A reader named Gusto emailed me the following query:
If I’m unfortunate enough to father a girl, what should I do to make sure she grows up with the right attitude?
A great question, and thanks for asking it. There are quite a few embedded issues lurking below the surface, so I will ask your indulgence in unpacking them.
The first embedded question in your interrogatory is this: “should we men have children in the first place?” My answer to that is the lawyer-like “it depends”. Broadly speaking, there are three camps in the dude-iverse when it comes to men and marriage and family. The first camp is made up of men who take seriously the warnings, sounded eloquently and effectively by elder brothers such as Baskerville, that counsel against men marrying and and having children. These men comprise the bulk of the marriage strike crowd.
The second camp is comprised of men either (a) aware of the warnings and took the risk anyway, or (b) was unaware of the warnings and assumed the risk by default. The end outcome of the behaviors of men in Camps 2a and 2b is the same, regardless of intent: get married, have kids, roll the dice. Maybe those fellows will get lucky, maybe not. I myself am a member of Camp 2a, although I was squarely in Camp 2b territory in my first marriage.
The third camp, much much smaller than either of the two previous, is comprised of those fellows that have the resources to pursue woman-not-included reproduction and raise these children outside of a pair-bond construct. These men do not maintain a romantic/sexual relationship with a woman but pursue a family anyway, either by adoption or by surrogacy, the latter of which is becoming more and more cost-effective in these days of globalization. The critical step to consider when implementing the surrogacy option is that a man should never allow a woman to act as the primary caregiver for his children unless she is paid for the effort or is a female relative. If he does, he risks placing himself on the same footing as those fellows who married to have children. Just as men who act the father figure to unrelated children run the substantial risk of becoming the target of a chilimony suit, I wouldn’t put it past a family court judge to reward a former girlfriend’s squatter’s rights with a two-decade long entitlement to my income stream. In short, a man who mixes the business of looking after his children with pleasure may find himself hit up for chilimony on her way out the door–with his children in tow. When “primary caregiver” is the standard, blood relationship matters little, and the State (post Welfare Reform) is merely looking for the closest, deepest pockets to pick, appropriate precautions must be taken, and this caregiver relationship, if used, must be kept strictly economic.
At any rate, however one accomplishes it, having a child is, in its essence, a vote of hope for the future, a public statement that one thinks that there is at least a future worth bringing the next generation into. One may also view child-bearing and -rearing as a form of demographic warfare, in that we know that the political inclinations of a child is best predicted by the political slant of his parents. Moreover, added to this are the facts that the fembots and their ilk fail to achieve replacement fertility, and that they must import acolytes from abroad and convert them in the education camps they run with taxpayer dollars. This low birthrate presents a critical vulnerability that we MRAs/FRAs/MGTOWers can exploit as part of a multi-pronged strategy to replace the present hegemony. We should aim to out-breed our adversaries, from the bottom up, over decades, in hundreds of thousands, even millions of small battles known as male-headed families. In such a way we may reclaim territory lost when the battle of the sexes brought “personal is political” divorces to our marriages and our families. To hazard a Rumsfeldian expression, this is the “long war” that won’t be over in a mater of days or months but in decades and/or generations.
The second embedded question, hinted at by the suggestion that having a girl-child would be a disappointment, is really two: should we men select the sex of our children, and should we men become like the women who express “gender disappointment” (GD) in conceiving boys? (Click here for a transcript of a stunning–in the sense that rarely is such feminine obtuseness so conspicuously on display–Elle article on the subject.) These are questions that a man can only answer for himself, given the thorny ethical and moral issues involved, although I do hold up the latent anti-male genocidal tendencies of these GD women for a bit of point-and-laugh scorn and ridicule and disgust. Thus, I suggest that, as critical as it is to raise good strong young men who are fully aware of the FemMatrix that surrounds them, if the twin misandrist threats of FemMarxism and Victorian traditionalism are to be defeated, it will require not only properly trained young men but properly trained young women to partner with them. Which leads me to the third question, the one you originally intended.
So what should we emphasize when raising those young girls, who are literally half of the future of the revolution that we men look to foment, and are essential to keeping the wheels of revolution turning? For starters, we should be raising girls the same way that we raise boys–to have integrity, to build up treasures in Heaven and not in this world, to be industrious and not lazy, to exercise self-control, to be responsible for their own actions, to prize the monogamous commitment of marriage, to hate divorce and, above all, to believe in a higher power that will hold them accountable for what they do in this life. From there, the instructions for daughters diverge slightly, tailored to the differential nature of the feminine. They are, in no particular order: to be modest in their dress, to be a help-meet worthy of the sacrifice and leadership of the man she’ll meet and marry, to be chaste, to keep her own significant sexual appetites in check, and to not be a stumbling block for the men around her.
