on the Internet, she seems to have made more progress in losing weight.
The truth is that people need real incentive to make a major personal change like losing weight and getting fitter. I think my wife is now more generally keen to please me, and losing weight is part of that.
A fat woman who is doing nothing about it is – in many cases – a woman who has little respect for her husband. It’s a bad sign.
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Here’s most of my post on The Balls Monologues on the subject:
“…
The study doesn’t particularly pertain to my own life, since most of the women I have dated and will continue to date don’t even weigh 104 pounds, let alone 140. By stating this, I am assuming that the concomitant weight gain by petite chicks is proportional, so a 94-pound chick that didn’t have a baby would weigh only about 102 after 10 years, and 110 afer 20.
Only one specific cause was theorized in the New York Times article on the study. Maureen A. Murtaugh, an associate professor of epidemiology at the University of Utah who the Times states has published widely on weight gain in women, suggested that a more active social life may help explain why women with partners gain more weight.
“Think of going to a restaurant,” Dr. Murtaugh said. “They serve a 6-foot man the same amount as they serve me, even though I’m 5 feet 5 inches and 60 pounds lighter.”
Personally, I have found that quickly devouring my own meal and staring at my partner’s plate like a hungry animal tends to cause her to offer me some of her food, alleviating the Murtaugh effect. In a similar vein, I also recommend offering your date Swedish Fish while on the way to the restaurant – they are full of sugar, but fat-free, and will cause the broad to feel full and ultimately order a lot less.
I also theorize that my practice of taking my partners to swingers clubs as the primary Saturday night date option helps. Not only does one – guy or gal – fell unsexy eating a big meal just before group sex, but the ingestion of ecstasy, cocaine, vodka Red Bull and Oxycontin -substances which a healthy majority of my swing-club dates have taken prior to the festivities, serves as an appetite – suppressant. Moreover, they don’t feel like eating much the next day.
I also rarely date someone long enough to witness substantial weight gain. That having been said, I did have sex with one woman at least once a year for 12 consecutive years, though we would hardly have considered each other our “partner” for more than a small fraction of that time, as our activity for much of that time amounted to little more than thrice-annual booty calls with facial finishes. Perhaps not uncoincidentally, she’s still rail thin.
I have no doubt whatsoever that the study would produce similar results for just about any female population studied, at least if the women studied were in the pre-osteoporosis years. As presumptive-guyinist “James” commented to the New York Times, “There’s a perfectly obvious, though cynical, explanation for this: many women stay in shape (and otherwise try to maximize their attractiveness) in order to catch a mate. Once they have caught a mate, they stop trying.”
That having been said, the study population was markedly different than one would expect from a similar group of women in the United States. As reported by the Times, “The number of women with a baby but no partner was too small to draw statistically significant conclusions.”
More from The Balls Monologues at http://guyinism.com
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You need to recover those photos from your ex! Your data, after all. You should have legal access to it — head on over with a thumb drive…
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@Welmer-
Wow. You look a lot like me, that is, if you take away your high cheekbones and strong jaw, you know, those structural signifiers of testosterone, ie. masculinity. My hair is silkier however. All the more to feminize my overall look. Don’t worry, when I turned 2o, I could finally grow facial hair and so grew a scruffy goatee that after a few years of filling out, I could carefully and artistically shape it so as to create the illusion that I actually have a chin. It also had the side benefit of making it impossible to be confused with a 15 year old boy. So by the time I turned 22, girls actually made eye contact with me. Handsome people. You have it so easy.
J/K Would you like some sour grapes jelly with your peanut bitter sandbitch? Why yes, yes I would. It wasn’t that bad actually, but being called “cute” isn’t what guys want to hear. It’s the visual equivalent of being called “nice”. But if my dad is anything to go by, not having any bone structure in my face means there isn’t much for wrinkles to form between, so I should age very well. And my hair really is magnificent. My feet are amazing also. I could be a foot model. Any women out there got feet fetishes? No? Maybe thats just a guy thing.
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Dirk Johnson-
Ur funny. And quite the little ambitious self promoter, aren’t you? No problem from me, I do the same. I just don’t have a product to sell right now, so I do it just for my ego……what are you selling again?
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@Bhetti:
Yes, there are. For Australians, marriage is more important than it is in other cultures, almost to the point of obsession. Where in any culture marriage is often regarded as a “right of passage”, in the cultural wasteland that is Australia, with its obsessions with materialism and hedonism and its denial of matters of the soul, marriage is an absolute priority, the focus of life’s purpose, the be-all and end-all of existence. Why? Because that’s what everyone else does. Once this priority is accomplished, Australians let themselves go, and they do so in a big way. Australian “morality” has less to do with courage and standing up for what you believe in than it does with conformity and receiving approval from others. So long as you meet certain standards by the requisite age (marriage and home ownership are the two staples of personal worth and identity), anything else is forgiveable, and you can let yourself bloat to the size of a blimp. Why? Because that’s what everyone else does.
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Hi codebuster. I think you are a bit hard on us Australians. As a man, I think it is a great country to live in. As I have said before, the women here seem pretty sane compared with some other places.
I don’t detect any obsession with marriage here. Are you sure?
The rest of what you write has a grain of truth in it, but it just reads like an old-fashioned stereotype to me.
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… just noticed the article refers to having a partner… obviously I am using the word “married” interchangebly with “partnered”. same principle applies.
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David, of course I’m sure. During my last trip to America, I was surprised how much better women over 35 look than they do in Australia in the same age category. The difference was staggering, by my observation.