As an aside, while we are talking about the raising of good, quality boys and girls, it should go without saying–but it doesn’t, so I will say it–that a man, if he wants the best for his children, should resist mightily the temptation to offer his children as a sacrifice to the modern-day Molech, the public school system. These government-run camps have been completely overrun by the feminists, and are where boys learn to despise the masculine…and where girls learn that feminine self-indulgence and responsibility-shifting are the ultimate values. If the hand that rocks the cradle rules the world, and if the fembots and their acolytes are the hands that rock that cradle, then men who wish to spare their children from this fate would do well to refuse to voluntarily submit their children to such brainwashing.
But it isn’t quite sufficient to train up your children in the way they should go and to avoid making your children victims of weapons of mass instruction. Just as, if not more, important are the characteristics you model for them as a husband, a father, and a citizen of the broader society. Are you the kind of father and role model that you want your son(s) to aspire to be? Do you model the sorts of masculine behaviors that you want your daughter(s) to seek out and to marry? For we are all tested each and every day; how we act, the choices that we make as men and as fathers, propagate themselves into our offspring.
As men, I think it important to not only effect first-order change, that is, a shift in attitudes of the men and women in our immediate vicinity, but we should also foment second- and third-order change as well. We can do this primarily through the institution that the present hegemony has fought so hard to destroy: the family. Through the family we provide moral and religious instruction as well as material provision, and it is through the family that we men give the gift that continues to propagate well after we’ve departed the scene. By our actions, by living lives morally and uprightly, we model behavior that will make the lives of our children happier and healthier and wealthier. Our children will absorb this instruction, and as the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree, will transmit it to their children, thus initiating the second-, third-, and subsequent-order chains. Through such a focus, multiplied by millions of men in across the country, we men can found the natural aristocracy of virtue and talent, dreamt of by Jefferson so long ago, and through this aristocracy we can re-install the family as the cornerstone of society, thereby prospering our societies, making them stronger, and–by virtue of displacing government–more free.
The Chinese character for crisis (危机) is formed from the stems of two others: “danger” (危险) and “opportunity” (机会). We know the dangers inherent in marrying, we know the dangers in begetting children in the current legal climate. I would not blame a single one of my brothers for deciding that the risk is unwarranted. But in the dangerous act of marrying and having children,of training them, and leading them as we are charged to do–not just boys but girls too–we posture our families to take advantage of the opportunity presented to us to restructure society in such a way as to prosper us all.
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The above article gives me yet another opportunity to present my usual misogynistic rant. Always when discussing marriage the focus is on the terrible legal prison that this puts a man in. My point that even without such a prison marriage is in itself not a state a man should ever surrender to. Marriage for a man can only be endured if he assassinates his manhood and commits himself to the endless hell which living with a woman entails.
Marriage is the end of a man’s sex life not the beginning of it. It will offer him nothing but responsibility and exploitation. Getting married put a man’s brain in a vice. Over the years the vice is ever tightened. All thought is crushed and what is left is intense pain. This is your lot even if you marry the best woman in the world.
Marriage is only for those who are not men at all. If the manhood within is stillborn then yes may be you can live as a dumb animal with a yoke around your neck never really to raise your head again. Better to die young than to be wed.
TOO FRIGGIN’ HARD. Any man contemplating this needs to understand what a bottomless time sink children are. Their demands for attention are literally unlimited. Try to raise that kid by yourself and you’re going to spend your whole life on the ragged edge of exhaustion. You don’t need that!
If you think you’re going to do it by yourself, get ready to spend boucoup bucks on nannies and daycare.
I agree, but here is my question – are private schools any better? Private school teachers are the products of the exact same Marxist-Leninist-Feminist “School of Education” programs as the public school teachers, are they not? My recollection of my private school teachers back in my grade school days is that they were pretty liberal, even though I did not fully recognize this at the time. I have no doubt the situation is even worse now. Where does that leave one – home schooling?
“Where does that leave one – home schooling?”
Yes, or even better, that radical form called “unschooling”. School-at-home is just as effective at crushing the natural love of learning.