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“in the cultural wasteland that is Australia, with its obsessions with materialism and hedonism and its denial of matters of the soul, marriage is an absolute priority, the focus of life’s purpose, the be-all and end-all of existence. ”
Codebuster, from your description Australia sounds like a traditional culture much like the entire planet from Turkey on Eastwards. From Turkey on Eastward you find this obsession with marriage because it is tied to the concepts of “chastity” “duty” and “family”.
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@OM Shanti
Cultures are extremely difficult to describe with precision. Which is why I choose my words very carefully. Note the presence of the words “hedonism” and “materialism”. These cultural dimensions are NOT characteristics of “traditional” cultures.
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codebuster,
Interesting. Americans do everything in grand style. Australians are lazier. I noticed that women in America – I was there in 1982, in Buffalo – really put effort in. They wore a lot of makeup and tried really hard. Like they were studying for a high grade in Female 101.
Same with American women’s attitudes to men – all the way from ballbusting feminists to little backwoods submissives. Australian women are more, well, “normal”.
But, honestly, a lot of this can just be random impressions. I remember being told by a colleague how everybody in Montreal was really short. I went there myself a bit later, and didn’t notice it.
Australian women don’t try very hard with makeup and clothes. But I doubt they are any fatter than American women on average. Probably less.
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http://www.foodconsumer.org/newsite/Non-food/Miscellaneous/the_world_s_fattest_countries_1712090555.html
Nope, Australia is not in the top ten.
Mind you obesity is definitely on the increase.. Not only in Australia, however.
I do not think as David mentioned, that Australians are obsessed with marriage, either. No more so than other nations like the U.K or the U.S. for instance.
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Australia is nothing like Turkey. Maybe a mixture of California and Texas. I don’t know. Australians are part of the Anglosphere.
I think a lot of our ancestors were Celts and Cockneys. Fairly low class but culturally and socially conservative. I think some of that has stuck.
Australians are tolerant but conservative. If two homosexuals move in next door, they will make jokes about “poofs”, but they won’t bother them.
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@Kathy Farrelly
I’m always suspicious of stats, but seeing as Kathy’s going there, I’ll go there too:
http://www.theage.com.au/news/health/australia-worlds-fattest-nation/2008/06/19/1213770886872.html
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They wore a lot of makeup and tried really hard. Like they were studying for a high grade in Female 101.
I know, it’s silly.
Who are they trying to impress?
Note the presence of the words “hedonism” and “materialism”. These cultural dimensions are NOT characteristics of “traditional” cultures.
Oh traditional cultures are materialistic alright. Just not in the same way.
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Snark,
The same DOES apply in reverse. A guy letting himself go is just as pathetic as a woman. Just because women don’t seem to care doesn’t make it any better. This is definately an area where American guys do not cover themselves in glory. Be a man and hit the gym! (not saying you personally)
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@OM Shanti
I’m glad you picked up on the very subtlety that I intended to convey. There are indeed different kinds of materialism, and I don’t have time to write a book to describe them all. And I further don’t have time to write a thesis explaining why some materialisms are more damaging than others, that’s for another day. But suffice to say, you are on track.
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The same DOES apply in reverse. A guy letting himself go is just as pathetic as a woman. Just because women don’t seem to care doesn’t make it any better.
Perhaps there’s a correlation to the much lamented “decline in my wife’s libido” that we often hear from men, and the above stated fact?
“not tonight honey, i’ve got a headache”
translation: you’ve let yourself go and just don’t turn me on anymore. yuck. now let me go to sleep and dream about Jude Law, Hrithik Roshan, Shemar Moore.
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Codebuster, “TheFat Bomb” report wasn’t a study that was published in a peer-reviewed medical journal, See Sandy Szwarc’s (she has a bacheolor of science in nursing) critical examination of the study here.
http://junkfoodscience.blogspot.com/2008/06/run-fat-bomb-getting-ready-to-detonate.html
The World Health Organizations’ is a more recent and accurate report I believe.
We still need to be concerned about the levels of obesity in Australia and America. I just don’t see any evidence that shows Australians to be fatter than Americans, really..
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Most importantly too, many people lead sedentary lifestyles. Exercise should be an integral part of one’s day.
ITA, not only to keep the weight off but to keep energy levels up as well. A good workout or a quick mile or two walk is a far more effective way to start the day than a jolt of sugar or caffeine and excellent for dwindling afternoon energy levels as well.
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If she had been a 42-year old guy, and the 16 year old guy was a girl.. this would have been blasted from every news channel and media outlet
_________________________________
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/01/06/lauri-price-charged-houst_n_414148.html
HOUSTON — A Houston mother remained jailed Wednesday after authorities said she flew to Canada and lured a 16-year-old boy, whom she allegedly had an online sexual relationship with for more than a year, away from his home.
Lauri Price, 42, has been charged by prosecutors in Houston with two counts of online solicitation of a minor and one count of enticing a child with the intent to commit a felony.
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Jabberwocky,
For now, I’m just selling me, though if you have around $200 to spend on a good time next time your in Tampa, I’ll be happy to hook you up with some nice girls.
OK, maybe they’re not so nice, but you’ll like them anyway.
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those who had given birth gained an average of 20 pounds
The important thing is whether or not they keep it on…
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Kathy Farrelly,
With respect…
No World Health Organization!
Please don’t give them baby slashing, wymin firster, man-hating SOB’s any credibility!