Move to a state with lax homeschooling laws. Give your children safe boundaries, but leave them to their own devices. They will teach themselves to read when they have a need to read. They will learn arithmetic and algebra if they need them to solve real world problems, viz. scaling recipes, carpentry, spending money. When they are interested in a topic, they will pursue it at their own pace, at whatever length they need to gain satisfaction. Be ready to answer questions, to help them find resources, but don’t presume you can teach them anything.
No one is ever taught anything.
I should weigh in on this, at least I have experience. I was a single dad in the 80’s and 90’s with a daughter and a son, who is autistic and still lives with me. Which do you think would be more difficult (hint, the autistic one anything but easy as anyone with experience knows)? When my daughter reached about 12 (and this varies, but it WILL happen) I had tremendous problems with her. She is now self-supporting with a son (she works as a model part-time as well). No man in his right mind will tolerate her for long. I have nothing to do with her, very mutually. After my dad died, my mom broke her hip and went to the hospital. My daughter took the opportunity to steal every piece of expensive jewelry in her home, and she has stolen a lot from mine as well. She is completely amoral. My grandson inherited a great deal of intelligence and is extremely intuitive, more than a match for her. By the age of five, he had already seen right through her and I assume will move on as soon as he’s old enough. Fortunately, he has had the guidance of his step-grandfather, something I would have loved to provide if possible. My situation may have been different because my son required so much care, but when my daughter was young I was everything to her. Since I will not be used by her, and rightfully do not trust her, she avoids me completely. My mother also had alzheimers, and never returned to her home, a minor blessing since she never learned of what my daughter did, and she passed away a year after my dad. I have no religious beliefs, though am not an atheist, and I do believe we are all accountable for our actions (balance) while here. During my years as a single dad, I dated a minister’s daughter who was 18, and another very religious woman. The minister’s daughter was one of the kinkiest women I’ve ever been with, and the religious woman wanted steady sex and for me to attend church with her. I never went and explained why. I dumped her when she stated that my son’s autism occurred as a result from me not attending church. Religion does not work to instill ethical behavior–the only reason it seemed effective in pre 60’s was because of social mores and lack of welfare programs. My 2 cents for what it’s worth….
“Religion does not work to instill ethical behavior–the only reason it seemed effective in pre 60’s was because of social mores and lack of welfare programs.”
Note that this is a statement about religion’s effect on females. As such, it is largely true. Not so for men, who tend to let their beliefs drive their behavior.
@ Tarl,
“…are private schools any better? “
Nope. As you’ve pointed out, the teachers train the same way, use the same curriculum, the same pedagogy. Not much of a substantial difference in performance between grads of public and private schools.
And yes, that does leave homeschooling/unschooling as pretty much the only alternative. That’s the only way to keep your child from being force-fed the man’s lessons.
If we want radical change, it has to start at home.
Tarl
“TOO FRIGGIN’ HARD. Any man contemplating this needs to understand what a bottomless time sink children are. Their demands for attention are literally unlimited. Try to raise that kid by yourself and you’re going to spend your whole life on the ragged edge of exhaustion. You don’t need that!
If you think you’re going to do it by yourself, get ready to spend boucoup bucks on nannies and daycare.”
Think so? You’re absolutely correct. And I am writing this from a point of experience. I’m 55, and I’m leaving to either Mexico or the Philippines. I earned it. Anyone who reaches my age knows how fast time passes, and I may have only 20 left–I’m going to attempt to enjoy every damn minute of it. I believe as more men leave, feminism with all it’s public sector jobs and civilization-destroying actions will implode, and Schriver can have her ‘Woman’s Nation’. I am old enough to remember a different kind of country. I am also inclined to agree with John Nada that they will attempt to erect a ‘testosterone wall’ to keep things running and to prevent the brain drain. After I leave, I will do my best to assist any man who wants out.
“Note that this is a statement about religion’s effect on females. As such, it is largely true. Not so for men, who tend to let their beliefs drive their behavior.”
Correct….thanks for adding this clarification.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Demaine
The above link and below quote is an example of homeschooling at its best.
“Martin Demaine is the father of MIT Computer Science professor and MacArthur Fellow Erik Demaine; in 1987 (when Erik was six) they together founded the Erik and Dad Puzzle Company which distributed puzzles throughout Canada.[10] Erik was home-schooled by Martin, and although Martin never received any higher degree than his high school diploma, his home-schooling catapulted Erik to a B.S. at age 14 and a Ph.D. and MIT professorship at age 20,[3][11] making him the youngest professor ever hired by MIT.[12] The two Demaines continue to work closely together and have many joint works of both mathematics and art,[13] including three pieces of mathematical origami in the permanent collection of the Museum of Modern Art, New York;[14] their joint mathematical works focus primarily on the mathematics of folding and unfolding objects out of flat materials such as paper and on the computational complexity of games and puzzles.[9][12] Martin and Erik are also featured in the movie Between the Folds, a documentary on modern origami.”
He credit his homeschooling for fostering his genius, and says that the education system in not set up to allow minds to excel.
That led me to this great link, a must read about homeschooling’s possibilities;
http://homeschooling.suite101.com/article.cfm/homeschooled_alumni_impressive_and_growing
The writer leads off with, “If I’m unfortunate enough to father a girl…” This is not a great way to launch into a blog posting, IMO.
John
“The writer leads off with, “If I’m unfortunate enough to father a girl…” This is not a great way to launch into a blog posting, IMO.”
I must agree, because of the feminist tendency to say this about their sons. Perhaps simply impulsively chosen. I want to state that I will always love my daughter….I simply will not tolerate her behavior, period. When she was young, I was her hero. I made up stories to help her get through rough times with situational analogies. I also sang songs to her. How or why she became so amoral is a mystery to me.
My sister took my niece out of public school, and went to southamerica for a little over a year. During that time she was receiving homeschooling, and managed to advance 3 years ahead of her schoolmates back home, while teaching herself to read and write spanish. When they returned, she were send back to public school, where they had to put her in a class two years ahead of her age. Despite this, she gradually lost all interest in learning, since it was just too easy for her, so she finished in the class she would have been in, had it not been for that trip. Today she´s a moronic 21-year old sex&the city-clone like most other girls her age. There´s public school for ya…
Kimski
I attended public school starting in the latter 50’s and two of my teachers had been my mom’s teachers. They actually valued my curiosity and assisted me in learning. Years later, I dropped HS because I hated it. I skipped most days and spent them at the library reading everything and anything, and made a deal to go ‘test’ which I always aced. I got a GED easily and attended university. Teachers in PS literally hate intelligent boys–I have no idea why, but I suspect it was their own educations that reinforced this behavior. This statement on this computer courtesy of Tesla, who was not squashed by such an idiotic system.
Your advice was off-point to the particular questioner. For anyone who would view the birth of his own daughter as unfortunate, the only true answer is, you should not have kids. Frankly, anyone who is incapable of even the thought of loving a daughter to the same degree as a son, should definitely enter therapy and attempt to come to the roots of their psychological pathologies.
Reminds me of the stat that families with girls are more likely to get divorced than families with even one boy.
“Frankly, anyone who is incapable of even the thought of loving a daughter to the same degree as a son, should definitely enter therapy and attempt to come to the roots of their psychological pathologies.”
Your pedestal is showing. And I think I see a straw man hiding behind it.
LOL!!
No one is ever taught anything.
This “kids want to learn” crap is pernicious noble savage nonsense. As Stephen Pinker has pointed out, learning is hard and definitely not natural. As me and my teacher friends say, the kids just want to fuck and play videogames.
It’s nice to see someone here who knows what he is talking about, David Brandt. If you haven’t tried to raise a daughter, then you simply can’t address this issue. My daughter is 11. I homeschool my kids. But it is natural for girls to absorb values from their friends and from the media. Logic has no impact on girls at all. The best one can do is to try to expose one’s daughter to as many positive outside influences as possible, and limit exposure to mainstream media as much as possible.
Here’s an interesting article written by Ted Byfield regarding education:
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?pageId=43308
“…One of those old-style teachers, who died in the early ’50s, was Sir Richard Livingstone, a classics professor, educational philosopher and chancellor of Oxford University. He was Dewey’s contemporary but held very different ideas. Livingstone defined what he called “educable ages” of human beings. We are most educable, he said, when we’re very young, least educable in the teen years and early 20s, and become highly educable again as adults.
He therefore proposed that the high school system be abolished except for the very brightest of students, and that the money thereby saved be directed instead into community schools for adults. People would normally continue their education through their adult life.
In effect, he was abolishing the whole concept of the teenager, the adolescent. If nearly everybody at 12 or 13 joined the work force, they would in fact become part of the adult world. Later they would go back to school as adults to actually learn something and be eager to learn it.