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Even Unicef is now using their collections to give women free abortions, to promote the Feminist and the UN’s agenda. That is where your pennies go.
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I agree that both women and men letting themselves go weight wise is wrong in most marriages. However I have to say that it’s been my observation that some couples simply gain the weight together by enjoying food together, having kids taking away from work out time, and not worrying so much about how they look.
The couples that I know that are overweight seem for the most part pretty happy with each other, and in the long-term seem to have a decreased level of infidelity. It might be that nature puts on pounds to maintain marital fidelity?
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The lowered testosterone levels of married men depresses me, too. Makes me want to live a swingin’ single life, drink, smoke, and die at fifty like a real man. Unfortunately, I have work to do.
On a related note, I wonder how many men are willing to tell a woman she is too skinny, compared to how many will tell a woman she is too fat? And if that varies if the woman in question is a stranger, a friend, a sister, a lover, or a raging bitch just asking to be insulted?
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Fat Bottomed Girls, You Make the Rockin’ World Go Round!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-D99n9f3vU4
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Abortion is MURDER and I certainly do not sanction it under any circumstances Fedrz, even when a woman has been raped!
10 years ago at a routine ultra sound at 16 weeks I was told that my baby was going to die.. Just like that..No hope. …My baby had a neural tube defect, anencephaly.
I refused to abort my baby. She was stillborn at 26 weeks. My wonderful husband and my faith in God sustained me during that most traumatic time in my life.
I have no regrets, I could not murder my own child, even though I knew that she would not survive anyway. (though I had hoped and prayed that she would) I know in my heart that my dear little daughter is in heaven looking down on her family.
No such reprieve for the woman who aborts her baby.. She is left to live with that on her conscience for the rest of her life.
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Kathy Farrelly,
More respect!
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What were the rates of increase in weight for the respective husbands vs. bachelors in the study?
If married men are gaining weight at the same rates after marriage, its a couple that is practicing poor diet, poor exercise, and poor health choices together.
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Women care about it.
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There is no excuse for Anglo women to be as fat as they are. NONE.
The unavoidable, disgusting sight of fat women in the Anglosphere is an absolute disgrace, proving once again that women are not capable of disciplining their behavior when controls are loosened from them. Our Anglo societies must once again re-impose controls on women if we want them to look healthy, feminine and pleasing for men. If men cannot muster the courage to face this fact, then they do not deserve to be released from their misery.
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Do men also gain weight after marrage. WTF? who cares? I bet he still makes money after marriage. God help any male who marries then loses his attractiveness (in the form of financial and social status) to his partner. Even he knows it’s over in such a case. So why all the handwringing over the poor wittle girliewirlies and their ‘unfortunate’ weight gain? If she could be slim beforehand, there’s no plausible explanation short of laziness for it afterward (short term circumstances notwithstanding).
Women have expectations of men, likewise men of women.
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The lowered testosterone levels of married men depresses me, too. Makes me want to live a swingin’ single life, drink, smoke, and die at fifty like a real man. Unfortunately, I have work to do.
Why? As we age our sex hormones naturally decrease, freeing up our energy for higher pursuits in the service of God, humanity, whatever.
Also, if you have children and grand-children living nearby and enjoy a healthy and tight-knit family dynamic, your time and energy will go towards nurturing that.
I think the post-modern West is the only culture that has ever looked at sex in old age as good thing or something to be coveted.
All other cultures see old age as a venerated and respected time for wisdom and teaching the younger generations. Not for getting laid.
Viagra is ridiculous and could only be invented by a society and within a time era like the one we currently live in – a degraded and immature one.
Old age for becoming like Gandhi or Mother Theresa and making an influence on the world or at least your community, if you have one. But you probably don’t, hence the obsession with sex.
(“you” means in general, not you – Bob, specifically)
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It is an embarrassment for a man to be seen with a fat woman. Women have an obligation to keep up their appearances, as it denotes care and devotion to feminine values.
Male physical appearance is lower on the list of things females find attractive. It is mostly personality, as well as the ability to buy goodies and necessities for the wife, that clinches it for the female.
Only in a patriarchy, where controls are placed on women to make sure they either don’t either misbehave blow up into fat whales, are women beautiful and feminine.
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Should read: “…where controls are placed on women to make sure they either don’t misbehave or blow up into fat whales…”
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I have the solution to married women getting fat and losing interest in sex… short term marriage contracts.
It would keep the guys motivated too. Good all round really. It works for business why not marriage?
Just imagine what kind a service you would get from your phone company if you signed up for life. It seems ridiculous but people sign open ended marriage contracts everyday. Contracts with huge penalty clauses!
Oh, I forgot! You can’t apply rational business logic to this… it’s l-o-v-e.
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””””””’fedrz January 6, 2010 at 20:16
Even Unicef is now using their collections to give women free abortions, to promote the Feminist and the UN’s agenda. That is where your pennies go.
”””””””
Do you have any more information on this. I have checked around and it looks like it will be 400 bucks to get rid of the 3 week old mass of flesh the chick I am with at moment is carrying.
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I do have the info.
But, I do not support abortion.
Period.
I don’t know if you are joking, but I am not laughing – at all.
http://no-maam.blogspot.com/2007/04/aaghh-my-complete-disgust-with.html
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Furthermore, Gun.
You are a military man.
Do you realize that if abortion were illegal, we wouldn’t have to take in massive amounts of immigrants, but, rather would would have OUR OWN babies, to sustain us in the future?