We scoffed at the time. Do away with high school? Preposterous, we said. Today, more than ever, it sounds like a good idea.”
First, we need to separate two terms: Marriage and having a child. Both are completely separated of each other.
Marriage is something that no sane male should do, but having a child comes for the biological desire of leaving a legacy in this world, something that survives after our deaths(let’s face it, nobody is inmortal). That’s something worth pursuing, besides you guys would’t want to raise your children if you didn’t have the desire to do it.
The advice here is sound, although the issue with homeschooling is the fear of having a child completely isolated from the real world and from other children of his/her age. Maybe a homeschooling association or something can provide a way for developing the social part.
@Justin
You are the one off-point. Having a daughter in a world dedicated to make women disgusting human beings isn’t a nice situation. Basically: No male likes raising whores. And this society is hellbent in making sure that all girls become that.
Thursday: “As me and my teacher friends say, the kids just want to fuck and play videogames.”
As well ask the screws what the inmates want.
As someone who has both a son and a daughter I have to say I did not find the way the article started as strange at all. In fact it seemed totally natural to me and I did not give it a seconds thought. When small all children are inherently appealing – that is certainly true. For those who have never raised children into adulthood then they will not understand that the cute little girl bears no relationship to the person that loveable bundle will become. The monster within will show its head soon enough.
What I like about The Spearhead and those who write and post is that they depart from cliché. So we don’t get sentimental nonsense except from a few. It often does me good to read say the candid experience of David Brandt. What he says is very helpful to me in understanding my own life and reading his words makes me less alone.
Persons who have never been subjected to (modern) schooling take great enjoyment in learning, only they tend not to think of it as learning. They want to do, to make. Real learning is a means to an end. No sensible person wants learning when learning is the end. Of course, learning isn’t the true end of compulsory schooling. The intended outcome is compliant factory workers.
For an antidote to the “children don’t want to learn” pernicious compulsory schooling nonsense, read Julia Weber Gordon’s My Country School Diary.
Children need companionship of all ages. The artificial isolation to a mob of one’s exact contemporaries is one of the worst aspects of schooling. Boys and girls should be comfortable with people in general, not just people born the same year.
A female child…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9Nbge3zvmc&feature=related
I am the man who asked the question quoted in the article.
I agree with gx1080.
Also, if this is in any way relevant, I am a high-functioning autistic. I have a high A.Q. and a high I.Q., I read blogs like this to better understand people.
Fathers, it is your responsibility make sure that your daughter’s sense of social value is based on what you and her brothers think.
If you live in a slum, it doesn’t matter how much you like Honda Civics. You’d rather not receive one as a gift.
It is good to get the high I.Q response from Gusto to matters raised in the articles here. To ’seek therapy’ certainly sounds like a high I.Q. answer. I wonder how he managed to think of that. I guess that’s high I.Q. for you.
Paul hocked up something for us, but I’m having trouble understanding it. Is anyone here a licensed augur?
gx1080 said:Marriage is something that no sane male should do, but having a child comes for the biological desire of leaving a legacy in this world, something that survives after our deaths
Survive after our death?
Why does it matter what happens after you’re gone UNLESS you already have children.
But nobody needs children, do they? So why worry about what will come after you?
Nobody has the responsibility to continue the species.
Be strict but be loving. Don’t spare the rod on your daughter.
Speaking from experience, I am grateful that I was brought up under strictness rather than leniency. I thought I was so wise at the age of 10! But because of my strict upbringing and cultural beliefs, I did not get into partying, drugs, alcohol, smoking, casual sex, etc. even though I saw such behavior all around me and on television.
rebel: “Nobody has the responsibility to continue the species.”
I am under strict orders to be fruitful and multiply.
Thursday: “This “kids want to learn” crap is pernicious noble savage nonsense. ”
It can be a mix. As a child I was a voracious reader, but had to be dragged kicking and screaming through math class. With homeschooling you can tailor the curriculum to the individual student.
Nobody wants to learn is just like “jobs Americans won’t do”.
Give the kids a suitable reward, and OF COURSE they will be motivated. And it need not be money.
But THAT IS THE POINT OF SCHOOL. You learn to Work Hard FOR NOTHING.
That is the whole point. Training you that Hard Work Is It’s Own Reward. Granted, training the slaves to work for a pat on the back from Mommy isn’t all that effective, but it does seem to work somewhat.
I prefer money. And in America, it’d better be Upfront. I’ve wasted enough of my life on the lying animal ’sometime in the future’ merry-go-round.