So they ask you to run around like a fucking idiot, dodging bullets…
But yet, it is too much to ask our women to have some goddamn children to make it worth your while to risk your life that.
Nope, sorry! What you did was pointless, because the broads wouldn’t even bear enough babies, in relative safety compared to you.
Don’t you feel smart.
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Yea I used to think that way but hey accidents happen apparently. I don’t want the kid. I don’t want to help raise it. I told the chick from beginning I didn’t want a kid. I told her I was going to be leaving at a projected time and we would no longer be hanging out from the beginning. Would you rather I pay 18 to 21 years of child support for a kid I don’t want?
I had and have no intention of staying with this chick and it was again made very clear to her from the beginning.
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Yeah, well, most soldiers didn’t count on war when they signed up.
40,000,000 dead babies.
Many would be of reproductive age by now.
Women can’t be fucking bothered.
Maybe you SHOULD keep it in your pants, and so should she.
Military men should be furious.
But you get your ass shot off to protect these ditch pigs who murder at the drop of a hat… and you support it.
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I don’t want to see women drafted into the army!
How about we draft them into something they are experts at… making new citizens, so we don’t all go broke and lose our country!
Gee!
Is that harder than what you did?
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Well I wasn’t even sure I could have kids. Now I know I can which is good. My plan is to have lots of babies just not in the us. I am done my time as a civilian contractor and it is time to enjoy the fruits of my labors. I was on medical leave in the us where I was basically kidnapped and sent. After signing paperwork to go home to my wife in another country. They escorted me to us soil. Like sat on the plane with me after I wrote an email about how safety was there value and all and then when I had massive stomach pain and they had no way of diagnosing it they kept me working 12 hour days 7 days a week while enduring massive stomach pain for two months. Basically would be up all night in pain then had to somehow do the work of three people during the day when I was sent to a new camp where two people had already quite because of the high workload and two people where on r&r. So yea just me filling literally three peoples jobs. Then the camp manager was new at it and didn’t know shit. I also had to explain processes to that dude as well. At some point I was just staring at the work and couldn’t even do it I was so sleep deprived and a drooling vegetable. Turns out my gall bladder was completely fucked and puss filled when they took it out.
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But yea someone actually in the army cannot spend 5 years straight working 12 hour days. They get breaks lol
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I did spend 6 months in bosnia in the army but yea then we left.
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””””””But yet, it is too much to ask our women to have some goddamn children to make it worth your while to risk your life that. ””””””’
It was worth it because I found a woman that is actually equal in another country. She was there for me through 5 years of the crap I went through and now there for me as I was there for her.
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”””””How about we draft them into something they are experts at… making new citizens, so we don’t all go broke and lose our country!””””””
If you haven’t noticed having a baby with a chick in the us is like holding dynamite and lighting the fuse.
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Yea I used to think that way but hey accidents happen apparently. I don’t want the kid. I don’t want to help raise it. I told the chick from beginning I didn’t want a kid. I told her I was going to be leaving at a projected time and we would no longer be hanging out from the beginning. Would you rather I pay 18 to 21 years of child support for a kid I don’t want?
I had and have no intention of staying with this chick and it was again made very clear to her from the beginning.
So why didn’t you use a condom you FOOL!?!
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I probably could use a good lawyer if someone wanted to make some easy money.
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Oh and yea I seriously would not want my children raised in the us. Be crazy to want it. So they can be drugged up for having high energy. Fuck that. Again just another reason out of many many reasons not to want your children in us.
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Ask your military rep if he can forward you to a high payed private lawyer.
I feared I got a woman pregnant a while back, but thankfully, your ideas were not on the table. Neither was marriage. I played the game, I fucked up, and I knew the rules. I shouldn’t have played.
No killing.
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And now you know because your girlfriend said so?
Your life man, but I’d be getting a second opinion. I’d be letting her know I’d be insisting on a paternity check, and I’d be privately doing a check on my own sperm count. A 3 week pregnancy often mysteriously turns out to be a false alarm as well.
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Naa I mean a lawyer to sue kbr.
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Although really I am prob just going to move on with my life.
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Abortion is ultimately just another form of birth/population control. It can’t be totally eliminated, nor is it desirable to do so.
The whole idea behind the anti-abortion movement is all wrong. It’s fine to object to it on religious/moral grounds, but the primary reason to restrict abortions should not be religious. The primary reason should always be to either limit or take away women’s rights.
Abortion (like voting) is yet another example of how liberalized controls on women have worked to the detriment of men and society. Abortion might have a place in a functioning patriarchal society, but let’s cut this nonsense once and for all about some “right of a woman to choose.”
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She got a blood test at the doctors. He said congratulations. I told him to go get a coathanger.
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I’m with you. I’d take jail for CS arrears over killing a baby any day.
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””””””””’piercedhead January 7, 2010 at 00:36
Well I wasn’t even sure I could have kids. Now I know I can which is good.
And now you know because your girlfriend said so?
Your life man, but I’d be getting a second opinion. I’d be letting her know I’d be insisting on a paternity check, and I’d be privately doing a check on my own sperm count. A 3 week pregnancy often mysteriously turns out to be a false alarm as well.
”””””””””
Naa I told her straight up I wouldn’t have anything to do with the kid if she had it. Giving no illusions that anything like johnny needs new shoes or whatever is going to work on me. Nor will calling me a bad dad work later on either since I have said from the beginning I don’t want the kid. I won’t be phoning to see how the kids doing. I won’t be giving a fuck about its progress. Stuff like that. She is gonna have an abortion. She cannot in any way lie to herself that I will have anything to do with the kid. So yea I guess secret is to make very clear intention from beginning that this will not make you marry the chick. This will not make you have an extended relationship with her. This will not keep you around.
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‘[”””””””Welmer January 7, 2010 at 00:40
No killing.
-fedrz
I’m with you. I’d take jail for CS arrears over killing a baby any day.
”””””””’
Well aparently people get what they want don’t they. I don’t want to go to jail for cs arrears. I don’t want to be a slave to the system. In a nutshell you have just laid bare the problem and why a shitload of men can be treated any which way by using the children as a battle cry. Sure children you want might be fine but with a woman you have no future with? Why the fuck do that? I would consider that crazy. I would consider that asking for your slave collar.
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Wow really amazing. So the guy who started spearhead would rather pay child support than abort a fetus that is at 4 weeks old.
http://www.pregnancy.org/fetaldevelopment/weeks-1-4
That is what it looks like at 4 weeks. No arms no legs.
Looks like an alien creature and you would give up 18 to 21 years for that?
So all the talk about mens rights is just bluster.
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Yes, I would. But I’m not asking anyone else to do so. It’s up to you.
Personally, I don’t think I’m worth a bit more than that little alien creature. Maybe it’s because I have kids. I don’t know, but that’s how I feel about it.
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””””””’I feared I got a woman pregnant a while back, but thankfully, your ideas were not on the table. Neither was marriage. I played the game, I fucked up, and I knew the rules. I shouldn’t have played. ”””””’
But what if you change the game to if you accidentally get pregnant you will have an abortion and she agrees. Kind of changes the game right. Kind of like you are proactive in covering your ass. Sounds like maybe a couple of adults who can make some descisions in life doesn’t it. Like maybe everything doesn’t have to be about I shouldn’t have played but be about I should have played by better rules. Instead of letting others make them up for me.
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Like I said, Gun,
You snaked your ass through bullets.
Can’t a woman have a baby in a safe hospital to ensure that what you fought for still exists when you are an old man?
Let’s draft ‘em!
(I have millions of sperms, if you are looking for a donor out of country – you know, to give the 11th province a bit of culture!)
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Come on, views on abortion/birth-control are independent of one’s views on feminism/men’s right. I agree that it’s OK to abort a four week old fetus, but I can understand if someone thinks differently.
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And this is the shit that men need to know. You can discuss stuff like this with a woman prior to having sex. Talk about this shit. Do not be afraid of a woman to where it is to your detriment. Man the fuck up and get what you want out of life. If a woman doesn’t agree to certain conditions then don’t fuck her.
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I don’t care about whether the mother has a future with me or not: they’re my kids.
I’d be perfectly straight with the judge: give me my children or put me in jail. Let the judge choose whether or not she will burn in hell.
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Actually, I think it is only feminism that made it an issue of feminism/men’s rights.
This is a serious issue.
Like is said before.
The USA has aborted FORTY MILLION BABIES! And is now looking to destroy their culture, for a lack of citizens, by taking in foreign immigrants who do not share their values at all, but rather, are creating counter cultures designed to destroy America, like the Raza.
Many of those aborted babies would be my age – mid to late 30′s – and would have had children of their own by now.
There would be zero need to dilute our cultures.
Fuck feminism. And fuck their rights. They are killing us all.
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I wonder what Gun’s Sargeant thought of his “rights” while he was dodging bullets?
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”””’Can’t a woman have a baby in a safe hospital to ensure that what you fought for still exists when you are an old man?””””””””’
Really I was trying to die so that I would never have to see what the us will become after watching my dad get a divorce. It is just that the iraqis are really that bad of shots.
The other reason was of course some patriatism and I have wanted to be a part of all wars the us has had.
The other was to earn my freedom from tyranny which the us has become.
There is nothing in the us that would want to exist when I am an old man.
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And as far as safe hospitals. My wife has a scar that is barely visable from her major surgery in her country. I have more noticeable scars from my gall bladder surgery. I also know a guy who had surgery for kidneys that also has a major scar and that was done recently. I trust there hospitals more. They do it out of love of the job and prestige among the community not for money as much.
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Btw,
They are NOT rope-a-doping us into this one.
We know the RULES, don’t we?
And it is not like the old days.
When I started humping my highschool girlfriend, condoms were hard to come by. Thankfully, I knew the Pharmacist in town (my sister used to work for him), and I would shyly come up to the back counter and he would shuffle me some, and I would shyly shuffle my money back… I mean, he was a good guy – he knew why I was there, and he co-operated with me.
But, nowadays, you can get the damn things at 7-11.
You know the rules.
They are not fair.
But you know the rules.
Don’t complain to me that you lost money in Vegas either – you know the house always wins.
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Amazingly two adults can make their own rules seperate from government intervention.
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Exactly we know the rules and we know outcomes to events. Therefore we can protect ourselves to the best of our ability and do not have to marry a chick just because she got pregnant. We also don’t have to pretend to want a kid with her or that life will suddenly become a cinderella story for this woman. Lot of good things can come with some knowledge.
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From the beginning you can tell a chick you have no interest in having kids with her. If that changes you can communicate that to her and give the green light. Men actually can steer outcomes to their desired result.
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For instance told the first wife I did not want to have kids yet. I also didn’t want to have kids until we both agreed on it. She religiously took the pill and there where no accidents like almost everyone else I knew.
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Everyone else I knew had one of those accidents where the wife was pregnant. You know after forgetting to take the pill for 6 months or so lol
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Don’t be silly, wrap your willy.