Dig a hole, and fill it up!
Dig a hole, and fill it up!
Dig a hole, and fill it up!
Dig a hole, and fill it up!
“For anyone who would view the birth of his own daughter as unfortunate, the only true answer is, you should not have kids. “
Perhaps. But it was also possible that, in a community so male focused and concerned with how chicks are screwing guys over, any female presence in a man’s life is unnecessarily denigrated. Yes, women today are screwed up. But not any less so than men. Exactly how socially constructive is it to bang your way into oblivion?
When I wrote this post, I had no insight into what went on inside Gusto’s cranium. It appears that he indeed does think that he has no biz having chilluns; if that’s his choice, well I’m down with that too.
Yet I do not think that a throw-your-pads-and-helmet-on-the-ground-and-stomp-off-the-field strategy good for anything except saving ourselves as individuals as Rome burns. I am one of those guys that thinks engagement is preferable to sidelining oneself. I thought that a discussion about how any strategy for changing things for the better necessarily includes daughters and women would be value-added.
We happy few here at Spearhead are a tiny minority of men and an even tiny-er proportion of like-minded women. For our sturm und drang to have any effect, We need more than just converts to our cause. We need to make our own, in a come-out-from-among-them-and-be-ye-separate kind of way (at least until they reach the age of majority).
“Marriage is something that no sane male should do”
Oh I disagree, at least wrt marriage constituted outside the purview of the state. The benefits that accrue to society in general, and men in particular, from a marriage culture outweigh the downsides, IMHO.
What makes marriage such a trap these days is the inequitable duties that state-marriage imposes on men and women in a three-way, polygamous on-way contract.
“Nobody has the responsibility to continue the species.”
Which is why I am pushing a natalist solution. For the society that can’t find a reason to replace itself naturally selects against itself. Put another way, a society that loses its will to live fails to be fruitful and multiply. So while nobody has the responsibility to propagate, the society that fails to imbue its members with the ability and wherewithal to do so is erased.
I have a question about surrogacy.
We all know that sperm is a strict liability item. It doesn’t matter how a child is conceived, if the sperm is yours mom gets to hit you up for child support.
What prevents a surrogate from hitting you up for child support? She’s the birth mother, giving her a nearly unrebuttable presumption of superiority in a custody dispute, the sperm is yours, and I seriously doubt that an advance contract for adoption (which is what a surrogacy contract essentially is) is enforceable. I know a contract that prohibits child support isn’t enforceable.
Something that stood out to me.
I pretty much agree with this part:
Here is where you lost me:
Are you saying that only/mainly girls should be taught to be chaste and to keep their sexual appetites in check? That’s one of the major problems and sources of confusion when it comes to young people and sex. Girls are taught to what until marriage or the “right” one, and boys….well…..don’t seem to be taught that at all or to that extent. Personally I believe that God never intended for only or mainly females to remain virgins until marriage. I don’t think there’s even a passage in the Bible that called for only women to wait until marriage to have sex. Everything else I agree on, it was just that part. Anyway, sorry I went a little off tangent there.
About the GD thing. GD towards girls isn’t a new thing at all. In fact, it has been around for a long time and seen all over the world. I point this out, because you seem compare it to GD of boys as a tit-for-tat thing. Don’t get me wrong, I read the link and was HIGHLY disturbed.
@fschmidt November 9, 2009 at 9:03 am
Now I don’t know jack about raising girls, but this is exactly how lower class Muslim girls are raised in the UK to be proper Muslim women. They are excluded from all outside influences and kept mostly in the presences of other good Muslims. Many are not taught how to speak English. Complete cultural isolationism seems to be the only working method to prevent most girls from becoming your average western women. Western culture is extremely corrosive to female minds.
I don’t advocate this, but it does work. There may be much better ways to handle this problem. But again I know almost nothing about the subject.
Simply answer, really.
Set strict rules and make sure she follows them and is punished for not doing so.
If she says anything like
“I CAN DO ___ IF I WANT TO” (fill in the blank: have sex, do drugs, stay outside until the wee ours, sleep over at a guy’s house, etc)
“EVERYBODY ELSE IS DOING IT”
“I AM AN ADULT”
“DO NOT JUDGE ME”
you must administer a harsh and immediate ass-kicking. You have to make sure, on the spot, that she knows that none of that pansy-ass liberal “finding yourself” bullshit will fly in your house.