In December, wrap your member.
These are simple rules. As a man, they are more important to you than to her.
The rules are CLEAR!
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Have you guys ever read those ‘fat activism’ blogs? It’s some offshoot of feminism, and it’s hilarious. Really, really funny, if you have the time.
no but standing at a bookstore counter mebbe 15 years ago, a female author was hawking a book to a roomful of middle aged hefties, something like Fat Isnt Your Fault or wuzzit Eat Your Guilt Away?
couldnt help laughing lustily at this woman’s spiel as i listened to her Stroke The Victim Cashcow
they didnt appreciate it tho and neither did the clerk at the counter, also female, but they got my best smile before departure
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I’m 55 and have gained weight at different periods, however always took it off. I watch what I eat and hit the gym. However, I don’t care how much anyone works out after a certain age, eating a high carb diet tends to make people gain weight. I have observed the weight loss strategy of some people. You cannot eat a fast food diet and possibly believe that simply ordering a sugar-free drink is going to be effective.
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Gun
In the future try not to post drunk, and when you make reference to your wife and then the women you got pregnant who you want to abort it just makes you look bad.
Did you tell the pregnant women that you were married at least?
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@Gunslingergregi
It’s wrong that men have no reproductive rights. It’s wrong that a woman can abort a man’s baby if he wants it. It’s wrong that a woman can give a baby up for adoption if the father wants to raise it. These are moral crimes of the highest order.
Your situation is different. If your girlfriend wants the baby, (providing) you are the father, you should pay. It’s immoral to try to coerce her into having an abortion if she does not want it. Her body, her choice. It’s that simple.
If she has the baby, get a DNA test.
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This may be true, but -
‘My body, my choice’ applies to the labours of men as well.
Men should have the right to remove themselves from the child’s life – we could have a deadline on that too, like with abortions. Giving plenty of time for men who did not want a baby to withdraw from the situation.
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@Snark
Yes, I agree. But at the risk of sounding like a feminist, which I am not, the best time for a man to remove himself from the child’s life is before the child is conceived.
I believe that men’s rights are trampled egregiously in many situations with regard to paternity, but this is not one of them. Once conceived, the child has rights, including the right to financial support from his biological father.
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My body, my choice. Bullshit. Why can’t I do whatever drugs I like. Why can’t I walk around naked. Why can’t I commit suicide. Why can’t I touch myself in public. Why can’t my eyes stare at a womens cleavage.
I get the sentiment, but until it’s applied equally, fuck that.
It its my ears and mind, why does my wife always insist that I listen to her?
You can’t get a tatoo until your 18, or drink a beer until your 21, but a 14 year old girl has the unconditional right to end a proto-life.
If its my body, my mind, my choice, why did I have to go to school?
Again, on this issue, women ended up on the side of the debate where logic works in their favor. They got lucky. But the hypocritical bullshit of women’s needs first needs to come to an end, so even when I might agree with it on the surface, for deeper reasons, I say fuck that. All the rules need to be renegotiated or I’m not playing by them. Alls fair in love and war? We’ll, that means alls fair in the wars of love. If a women can abort a baby, then I don’t need to financially provide for one either. Its my body, my labor, my money.
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“Once conceived, the child has rights, including the right to financial support from his biological father.”
That is a very specific right. Seems forced. I would say, whoever owns the baby has the obligation to support it. If a man doesn’t have custody, that obligation is nullified.
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@Jabherwochie
False analogies. You know that.
You go right on believing in unicorns. Better yet, how ’bout I catch one for you?
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“Charles Martel January 7, 2010 at 08:39
@Jabherwochie
Why can’t I do whatever drugs I like. Why can’t I walk around naked. Why can’t I commit suicide. Why can’t I touch myself in public. Why can’t my eyes stare at a womens cleavage.
False analogies. You know that.”
You’re going to specifically have to deconstruct them for me to see them as being false. I’m honestly not following completely. They aren’t perfect analogies, but most analogies aren’t.
“If a women can abort a baby, then I don’t need to financially provide for one either. Its my body, my labor, my money.
You go right on believing in unicorns. Better yet, how ’bout I catch one for you?”
I’m using feminist logic against them. I don’t claim that it makes complete sense. Just using their stretching of definitions towards our own ends. Obviously I believe a man should support his baby, but that emplies it is his also, so why can a female kill it in the womb?
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Is the psychological well-being of the incubator more important than the life of a fetus?
If her health is at risk, which is rare, then sure, coat hanger it.
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Ideally, but we all know that some women lie about birth control, dig in the trash for condoms to impregnate themselves, etc.
A man should not be forced to pay child support for 18 years because of such deceptions. Feminists won’t hear these arguments, of course – any instance in which a man loses is fair game to them.
These are the instances in which I argue that a man should have the right to ‘abort’ – to abort himself from the situation.
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I’m fairly ambilvalent about the whole abortion thing. Whichever side feminist are on, I’ll be on the other.
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“What were the rates of increase in weight for the respective husbands vs. bachelors in the study?’
That’s comparing apples to oranges. As had been said before, a man’s looks is not as high on a woman’s priority list in attractiveness after marriage.
The better comparison regarding attractiveness in the context of marriage or a LTR would be if a woman started getting fat and a man started making less money.
“Gee cupcake, you’ve gained 30% in bodyweight in the last two years, you’d better lose that blubber or I’ll take a job that pays 30% less.”