She will bring boyfriends over. That’s unavoidable by now. Forbidding her from doing so will drive her to date in secret, and then things slip out of your control.
Instead, keep a baseball bat in a visible spot near the door. Bonus points for a Bible/crucifix or a shotgun/assault rifle on a rack placed in a visible spot in the background.
Make sure to open the door first when the boy comes around and, through polite but vaguely threatening conversation, together with the aforementioned props, make it amply clear that the second he “fools around” with your daughter he will marry her, or he’ll be smoking your Smith & Wesson. A slightly crazy vibe is a must.
Not that that doesn’t mean she can bring home just anyone. The second a “thug-ass original G” shows up at the door, it’s time for her to join an Ethiopian monastery.
*Not that that means
“I seriously doubt that an advance contract for adoption (which is what a surrogacy contract essentially is) is enforceable. “
I’m no attorney, but from what I’ve read, the contract for surrogacy is enforceable, although high-profile cases such as “Baby M” have attempted to challenge this presumption.
Seems to me that child support and other such issues are less of a hazard if the child is not related to the surrogate at all…in other words, a fellow buys the egg as well as rents the uterus. And then takes the entire transaction overseas.
@Renee,
“Are you saying that only/mainly girls should be taught to be chaste and to keep their sexual appetites in check? “
I can see how what I wrote can be confusing. So I’m clear, I think that it is just as important from a macro level for a guy to keep it in his pants as it is for a gal to keep her legs closed. At the street level, given the current legal climate, a man’s failure to exercise what I call sperm surety is a one-way ticket to the slave gulag.
These days I sense that there is no stigma whatsoever on women being as slutty as they wanna be, which is why I bring it up. (In contrast, the enforcement mechanism / stigma for men is…surprise!…child support, something that women can easily duck through unilateral abortion). Also, another reason why I bring this up is because there is still a fair amount of females out there who don’t think they have a sexual appetite, what triggers it, or think their is less ferocious than a guy’s. Thus they have issues with controlling it because they don’t know how to deal with the strength of their sex drive or how powerful their vag tingle can be.
“Personally I believe that God never intended for only or mainly females to remain virgins until marriage.”
I don’t disagree one bit…this is precisely the kind of moral and upright behavior that I think would serve men and women, the communities they live in, and their children, very well.
Regarding GD for girls, yes there are some parts of the world where males are valued more than females. I bring up the Anglophone GD issue as a way of highlighting that their anti-male GD is no different in kind or in degree from the anti-female GD that exists in Central Asian societies.
@ Red,
One doesn’t need to keep your kids from such deleterious influences for that long, either.
From what I read, personality and values are pretty much set at about age 13, although I’ve seen research that suggests some amount of plasticity in both personality and values through age 25.
But the bulk of the values establishment happens by the time the kiddos hit their frosh year in HS.
A woman’s values, however, are indefinitely malleable. This is especially true when her received values come into conflict with her achievement of social value.
Thank you for answering my question, Wapiti.
How to raise girls well?
I will insert what I’ve observed from working in daycare and my own father:
It is important for girls to have a positive relationship with their fathers. In fact, I think the father daughter dynamic is very conducive to a woman developing self-respect and trust for men.
Therefore men, try to find bonding activities to share with your daughters. Take your daughters with you on errands, talk with them, joke with them, teach them how to ride a bike, or change a tire. You may be laughing at the last one, but whenever my dad had to change a tire or check his oil, he would make sure I was watching so I wouldn’t miss out on a learning opportunity.
Most importantly, always treat them like adults, even when they’re young. As a child my dad was never afraid to use large words around me, encourage me to read college level books, or to discuss abstract/academic concepts. Of course I was always asking a loooot of questions, but he patiently answered every one.
Another thing, patience! If you want to have children, make sure you have this quality in bucket loads, you’re going to need it.
Lastly, be hard on your girls.
That’s right. Don’t pamper them. Don’t treat them like angels from heaven like many fathers treat their daughters. Many cultures have a tradition of pampering their daughters, but in doing so men are putting their daughters up on a pedestal that results in selfishness/attention whoring/ and soft morals.
Have high expectations of your daughters. Expect them to mow the lawn, whack weeds, carry logs, get good grades, and treat you with RESPECT. Don’t insult them when they fail to meet your stellar expectations, rather keep encouraging them towards higher and higher heights.