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@Jabher
You write so beautifully, I was hoping to see another fantastic, multicolored essay, full of wonderful images and metaphors. So, of the crime of trollery, I am guilty as charged. My apologies.
How is it possible for anyone here to know that women can’t be trusted? I wish it weren’t so, but a man can not expect to be able to put his whole life and future into the hands of a woman and walk away unscathed.
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I was exagerating to drive home a point, so whatever, fairplay.
“Blue and yellow makes grass grow green.”
Does that work for you. I think expectations of me are too high. I’ll just lower them a bit.
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To Charles:
It’s not that women can’t be trusted…they, like everyone else, will pretty dependably act in their own self-interest. In particular, they will do what they think will make them feel good.
The key to successfully interacting with people in general, and women in particular, is realizing this and using it to meet your own needs. The most effective methods–and also the ones most likely to be decried as manipulative–are to use your actions to alter her perception of the incentives around her to make doing what you want seem like the alternative that will feel best.
The next most effective methods–and somewhat less likely to be decried as manipulative–are to simply focus her on advancing the parts of her interest that are also in your interest.
The only methods acceptable to the feminist position, however, are for the man to subordinate his interests to the woman’s whims. This is a recipe for disaster that is increasingly codified into law.
I personally trust everyone to act largely in line with their self-interest, and I plan accordingly. I recommend that you do the same.
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Unfortunately, women (for now) own the abortion issue. The only practical counter-measure as far as I can tell is male birth control. Once this is developed and made available, men take back control of their reproductive rights — and effectively take away women’s, which is what we should be working on.
The goal should always be to minimize or hem in women’s choices/freedom of opportunities. The law won’t help us here. But science and technology can.
And I agree that in the meantime, you should use a condom.
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”””””’Jabherwochie
Obviously I believe a man should support his baby, ””””””
Why should that be obvious and why does that support always mean money. What if he doesn’t want to support the baby? What if he said before it was consumated he didn’t want it? Is it obvious because a feminist or tv told you so?
””””””Jabherwochie
That is a very specific right. Seems forced. I would say, whoever owns the baby has the obligation to support it. If a man doesn’t have custody, that obligation is nullified.”””’
This makes sense.
””””””””””””’Snark January 7, 2010 at 08:53
the best time for a man to remove himself from the child’s life is before the child is conceived.
Ideally, but we all know that some women lie about birth control, dig in the trash for condoms to impregnate themselves, etc.
A man should not be forced to pay child support for 18 years because of such deceptions. Feminists won’t hear these arguments, of course – any instance in which a man loses is fair game to them.
”””””””””””””””
It is apparently not just feminists that will not hear these or any other arguments when it comes to a fetus but men on this very site.
””””’Jabherwochie
Why can’t I commit suicide.”””””
You can commit suicide. Why the boogieman of religion was created to keep slaves at their posts. You will go to hell if you do it to be tormented worse than you ever could on earth. Which I can’t disprove hence I am still on planet earth.
”””””””’If a women can abort a baby, then I don’t need to financially provide for one either. Its my body, my labor, my money.
You go right on believing in unicorns. Better yet, how ’bout I catch one for you?
””””””””””””””’
No unicorn. Any human being can enforce this decree that they have made. They may die in the process but so what.
”””””””””””Yes, I agree. But at the risk of sounding like a feminist, which I am not, the best time for a man to remove himself from the child’s life is before the child is conceived.
I believe that men’s rights are trampled egregiously in many situations with regard to paternity, but this is not one of them. Once conceived, the child has rights, including the right to financial support from his biological father.
”””””””””””””””””
So you think it is fine to enslave men as long as a baby is involved just amazing shit coming out right now. The thing is there are options. There is abortion so that it doesn’t have to come to that. You don’t have to be rearing to go to jump into that slavery yolk.
””””””’Snark
Men should have the right to remove themselves from the child’s life – we could have a deadline on that too, like with abortions. Giving plenty of time for men who did not want a baby to withdraw from the situation.”””””””’
Exactly before she concieved she knew my views on her having my baby. She agreed to have an abortion if she got pregnant before she concieved. She would just be living up to her word when she gets rid of it.
”””””Karl
Did you tell the pregnant women that you were married at least?””””””””’
I sure did. She knew I was married before we had sex. I was also the one who made sure she told her husband about me because she wasn’t planning on it lol
Why I got into the situation in the first place. It was convenient for the both of us. We were both away from our signifigant other for a time. I have taught her how to save money and she will be buying her first house. I have had a good impact on her life. So no regrets for me.
””””””””Charles Martel
Your situation is different. If your girlfriend wants the baby, (providing) you are the father, you should pay. It’s immoral to try to coerce her into having an abortion if she does not want it. Her body, her choice. It’s that simple.””””””””””””
lol you have completely drunk the coolaid of womans superiority eh. She agreed before she got pregnant that she would have an abortion. So yea my situation is different. I am not afraid to talk about anything with a woman. I treat them like adults and expect them to keep their word. She just started playing a cinderella movie in her head that somehow I would stay with her if she had the baby. Like apparently you guys would. Except I have choices too in life. I was just reenforcing what I said at the very beginning. That there was no future to our relationship and there still wouldn’t be just because she had a baby. I would not magically love her because of it. I have never told her I love her either because I don’t.
————-
Gunslingergregi January 7, 2010 at 01:26
Amazingly two adults can make their own rules seperate from government intervention.