My father treated me thusly and I never fail to amaze my managers and co-workers with my abilities as a young female to work hard while maintaining a positive attitude. I have two jobs and I’m putting myself through school – asking nothing from my parents.
Red,
While you can’t raise your daughter in an under ground safe away from the vile influences of western culture, you can immerse her in a moral culture (church group) and work hard to instill her with the moral and intellectual ability to resist modern day temptations. You must be strict/loving/patient/ and consistent all at once.
Lead by example. The type of man you are will influence the type of man she wants to be with growing up (call this the Electra complex – yeah yeah I know Freud smoked a lot of dope, but he got a few things right)
While your punishment should be consistent and effective, don’t forget to love unconditionally. My step sister was a thief and a compulsive liar; when she failed to do well in school her parents threatened to disown and not love her.
When I didn’t do well I got a lecture and a punishment, but my parents still loved me through the good and bad. If you can’t love your daughter in her worst of defeats, she’ll never rise to her greatest of triumphs.
On fatherhood? Don’t do it. It’s a waste of time now. If you have a girl? Forget her. Just leave. It’s a complete waste of time trying to set a good example to them when the women around them set such bad examples. I have two former daughters and I am disgusted in the way they choose to behave themselves. I have two former sons and despite their mothers terrible mothering they turned out fine.
Children are over-rated. You can’t sent them back once you have them..so just don’t have them. Save your money and enjoy spending it on yourself.
EW.
“Marriage is something that no sane male should do”
“Oh I disagree, at least wrt marriage constituted outside the purview of the state. The benefits that accrue to society in general, and men in particular, from a marriage culture outweigh the downsides, IMHO.”
Name one benefit of marriage to a man. I was married for 18 years and now single again for 2 years. I can’t think of one single benefit of being a husband and a father. Care to take a stab at naming one?
Bob Smith November 9, 2009 at 2:40 pm
“We all know that sperm is a strict liability item. It doesn’t matter how a child is conceived, if the sperm is yours mom gets to hit you up for child support.”
No. We don’t all KNOW this. Child support is voluntary. If you do not volunteer to pay it then you don’t pay it. I am not sure how many times I am going to have to say that before men actually go and do their research and find that it is true. You don’t have to pay income tax, alimony, child support or mortgages. These are all voluntary things.
Elusive Wapiti,
Based on you last response, it looks like we pretty see eye-to-eye
Just want to point out something though.
Personally I think the stigma is still there for females. For men, there are words like “playas”, “studs”, and “cads” which are in a sense positive connotations of promiscuous behavior. It’s almost expected of them. If they turn down sex or is a virgin, then either they’re gay, aren’t considered real men, or the butt of the joke. On tv and movies you see men surrounded by females or have one on each arm. So to me, child support isn’t really evidence of a stigma.
For women, it’s a different story. I’m glad that you stated that women do have sexual appetites. Women not having any is one of the biggest myths about them. I wouldn’t be surprised if it was used as a tool in the sexual oppression of the past. Anyway while names describing male’s promiscuous behavior has positive connotations, names for females do not. Examples: “slut”, “whore”, “ho”. Even the word “promiscuous” is mainly applied to women in a negative fashion. It’s expected for females to decide to be virgins or to wait to have sex. It’s considered normal for females to be the one to turn down sex.
OK, back to the topic lol!
wow
That link you gave about the women who are disappointed about having sons, instead of daughters, was as fascinating as it was absolutely terrifying.
The following is just a small fragment of that madness.
This is exactly why I brought up the topic of circumcision before, as it is indeed a complete violation of male’s bodies. Perhaps this section will demonstrate well the reasons why we should should take up this issue, and protect our boys.
Deborah, your Dad sounds like my Dad
I’m sitting here grinning after reading that…it’s no accident that I am a weed-whacker extraordinaire ;-P
Joking aside, it’s true that it makes a difference when a father will not put up with typical female whining and excuse-making, when it’s clear that Dad takes NO crap. It teaches taking responsibility for one’s own actions, something you don’t always learn from Mom. Too many mothers are way too lenient and soft on the kids, or just have no rules at all.
Dad had me reading poetry before I went to school, never talked down to me and expected me to be able to do what he asked, and out of respect as well as love, I didn’t like to disappoint him. If he thought I could do it, well, I did it.
It means a lot, and definitely lays down the groundwork for future relationships with men.
A note to those who’ve given in to despair:
If you are vehemently opposed to marriage and family, then you will indeed never be in a relationship with a woman worth her salt.
You get what you seek. Think on that.