————
I am looking around and realizing that men are the ones enslaving other men with old notions of chivalry that should be dead. Apparently even if mens rights guys took over. Other men would still be paying child support and alimony probably even worse than now. Because you guys can’t get it out of your head that it is just a poor woman who is always taken advantage of by a man. The man needs to pay when a kid is involved no matter what. You have internalized the bullshit. Just because you are forced to pay or want to pay doesn’t mean that someone else will. That is why you should be allowed to be free. If you want to give money to a woman who had your baby give it. But no that is not enough. You would also agree to legislate to make sure that bad bad man pays money and takes care of his responsibilities even though from the beginning and before the kid was made he made it clear that he didn’t want it.
So yea you can see it is not only feminists that men are being enslaved by but a shitload of people men and woman who will always just want to force someone else to do something against there will. Against there freedom. Enjoying seeing one more man become a slave and reducing the competition or seeing someone else in the same hell of paying moeny they are.
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”””””’Jabherwochie
Obviously I believe a man should support his baby, ””””””
Why should that be obvious and why does that support always mean money. What if he doesn’t want to support the baby? What if he said before it was consumated he didn’t want it? Is it obvious because a feminist or tv told you so?”
Evolution; genetic lineage self preservation. Obviously, other factors need to be weighted against that directive, like other children, personal needs, wether you have some type of custody, etc. If she won’t let you see the kid, then by all means, your money won’t make up the the lack of a father, so why waste it.
And why money? I see your point. I could raise a son poor and make him a genius through the use of the internet and library. Money does help however, although not the end all be all. Child support is way over priced. I think these situations should default to 50/50 custody with no child support. That is fair.
“What if he doesn’t want to support the baby?” Then don’t. Don’t expect anything from the baby either. I’m on your side, especially since you told her the deal. You had a verbal contract. She broke it. You shouldn’t have to suffer. She should abort.
“What if he said before it was consumated he didn’t want it? ”
Then she should abort in my opinion, but if the kid is going to live, even against your will, might as well make sure it does all right. It is half you. Empathetic bond I guess. I get you and see the larger point. This is a tricky area. Personal preference will play a part in these decisions. You’ve been screwed, and you are justified in seeking revenge in my eyes, but the kid won’t be to blame, and niether will you if the child suffers due to this chick’s lying and bad choices, but are even if you aren’t to blame, will you be allright if the kid suffers? And will he really suffer that much? Probably not from a lack of child support, but more from a lack of a father? I would be more proud if you spent time communicating with him as he grows up, teaching him life lessons and such through email or letters or whatever, rather than throwing money at his mom who won’t even spend it on him.
Whatever the answer, women shouldn’t be able to demand anything from men if men can’t demand anything from women.
””””’Jabherwochie
Why can’t I commit suicide.”””””
You can commit suicide. Why the boogieman of religion was created to keep slaves at their posts. You will go to hell if you do it to be tormented worse than you ever could on earth. Which I can’t disprove hence I am still on planet earth. ”
Its still illegal. A stupid law, like many laws, but it was to show the stupidity of the belief that we own our body. The government makes claims on it, despite our belief in its sanctity.
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To summarize, if I knocked up a chick after I made it clear I didn’t want any baby under any circumstances, then she should abort, and if she won’t, she should give me the baby. Why give it to me?
Because fuck her! I could raise a baby like nothin! The first three or four years would be rough, but I have a support network, including the government. I could do it. Women do it. You telling me a man can’t do it also. I love to play like a kid anyways. Kids don’t need stuff, they just need stimulation and knowledge. Women make raising children like it’s so hard. They have no inner child. The noise and rambunctousness bothers them. I’d join in. I love to teach. I could instill knowledge in him all day. Many women fuck children up. They don’t even try to teach them things half the time, or think they aren’t ready for it. They understand language before they can speak. Trust me, a little kids mind is a sponge. I’d fill that shit up every day. My kid would be helping me by the time he was 7! “Daddy! I de-virused the computer for you, and updated WOW for us!” Shiiit. Raising kids is easy. Women do it all the time. Even the stupider ones.
If she won’t abort or give you the kid, then yeah, gloves off. Do what you need to do. You both had a deal. She broke it. No rules now.
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I always wear a condom though. You should have also, mainly for disease, but for babies also. I know they suck, but you’ve got to play with the cards your dealt. Can’t eat all you want without getting fat. Can’t have sex without a condom without risking a baby. Thems the breaks. Did she say she was on birth control? I’m not sure if I read that, I read fast.
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””””’Can’t have sex without a condom without risking a baby.”””
Sure maybe so but the good thing I guess is that there are options in place to remedy the mistake before it comes to a situation where it is untenable for either of us.
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””””””If she won’t abort or give you the kid, then yeah, gloves off. Do what you need to do. You both had a deal. She broke it. No rules now.”””””””’
She didn’t break it yet. She is gonna get the abortion.
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Question of the Day:
What would the marriage rate be today if pumpkin couldn’t force marriage by pregnancy?
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Just showing an example of how situations where you are about to get fucked can be avoided and how you can react in the situation to insure compliance with already established guidlines.
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””””””InternetWood January 7, 2010 at 13:14
Question of the Day:
What would the marriage rate be today if pumpkin couldn’t force marriage by pregnancy?
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Yea if male pill comes out it sure will change some landscape.
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The good thing is men have free will. You do not have to do a fucking thing you don’t want to. You can always just go talk to god about it.
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Well ok you might not want to do that but it negates all worldly crap he he he
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Women gain weight after marriage? They need a study to figure this out? Ask any 100 husbands. Sheese…
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